God(s)...?

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This is just hate-speech, now. This makes you sound like a total schmuck.

Well I have felt awe and love without any hint of god, and as for 'everything' god has nothing of mine.

No, not hate speech. Merely a clear analysis of an all powerful being who is stupid enough to be jealous of anybody. Jealousy is, after all, a reaction to a threat and how can an all powerful being be threatened?

Criticism of religion is not hate speech. You have a choice to be a Christian. It is acceptable that those who do not share your opinion would wish to change your mind. But I personally think this is impossible in your case and many others.

A valid criticism must be intelligent. What you said was not intelligent.

Another waay to descirbe the jealousy of God is the fact that we cannot serve two masters. We cannot worship two gods at once. We can either serve God or Mannon, but not both. Mammon btw is the god of materilasm, money, sex, earthly delights. Many have tried to fool themselves into thinking they served God and not Mannon, but in fact their professed belief in God was only a window-dressing for the worship of Mannon.

A valid criticism is inherently correct. Intelligence is irrelevant. I did not make an criticism in this thread.

But I will now.

You base your morality on a 2,000 year old book, correct?

Why do you think this is the correct book?

There are others that also claim to come from god.

The Koran etc.

What makes the Bible more valid than the Koran if you are deriving your morality from books and not your own reason?

Would this book have any more revelance if it were 20 years old instead of 2,000 years old? If anything, I think the extreme age of Scripture speaks to its validity.

Religions are numerous because of the varying natures of human experience and how different people have understood God differently. Many mountain paths lead up to the same peak.

How do you not know that you are worshiping a false god?

Would it not make sense to reserve judgment? If you have mistakenly worshiped the wrong god, wouldn't that annoy the true god?

Wouldn't the true god be less annoyed with the agnostic, than the false believer?

If by "reserve judgement" you mean "sit on the fence," then no.

You haven't answer my questions. Reserving judgment is where you do not have enough information to make an informed decision so you wait for more information before you make a judgment.

How do you not know that you are worshiping a false god?

Would it not make sense to reserve judgment? If you have mistakenly worshiped the wrong god, wouldn't that annoy the true god?

Wouldn't the true god be less annoyed with the agnostic, than the false believer?

Some questions just don't have answers, at least none that I can give you. I hope you're not asking me all this just to prove you're the master debator. Is this about faith or debating? I'm not that interested in debating as I am in discussing faith.

What is faith? What compels you to have faith in something that millions of people of other religions believe is wrong due to their own faith - which is just as strong as yours?

I'm not trying to be argumentive, but faith is something I completely lack and it is a great source of interest for me.

P.S. - Corroonb may be the master debator, but you're the cunning linguist!

Aside from other considerations the concept that the age of a book is any indication of its validity ignores completely that much written material from various cultures is very old indeed and they openly contradict each other in many ways. As a measure of the quality of thinking in these matters the valuation of age as an indicator of validity is rather a negative indicator of the quality of analysis.

LOL!
Incidentally, Phagocyte, this was me about 8 months ago. I'm not sure how closely your situation parallels with mine, but I refused to believe anything religious or spiritual for fear of false comfort. I had a kneejerk reaction to doubt everything. Then one day, I realized my doubt was as much a prison as it was a worldview. I was depriving myself of any real belief system. I realized this was somewhat masochistic.

I'm not saying I have faith now, but I see the value of it. All it took was for me to give up my intellectual self-flogging and allow myself to be f*@%ing human again.

Don't laugh at me, laugh at Austin Powers.



This mode of thought began during the summer when I was fifteen and started getting really serious about science and skepticism. In my opinion you should have a kneejerk reaction to doubt everything, because if it's true, your doubts will remain fruitless. The thing is, it's not a prison for me, it's just the way I'm wired - I don't believe anything without a reason to do so, and why should I without one?