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Awesomelyglorious
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08 Jul 2010, 6:01 pm

Does cryogenic freezing allow one to live in the future? Particularly if all that is done is that the information is copied from the brain into another source?

Is cryogenics a problem? Is it odd? Would you freeze yourself?

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/11/magaz ... gewanted=1



greenblue
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08 Jul 2010, 6:11 pm

Does the copy of information from the brain to other source has to do with Ray Kurzweil's futuristic AI ideas or is this a different scenario?


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Awesomelyglorious
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08 Jul 2010, 6:20 pm

greenblue wrote:
Does the copy of information from the brain to other source has to do with Ray Kurzweil's futuristic AI ideas or is this a different scenario?

It has as much to do with Kurzweil as you want it to. :P



Sand
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08 Jul 2010, 7:06 pm

Awesomelyglorious wrote:
greenblue wrote:
Does the copy of information from the brain to other source has to do with Ray Kurzweil's futuristic AI ideas or is this a different scenario?

It has as much to do with Kurzweil as you want it to. :P


It is unlikely that anyone at this site has the scientific background or experimental experience to offer a sensible reply. It is quite easy here to gather meaningless chatter by total ignoramuses if that is your goal.



Awesomelyglorious
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08 Jul 2010, 9:36 pm

Sand wrote:
Awesomelyglorious wrote:
greenblue wrote:
Does the copy of information from the brain to other source has to do with Ray Kurzweil's futuristic AI ideas or is this a different scenario?

It has as much to do with Kurzweil as you want it to. :P


It is unlikely that anyone at this site has the scientific background or experimental experience to offer a sensible reply. It is quite easy here to gather meaningless chatter by total ignoramuses if that is your goal.

You complain about this all the time, and I still say f*** you. That being said, most of the questions are philosophical or sociological anyway, and thus don't require much of a scientific background at all. You just need to know the term "cryogenic" and have some vague idea of transferring knowledge from a brain to a computer.



Sand
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08 Jul 2010, 10:59 pm

Awesomelyglorious wrote:
Sand wrote:
Awesomelyglorious wrote:
greenblue wrote:
Does the copy of information from the brain to other source has to do with Ray Kurzweil's futuristic AI ideas or is this a different scenario?

It has as much to do with Kurzweil as you want it to. :P


It is unlikely that anyone at this site has the scientific background or experimental experience to offer a sensible reply. It is quite easy here to gather meaningless chatter by total ignoramuses if that is your goal.

You complain about this all the time, and I still say f*** you. That being said, most of the questions are philosophical or sociological anyway, and thus don't require much of a scientific background at all. You just need to know the term "cryogenic" and have some vague idea of transferring knowledge from a brain to a computer.


A powerful and intelligent response, "Fuckyou". If that is the level of your discussion it seems my original contention is right on target.



Awesomelyglorious
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08 Jul 2010, 11:15 pm

Sand wrote:
Awesomelyglorious wrote:
Sand wrote:
Awesomelyglorious wrote:
greenblue wrote:
Does the copy of information from the brain to other source has to do with Ray Kurzweil's futuristic AI ideas or is this a different scenario?

It has as much to do with Kurzweil as you want it to. :P


It is unlikely that anyone at this site has the scientific background or experimental experience to offer a sensible reply. It is quite easy here to gather meaningless chatter by total ignoramuses if that is your goal.

You complain about this all the time, and I still say f*** you. That being said, most of the questions are philosophical or sociological anyway, and thus don't require much of a scientific background at all. You just need to know the term "cryogenic" and have some vague idea of transferring knowledge from a brain to a computer.


A powerful and intelligent response, "f****". If that is the level of your discussion it seems my original contention is right on target.

Actualy, "f***" is totally appropriate when dealing with you. Not only that, but I clearly used a 4 letter word.



Sand
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08 Jul 2010, 11:34 pm

Awesomelyglorious wrote:
Sand wrote:
Awesomelyglorious wrote:
Sand wrote:
Awesomelyglorious wrote:
greenblue wrote:
Does the copy of information from the brain to other source has to do with Ray Kurzweil's futuristic AI ideas or is this a different scenario?

It has as much to do with Kurzweil as you want it to. :P


It is unlikely that anyone at this site has the scientific background or experimental experience to offer a sensible reply. It is quite easy here to gather meaningless chatter by total ignoramuses if that is your goal.

You complain about this all the time, and I still say f*** you. That being said, most of the questions are philosophical or sociological anyway, and thus don't require much of a scientific background at all. You just need to know the term "cryogenic" and have some vague idea of transferring knowledge from a brain to a computer.


A powerful and intelligent response, "f****". If that is the level of your discussion it seems my original contention is right on target.

Actualy, "f***" is totally appropriate when dealing with you. Not only that, but I clearly used a 4 letter word.


Don't blame me for incompetent censorship. Your vitriolic emotional response quite satisfactorily demonstrates I've struck home.



Awesomelyglorious
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08 Jul 2010, 11:49 pm

Sand wrote:
Awesomelyglorious wrote:
Sand wrote:
Awesomelyglorious wrote:
Sand wrote:
Awesomelyglorious wrote:
greenblue wrote:
Does the copy of information from the brain to other source has to do with Ray Kurzweil's futuristic AI ideas or is this a different scenario?

It has as much to do with Kurzweil as you want it to. :P


It is unlikely that anyone at this site has the scientific background or experimental experience to offer a sensible reply. It is quite easy here to gather meaningless chatter by total ignoramuses if that is your goal.

You complain about this all the time, and I still say f*** you. That being said, most of the questions are philosophical or sociological anyway, and thus don't require much of a scientific background at all. You just need to know the term "cryogenic" and have some vague idea of transferring knowledge from a brain to a computer.


A powerful and intelligent response, "f****". If that is the level of your discussion it seems my original contention is right on target.

Actualy, "f***" is totally appropriate when dealing with you. Not only that, but I clearly used a 4 letter word.


Don't blame me for incompetent censorship. Your vitriolic emotional response quite satisfactorily demonstrates I've struck home.

No, it proves that you are an annoying f***. Let's put it this way, if a mosquito bites once, it's annoying. If it bites twice, you start getting mad. If you get bitten any time you go out, then the mosquitoes are annoying f***s.



skafather84
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08 Jul 2010, 11:59 pm

Awesomelyglorious wrote:
Does cryogenic freezing allow one to live in the future?


In short, no. In medium, the freezing process causes irreparable cell damage and the preservation processes that are currently available amount to little more than marinating a body in antifreeze and hoping someone can clean the body out in the future. In long, the cell damage is caused by the formation of ice crystals at the cellular level that pierce and damage the cells; to prevent this the body is cleaned of its bodily fluids and replaced with antifreeze substances on the off-chance that in the future they'll be able to clean out the antifreeze and repair any damage along with replacing all body fluids and then getting the heart to start up again after all of this.


Cryo works amazingly well for short term but it's not a hard freeze so much as it is a controlled induced hypothermia that is used to slow the heart to stoppage and it helps preserve the body longer for short term repair in the case of injury. There was a great presentation at TED recently on this. But it's not a long-term freezing solution, it's simply a measure to extend one's chances of living in the case of critical injury in the face of a long travel.


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skafather84
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09 Jul 2010, 12:03 am

Sand wrote:
Awesomelyglorious wrote:
greenblue wrote:
Does the copy of information from the brain to other source has to do with Ray Kurzweil's futuristic AI ideas or is this a different scenario?

It has as much to do with Kurzweil as you want it to. :P


It is unlikely that anyone at this site has the scientific background or experimental experience to offer a sensible reply. It is quite easy here to gather meaningless chatter by total ignoramuses if that is your goal.


It is likely, however, that there are people here who are futurists who read articles that contain information from experiments done by people with the required scientific backgrounds.

New Scientist, TED, Physorg, H+ Magazine. There's plenty of science to be learned and digested in a format for lay people.


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Awesomelyglorious
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09 Jul 2010, 12:04 am

skafather84 wrote:
There was a great presentation at TED recently on this. But it's not a long-term freezing solution, it's simply a measure to extend one's chances of living in the case of critical injury in the face of a long travel.

Hunh, interesting.



skafather84
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09 Jul 2010, 12:17 am

Awesomelyglorious wrote:
skafather84 wrote:
There was a great presentation at TED recently on this. But it's not a long-term freezing solution, it's simply a measure to extend one's chances of living in the case of critical injury in the face of a long travel.

Hunh, interesting.


Having trouble finding the video right now but that's probably because, if I'm not mistaken, the talk on freezing was in part of a larger presentation on the various technologies and techniques coming out to help extend our lifespans.


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Sand
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09 Jul 2010, 12:36 am

Although cryogenics has been slightly successful in suspended animation and other means such as the use of hydrogen sulfide looks interesting it is a subject that responds to experimentation and kicking the BS around is not an effective approach.

see:

http://edition.cnn.com/2009/HEALTH/10/0 ... index.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suspended_animation



skafather84
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09 Jul 2010, 12:52 am

Sand wrote:
Although cryogenics has been slightly successful in suspended animation and other means such as the use of hydrogen sulfide looks interesting it is a subject that responds to experimentation and kicking the BS around is not an effective approach.

see:

http://edition.cnn.com/2009/HEALTH/10/0 ... index.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suspended_animation


You gave me the keyword to find the video I was thinking of. Thanks!! :D

http://www.ted.com/talks/lang/eng/mark_ ... ation.html


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Last edited by skafather84 on 09 Jul 2010, 12:52 am, edited 1 time in total.

greenblue
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09 Jul 2010, 12:52 am

Awesomelyglorious wrote:
You just need to know the term "cryogenic" and have some vague idea of transferring knowledge from a brain to a computer.

well, not sure if those are necessarily related, cryogenics and mind transfer, as I assumed to be different things, however same goals.

The idea of transfering the brain to a computer seems very appealing, however I believe that requires some sort of dualism to work, and since that doesn't seem much to be the case, likely that may be an impossible but nice idea.

In any case, very likely, you can get a copy of a "dead" version of yourself, besides the issue that you would be just creating copies rather than actually transfering the mind from one place to another.

And unless the copy can actually feel and recognize everything exactly like we do as human beings, then I suppose that could be a perception of immortality, however not for the original individuals but the copies. And that seems unlikely given the issue related to the mind reagarding dualism vs nondualism.


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Last edited by greenblue on 09 Jul 2010, 1:03 am, edited 3 times in total.