Do you, a free person, see Muslim females as slaves?

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God had also been commanding David to commit genocide, allegedly. Just sayin'.

Wait, what is the connection?

quote="GnosticBishop"] If a theist believes in a creator God, then of course he should believe God is responsible.

Sure they blame men but they can only (intelligently, if they have intelligence) follow what they would see as our God given natures.

Sure, Christians and others will throw out their free will card but cannot explain how no one has the free will to not sin or do evil when we have to to evolve and survive. Our evolution forces us to both compete and cooperate and when we compete, as we must, we create what theists see as evil. Meanwhile they themselves do the same evils as everyone else.

Regards
DL

I think advocating for genocide destroys all moral authority. I hold gods to a somewhat lower standard than people, but genocide - even genocide against Philistines - crosses the line.

I wish I could remember more about the archaeological evidence from Philistia. I'm just taking a quick break, and I'm on a deadline today, so I can't look for it. I remember them having a fairly advanced culture, and I found it interesting. It's pretty sad that the name of their culture is a slur. Unsurprisingly it appears to have as little basis in reality as other slurs that support genocides.

Yes Hebrew culture is indeed fascinating. However back to the point. Job 1;21 He said, "Naked I came from my mother's womb, And naked I shall return there. The LORD gave and the LORD has taken away. Blessed be the name of the LORD." God gives and God takes. This is the theme of the book of Job, it's a good read. .

Again it's something that only exist in the islamist sharia countries, where the dower is really treated as a bride price. I am not denying that women are treated as slaves in countries such as : Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan, the conservative communities of Iran, and some parts of Pakistan and maybe in the poorest class of Sudan.

In the less conservative countries, you may still find Dower tradition; they call it a 'mahr'.

Dower means the amount paid by groom to bride, dowry is the opposite, according to dictionary.

Some pre-islamic traditions in non-really-Arab Arabized civilizations still remain: Traditionally, in Egypt for instance, at least among the non-MB and non-salafist people; the bride or her family often bring dowry to marriage often to cover the wedding costs yet the groom may contribute, while groom/his family covers the housing costs as dower yet the groom's family may contribute too, furniture and others costs are usually divided; so it's a dual system of dower/dowry and often negotiable. Doesn't it ring a bell? In lebanon for instance, the mahr is symbolic, almost all costs are divided especially among the middle class yet the groom usually contribute more; even among Christians, the men often contribute more.

So it's like a price tag being put on a bride in some market; yet some greedy brides or greedy parents may treat it as such if they feel their daughter is so desirable.


As for the child brides, the info on Mohammad's child bride comes as a shock to most moderate Muslims; a lot also deny it and convince themselves with specific interpretations that claim she was 16 or 19, not 9.

Again I tell you, most muslims don't know really their religion.

This was a social experiment in a Sunni-majority area in Beirut, the old man, the cemeraman and the child are actors- click on CC to read the english translations, watch it to the end:

Job 2;3 And the LORD said unto Satan: 'Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a whole-hearted and an upright man, one that feareth God, and shunneth evil? and he still holdeth fast his integrity, although thou didst move Me against him, to destroy him without cause.'

God admitting he was moved to do evil by Satan.

So much for God being good.

You can blame the hit man Satan alone but to ignore the one who paid for the hit would be you not wanting to face reality and you would be showing poor morals by exonerating your evil demiurge.

Regards
DL

Again, thanks for the good info.

That clip may have been staged but it shows all too well the reality of old Muslim men marrying children who likely have no choice and who are definitely too young to make an intelligent choice.

Regards
DL