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Atheism and Satanism

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Dogbrain
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29 Aug 2008, 1:42 pm

0_equals_true wrote:
One of the assumptions of this argument is that atheists are automatically materialists and lack morals. This is plain wrong.



Really? You really believe that I think this? Could you point out specifically wherein I have written anything that would lead someone to think that I believe such a thing of atheists?

Please do so, since you are accusing me of having this "assumption".



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29 Aug 2008, 1:42 pm

0_equals_true wrote:
One of the assumptions of this argument is that atheists are automatically materialists and lack morals. This is plain wrong.

Religion or no religion morality is unique to each person.

I can't speak for all atheists, but I'm a relativist. So therefore I make choices on my moral standing all the time. I don't believe in an absolute morality. I believe in a sort of medium as cultural memes, but this is highly complex and never permanent.


Relativist! Ah, damn - why didn't I think of that name?
Describes my views almost aptly! Not perfect, but few things are.


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29 Aug 2008, 1:43 pm

0_equals_true wrote:
One of the assumptions of this argument is that atheists are automatically materialists and lack morals. This is plain wrong.

Religion or no religion morality is unique to each person.

I can't speak for all atheists, but I'm a relativist. So therefore I make choices on my moral standing all the time. I don't believe in an absolute morality. I believe in a sort of medium as cultural memes, but this is highly complex and never permanent.


Thing about Christians/Religious people, is when they act immoral they are hypocrites.
If atheists act immoral according to a standard they don't adhere to, they aren't hypocrites.

However, a lot of nonreligious people that I have seen do hold religious people to said standard to which they don't adhere. It is a form of manipulation.



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29 Aug 2008, 1:43 pm

Trigger11 wrote:
The idea of Atheism precludes the existence of ANY dieties. So...no, I am not a Satanist, even if Christians like to call me one.


People really do need to get out more. The most popular form of satanism in the USA (at least when I last checked for popularity) is explicitly atheist. For this group, "satan" is a symbol but not an actual being.



Ishmael
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29 Aug 2008, 1:48 pm

Dogbrain wrote:
Trigger11 wrote:
The idea of Atheism precludes the existence of ANY dieties. So...no, I am not a Satanist, even if Christians like to call me one.


People really do need to get out more. The most popular form of satanism in the USA (at least when I last checked for popularity) is explicitly atheist. For this group, "satan" is a symbol but not an actual being.


Uh... No offense intended, but examples from just the USA don't count for much. Those people aren't considered atheists by other atheists, their satanic/atheist combo is more a lashing out at living in a country "under god", in whom they don't believe.


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29 Aug 2008, 2:00 pm

Ishmael wrote:
Dogbrain wrote:
Trigger11 wrote:
The idea of Atheism precludes the existence of ANY dieties. So...no, I am not a Satanist, even if Christians like to call me one.


People really do need to get out more. The most popular form of satanism in the USA (at least when I last checked for popularity) is explicitly atheist. For this group, "satan" is a symbol but not an actual being.


Uh... No offense intended, but examples from just the USA don't count for much. Those people aren't considered atheists by other atheists, their satanic/atheist combo is more a lashing out at living in a country "under god", in whom they don't believe.


People in America rarely even notice "Under God" on their money. They care more that the counterfeit marker doesn't turn black. Only time it is said out loud is at sporting events and in some meetings of state congresses, though it has been tried to be replaced with "under force" or something like that in 2003 I think. Really. Visit here before you make such statements.



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29 Aug 2008, 2:09 pm

Actually, I have family in America ;)
But that's perception; most don't notice because most believe in a god of some kind. 90%. Of those 10% that don't, we can assume they would be too practicle, busy, unconcerned or whatever. Then those few that would notice it, because the meaning isn't an accepted norm to them, but something they are uncomfortable with. Some of those few would then taper off, according to events, to certain beliefs and behavioural patterns.


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29 Aug 2008, 2:11 pm

0_equals_true wrote:
One of the assumptions of this argument is that atheists are automatically materialists and lack morals. This is plain wrong.

Religion or no religion morality is unique to each person.

I can't speak for all atheists, but I'm a relativist. So therefore I make choices on my moral standing all the time. I don't believe in an absolute morality. I believe in a sort of medium as cultural memes, but this is highly complex and never permanent.

I agree, although I sort of hold an idealism, but I believe morality is not absolute and are human constructs.

Curiously, the 10 commandments have been stated to be somehow an example or the main example of morality to defend Christianity, it has been stated by some scholars and historians, however, that the 10 commandments may have originated from Ancient Egypt actually, in which it would have been borrowed by Ancient Judaism as they did with other stuff.


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29 Aug 2008, 2:16 pm

history_of_psychiatry wrote:
Satanism is almost "uber atheism" in a way. It is a religion that believes in taking part in the carnal as opposed to the spiritual.

Heh, I actually like the sound of 'Uber Atheism'. :lol:



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29 Aug 2008, 2:18 pm

Atheism and Satanism are different. Atheism denies any religion at all, and Satanism is Anti-Christianity. In any case, it's a religion, I think :twisted:



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29 Aug 2008, 2:18 pm

greenblue wrote:
the 10 commandments may have originated from Ancient Egypt actually, in which it would have been borrowed by Ancient Judaism as they did with other stuff.


Really, what Egyptian manuscript would they have borrowed them from?

For a memory refresher:

Quote:
Exodus 20:1-20 ESV
[1] And God spoke all these words, saying,
[2] "I am the LORD your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of slavery.
[3] "You shall have no other gods before me.
[4] "You shall not make for yourself a carved image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.
[5] You shall not bow down to them or serve them, for I the LORD your God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children to the third and the fourth generation of those who hate me,
[6] but showing steadfast love to thousands of those who love me and keep my commandments.
[7] "You shall not take the name of the LORD your God in vain, for the LORD will not hold him guiltless who takes his name in vain.
[8] "Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy.
[9] Six days you shall labor, and do all your work,
[10] but the seventh day is a Sabbath to the LORD your God. On it you shall not do any work, you, or your son, or your daughter, your male servant, or your female servant, or your livestock, or the sojourner who is within your gates.
[11] For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy.
[12] "Honor your father and your mother, that your days may be long in the land that the LORD your God is giving you.
[13] "You shall not murder.
[14] "You shall not commit adultery.
[15] "You shall not steal.
[16] "You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.
[17] "You shall not covet your neighbor's house; you shall not covet your neighbor's wife, or his male servant, or his female servant, or his ox, or his donkey, or anything that is your neighbor's."
[18] Now when all the people saw the thunder and the flashes of lightning and the sound of the trumpet and the mountain smoking, the people were afraid and trembled, and they stood far off
[19] and said to Moses, "You speak to us, and we will listen; but do not let God speak to us, lest we die."
[20] Moses said to the people, "Do not fear, for God has come to test you, that the fear of him may be before you, that you may not sin."



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29 Aug 2008, 3:32 pm

iamnotaparakeet wrote:
Really, what Egyptian manuscript would they have borrowed them from?

Papyrus of Ani (Book of the dead) chapter 125.
http://www.bardo.org/ani/ch125_p2.html


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29 Aug 2008, 4:42 pm

Sand wrote:
Some religious fanatics seem to believe that any opposition to Christianity obviously supports the devil. It stems from the mindset that there are only two sides to the question when there are clearly at least three and probably more. It is the same psychology that the Bush administration uses in that either you support his totalitarian approach to fighting terrorism or you are a terrorist.



I honestly think that the more intelligent ones dont really believe it but they promulgate it an attempt to villify atheists and "spook" some of the more gullible agnostics into joining the born-again Cult. :mrgreen:

But I have a question for those of you who really Do equate atheism with satanism(you folks are NOT SMART, which is probably why you have usernames like "Dogbrain" :D), if I were to worship Cthulhu instead of Jesus or the Devil, is that satanism??????



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29 Aug 2008, 5:18 pm

greenblue wrote:
iamnotaparakeet wrote:
Really, what Egyptian manuscript would they have borrowed them from?

Papyrus of Ani (Book of the dead) chapter 125.
http://www.bardo.org/ani/ch125_p2.html


If the author is a guy, he mustn't have reached puberty when he wrote this, otherwise the 22nd is a load of crap. "violent robbery" I suppose that makes nonviolent robbery acceptable. There's a lot of difference with minimal similarities. To claim lineage of one text from the other is invalid. Besides, why bother with Egypt? Has someone debunked the Sumerian claim already?



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29 Aug 2008, 5:21 pm

Haliphron wrote:
Sand wrote:
Some religious fanatics seem to believe that any opposition to Christianity obviously supports the devil. It stems from the mindset that there are only two sides to the question when there are clearly at least three and probably more. It is the same psychology that the Bush administration uses in that either you support his totalitarian approach to fighting terrorism or you are a terrorist.



I honestly think that the more intelligent ones dont really believe it but they promulgate it an attempt to villify atheists and "spook" some of the more gullible agnostics into joining the born-again Cult. :mrgreen:

But I have a question for those of you who really Do equate atheism with satanism(you folks are NOT SMART, which is probably why you have usernames like "Dogbrain" :D), if I were to worship Cthulhu instead of Jesus or the Devil, is that satanism??????


You don't have the ability to read if you think I'm claiming Atheism = Satanism.

The fact is that Satanism is a subset of Atheism, and that is true whether you like it or not.



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29 Aug 2008, 5:50 pm

iamnotaparakeet wrote:
Haliphron wrote:
Sand wrote:
Some religious fanatics seem to believe that any opposition to Christianity obviously supports the devil. It stems from the mindset that there are only two sides to the question when there are clearly at least three and probably more. It is the same psychology that the Bush administration uses in that either you support his totalitarian approach to fighting terrorism or you are a terrorist.



I honestly think that the more intelligent ones dont really believe it but they promulgate it an attempt to villify atheists and "spook" some of the more gullible agnostics into joining the born-again Cult. :mrgreen:

But I have a question for those of you who really Do equate atheism with satanism(you folks are NOT SMART, which is probably why you have usernames like "Dogbrain" :D), if I were to worship Cthulhu instead of Jesus or the Devil, is that satanism??????


You don't have the ability to read if you think I'm claiming Atheism = Satanism.

The fact is that Satanism is a subset of Atheism, and that is true whether you like it or not.

Well it depends which type of Satanism, Church of Satan Satanism shares the belief that mythical creatures such as Jesus or a God do not exist. There are types of Satanism though that have followers that actually believe Satan exists and go from there.