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Entitlements getting too harmful

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Vexcalibur
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01 May 2011, 8:41 am

This woman feels so entitled to not paying taxes that she compared getting a fair tax to the Holocaust:
http://www.startribune.com/politics/nat ... 23944.html


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ruveyn
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01 May 2011, 8:45 am

Vexcalibur wrote:
This woman feels so entitled to not paying taxes that she compared getting a fair tax to the Holocaust:
http://www.startribune.com/politics/nat ... 23944.html


the analogy to the Shoah is rather stretched and strained.

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DW_a_mom
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01 May 2011, 3:09 pm

Crack pot.

Income taxes have been going down for my entire adult life. We have more "economic liberty" now than when I entered the work force.

Fact.


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aghogday
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01 May 2011, 6:35 pm

DW_a_mom wrote:
Crack pot.

Income taxes have been going down for my entire adult life. We have more "economic liberty" now than when I entered the work force.

Fact.


I concur. I paid more taxes at $25,000 than I did at $50,000. I kept thinking to myself this is nice but, where is all this money coming from. One of my favorites was the retirement tax credit; hit the right taxable income bracket and get back $1000 for saving $2000 for retirement. And now $800 tax credits for working, all in addition to the average $6500 a year reduction a person with an AGI of $250,000 sees from the reduction in the tax brackets.

In ten years I padded my savings account by $20,000 from those tax cuts. I was not rich by any means, but $20,000 in my savings account is economic liberty provided by the government in the way of tax cuts.

Taxes really haven't been historically high since after the Reagan tax cuts. I benefited from those as well.

Does any free market Capitalistic Country have individual Government income tax rates that are lower?

She is assuming something is going to happen in the future that is not happening now. Many people that enter the workforce now pay nothing in federal income tax on their wages.

After saying all that though, we really do need to raise taxes, along with cutting spending, in an efficient manner to get control of the budget, but I don't think it is going to significantly impact anyone, anytime soon that enters the workforce, as long as it is done soon, and is not delayed until we have a crisis.



pandabear
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01 May 2011, 6:49 pm

Citizens of some of the oil-rich nations pay no taxes at all.



leejosepho
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01 May 2011, 7:07 pm

Vexcalibur wrote:
This woman feels so entitled to not paying taxes that she compared getting a fair tax to the Holocaust:
http://www.startribune.com/politics/nat ... 23944.html

I have often heard people make remarks such as "You're killing me!" over something someone has done (or has not done), but I do not think that is what this woman really meant in relation to younger people today. Rather, and with some kind of "living hell" in mind, she just mentions a time in her own past when she had heard about something really bad for a lot of people and then found herself ...
Quote:
... wondering if her mother did anything to stop it.

And then right after that, she ...
Quote:
... described the loss of "economic liberty" young Americans face today as a "flash point of history" in which the younger generation will [look back and] ask what their elders did to stop it. (italic added)

So then, what responsibility do people today have in relation to this:
Quote:
... the next generation will ask ... what their elders did to prevent them from facing a huge tax burden.

??

I have not yet read all the other posts here, so maybe somebody has already talked about what that woman is meaning to try to bring to everyone's attention:
Quote:
The generation of Americans just entering the work force now could eventually see 75 percent of their earnings sucked up by income taxes, Social Security and Medicare ...

... and I wonder what even my grandchildren might wonder about me in relation to that.


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leejosepho
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01 May 2011, 7:16 pm

DW_a_mom wrote:
Crack pot.

Income taxes have been going down for my entire adult life. We have more "economic liberty" now than when I entered the work force.

Fact.

Sure, maybe at the moment ... but then that will all change within the blink of an eye if/when this country ever has to pays it debts and get back into the black (if it even ever was).


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AceOfSpades
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01 May 2011, 9:34 pm

Vexcalibur wrote:
This woman feels so entitled to not paying taxes that she compared getting a fair tax to the Holocaust:
http://www.startribune.com/politics/nat ... 23944.html
Once again you've missed the point. The phrase "sense of entitlement" doesn't refer to a sense of entitlement per se, but it refers to wanting something for nothing. If it did refer to a sense of entitlement per se, then slavery would be justifiable since none of us would be entitled to being free of coercion. And of course, none of us would be held to a high enough esteem to be entitled to our own property.



LKL
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01 May 2011, 9:57 pm

AceOfSpades wrote:
Vexcalibur wrote:
This woman feels so entitled to not paying taxes that she compared getting a fair tax to the Holocaust:
http://www.startribune.com/politics/nat ... 23944.html
Once again you've missed the point. The phrase "sense of entitlement" doesn't refer to a sense of entitlement per se, but it refers to wanting something for nothing. If it did refer to a sense of entitlement per se, then slavery would be justifiable since none of us would be entitled to being free of coercion. And of course, none of us would be held to a high enough esteem to be entitled to our own property.

Do you have a significant point to make, besides "The phrase "sense of entitlement" doesn't refer to a sense of entitlement..."?



leejosepho
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01 May 2011, 10:04 pm

Vexcalibur wrote:
This woman feels so entitled to not paying taxes ...

Ah, I had been distracted by :holocaust: and had missed your having said that ...

Where did you get that thought?

I see nothing like that in the linked article, and the SSA disability income I will soon be receiving from your children (if you have any and of working age) and mine is actually an "allowance" (SSA term) ... and I am not in any way at all "entitled" to it.


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AceOfSpades
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01 May 2011, 10:09 pm

LKL wrote:
AceOfSpades wrote:
Vexcalibur wrote:
This woman feels so entitled to not paying taxes that she compared getting a fair tax to the Holocaust:
http://www.startribune.com/politics/nat ... 23944.html
Once again you've missed the point. The phrase "sense of entitlement" doesn't refer to a sense of entitlement per se, but it refers to wanting something for nothing. If it did refer to a sense of entitlement per se, then slavery would be justifiable since none of us would be entitled to being free of coercion. And of course, none of us would be held to a high enough esteem to be entitled to our own property.

Do you have a significant point to make, besides "The phrase "sense of entitlement" doesn't refer to a sense of entitlement..."?
I've already made it, so had you not resorted to appealing to ridicule you would've noticed that it doesn't refer to a sense of entitlement per se but feeling entitled to something for nothing. He is mocking the woman's "sense of entitlement" as if he's pointing out a hypocrisy since that phrase is commonly used among right wingers. If having a sense of entitlement itself was bad, then no right winger would stand for the right to property or anything like that since no one would be considered good enough to be entitled to their own property.



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01 May 2011, 11:02 pm

to me this all screams of the fact that in this day and age your worth as a human being comes ever closer to being the financial value one has, either towards oneself or society.


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leejosepho
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01 May 2011, 11:07 pm

Oodain wrote:
to me this all screams of the fact that in this day and age your worth as a human being comes ever closer to being the financial value one has, either towards oneself or society.

Oh, absolutely! The attorney who handled my SSA appeal hearing told me he has homeless people who cannot get disability even though they cannot work ... and so I trimmed my hair and beard a bit and took my skinny little wife along to the hearing!

Seriously, however, yes, the "earning capacity" of we Americans who have SS numbers is the "chattel property" or whatever securing financing to keep this batter-and-tattered, not-really-all-that-old Mayflower afloat ... or something like that.


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LKL
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02 May 2011, 3:57 pm

AceOfSpades wrote:
LKL wrote:
AceOfSpades wrote:
Vexcalibur wrote:
This woman feels so entitled to not paying taxes that she compared getting a fair tax to the Holocaust:
http://www.startribune.com/politics/nat ... 23944.html
Once again you've missed the point. The phrase "sense of entitlement" doesn't refer to a sense of entitlement per se, but it refers to wanting something for nothing. If it did refer to a sense of entitlement per se, then slavery would be justifiable since none of us would be entitled to being free of coercion. And of course, none of us would be held to a high enough esteem to be entitled to our own property.

Do you have a significant point to make, besides "The phrase "sense of entitlement" doesn't refer to a sense of entitlement..."?
I've already made it, so had you not resorted to appealing to ridicule you would've noticed that it doesn't refer to a sense of entitlement per se but feeling entitled to something for nothing. He is mocking the woman's "sense of entitlement" as if he's pointing out a hypocrisy since that phrase is commonly used among right wingers. If having a sense of entitlement itself was bad, then no right winger would stand for the right to property or anything like that since no one would be considered good enough to be entitled to their own property.

In other words, 'No.'



AceOfSpades
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02 May 2011, 3:58 pm

LKL wrote:
AceOfSpades wrote:
LKL wrote:
AceOfSpades wrote:
Vexcalibur wrote:
This woman feels so entitled to not paying taxes that she compared getting a fair tax to the Holocaust:
http://www.startribune.com/politics/nat ... 23944.html
Once again you've missed the point. The phrase "sense of entitlement" doesn't refer to a sense of entitlement per se, but it refers to wanting something for nothing. If it did refer to a sense of entitlement per se, then slavery would be justifiable since none of us would be entitled to being free of coercion. And of course, none of us would be held to a high enough esteem to be entitled to our own property.

Do you have a significant point to make, besides "The phrase "sense of entitlement" doesn't refer to a sense of entitlement..."?
I've already made it, so had you not resorted to appealing to ridicule you would've noticed that it doesn't refer to a sense of entitlement per se but feeling entitled to something for nothing. He is mocking the woman's "sense of entitlement" as if he's pointing out a hypocrisy since that phrase is commonly used among right wingers. If having a sense of entitlement itself was bad, then no right winger would stand for the right to property or anything like that since no one would be considered good enough to be entitled to their own property.

In other words, 'No.'
Care to explain why the distinction is insignificant?



LKL
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02 May 2011, 4:11 pm

Because the initial post is valid in either sense. One could say that Bachman wants something -civilization- for nothing -no taxes-. Or that she feels a personal sense of entitlement. Either way, Vex's post makes sense.

You are quibbling over the meaning of the word, rather than addressing the overarching point of teabaggers' attitudes towards taxes and ignorance of history.