Religion-What's the Point?

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All my life I've wondered, what's the point in religion? All it is in my opinion is a false promise. What if you pray all your life and turns out there isn't a God there isn't a Devil? And you sit their rotting in your grave. Personally I don't give a flying frick if "God" exist. I'm not saying he doesn't I just don't know. I'm not gonna make a false promise to myself. One of my therepist, who is like the holiest people I know besides my Grandparent's, always assumes I'm manic or going through a phase when I say I don't know or care if "God" exist.

So let's say he does exist, then I'll believe when I see him. Let's say he doesn't, at least I didn't make my self a false promise. People give me crap because I never read the "Bible". Here's why, 1. I don't like to read 2. If he doesn't exsist, think about all the time I wasted reading a book when I could've done something productive like finding a decent job or spending time with my cat, or even just focusing on the literature that my school actually requires that I read.

In fact, one of the reasons I don't want kids is that I don't want them to ask me if I believe in "God". Then I'll tell them "I don't really know if there's a "God". When I see him/her/it, I'll believe then." and then have my kids tell everybody at school.

Here's my opinion on Christmas and Easter. Those holidays aren't really Christian or religious anymore. All they've become is a time for bunnies, a man in a red suit, chocolate, and free gifts(well not really free but someone had to pay money for them). I seriously doubt anyone but the die-hards celebrate "God" and "Jesus" on those days.

Church, again a false promise. You could be at the mall buying new pairs of pants and shoes or at the supermarket buying food. Plus waking up that early on a Sunday morning is a bit ridiculous. I'd rather sleep in before getting up at 4:00 AM for school.

I apoligize if this makes anyone angry, but this is just my opinion so don't give me any "rebellious teen","Satanist wannabe" or "Atheist" comments. Because honesly I don't know and don't care. I'll know when I see it. I'll believe when I see it. Thank you for your time. Now it is time for a happy monkey:
http://www.clker.com/clipart-3424.html

At the very least, and while considering "religion" in the very broadest sense, it is one's "belief system" and "method of practice" while living life as we know it, and it is something nobody can actually avoid. Some religions and/or personal philosophies include one or more "gods" and others' do not, but everybody has a religion of one type or kind or style or another.


In reality, anyone at all could make that same statement about anyone's and/or everyone else's personal belief system and method of practice in life.


I would guess there are very few people who pray for their entire lives unless something along the way has assured them of the value of prayer ... and yet in reality, everybody actually prays -- "Oh, I hope ..." or "Oh, please ..." (even if only while thinking to themselves) -- for all their lives anyway.


Yes ... and there will actually be a day when *every* knee will bend.

Zero: Care to take Pascal up on his wager?

Huhhh????

He was a very logical person. He looked at the situation just as you have but came to a precisely opposite conclusion. You have concluded that it is a waste to spend your whole life praying because what happens if you pray but there is no God? Well, nothing happens. But if there is a God and you have spent your whole life reviling Him, then you are screwed. Pascal's Wager is the safer bet. He concluded that it's better to spend your whole life praying because if you are wrong and there is no God, then there are no consequences. But if he does exist then he will appreciate having been prayed to (more or less).

With your plan, the consequence of being right is nothing happens but the consequence of being wrong is eternal damnation. With his plan (Pascal's Wager), the consequences of being right is going to heaven but the consequences of being wrong is nothing happens. Logical man that he was, he saw which was the safer bet.

Pascal's Wager. You can read more about it at this link.

The short explanation of it is, Pascal proposed that the personal cost of not believing in God and being proven wrong in the afterlife (i.e., being damned to eternity in hell, and losing the opportunity to go to heaven) was much higher than believing in God and being proven wrong. Therefore, according to Pascal's logic, it was less risky to be a theist rather than an atheist.

Does the Flying Spaghetti Monster exist? I better devote my whole life to him and eat as much spaghetti as I can just in case.

He is often misunderstood. The wager was just an explanation about the use of infinite when calculating expected values...

Either way, besides of being a good example on that one math concept the actual logic used is not that good.

There is not just one god out there that is believed to exist and promises eternal punishment if you do not worship it. There are thousands of them. On that matter, it makes the wager irrelevant. If you choose to worship one, you will still be doomed in case the other one turns out to be the true god.

Multiple religions are a definate weak point. But on the other hand, as long as you stick to monotheism, you are covered for 3 religions.

The other weak point is the how much are you actually believing if you are just psyching yourself into believing for safety's sake? Would this somewhat compromised belief be good enough?

But even though it can be picked apart, I still do admire it's (somewhat flawed) logic, especially for the very religious culture he was writing this in. It's halfway to agnostic and I think that was a brave stand in that era.

Yes, neither do I like that "Pascal's Wager" kind of thinking. Nevertheless, we each do spend our lives devoted to something or someone, even if only to ourselves, so the first question we must consider, if any, is whether or not our devotion is actually being well-spent ...

... and that is where we each get to assess and decide for ourselves concerning the actual effectiveness of our personal beliefs and related actions.

The point is to shape our reality into what we truly believe it is.

The point in organized religion seems to be to unify and control people, more than anything else. The point in superstitious beliefs is to satisfy our craving for answers when we can't find real ones.
"Religions" that don't involve superstitious beliefs are just ideologies that make sense to some people and not to others.

By the way, to you Pascal's Wager supporters,

Billybob is the creator of the universe. You must believe in him and no other gods in order to get into heaven.

Fuzzy is the creator of the universe. You must believe in him and no other gods in order to get into heaven.

Jingaling is the creator of the universe. You must believe in her and no other gods in order to get into heaven.

Obviously, you're screwed no matter what. Also, believe in the Flying Spaghetti Monster right now. Do it. You can't? You say it's too ridiculous to believe in? Well, I'm the same way with your gods. I couldn't just choose to believe in a god even if it was the wisest thing to do.

Last edited by Squirrelrat on 20 Nov 2010, 5:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I love how you all fall back on the cry of 'flawed logic' when you don't like the answer. That's some pretty sound reasoning, without any fallacy in the midst. The question of multiple Gods and cultural practices is really tangential to the original reasoning.

The most obvious problem with Pascal's wager is that one cannot decide to believe in anything. One must be totally convinced and anyone who decides to believe in God out of fear is merely attempting to fool God of that conviction without being convinced. If God is real you can't fool Him,Her,It. God is omniscient.

Pascal's Wager is a fine example of hedging a bet. A hedged bet guarantees no loss and a possible gain regardless of the outcome.

ruveyn

Depending upon what you mean by "shape our reality", we must be careful there. We each have a right to believe belief can create reality, but I have yet to ever see anyone actually do that. Belief can lead to action (intentional or circumstantial investigation), however, and action can then disclose/reveal truth ... and that is how I have learned to *discover* reality each one of us can then either accept or reject.


That is not my experience. A mere willingness to believe was all it took for me to get started.


Neither is that true. Such fear would not be a good place to remain or to rely upon indefinitely, but anyone can get started for any reason of his or her own choosing.


We agree.