Page 1 of 3 [ 41 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next

JakobVirgil
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 15 Feb 2011
Age: 50
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,744
Location: yes

11 Sep 2011, 10:30 am

מְכַשֵּׁפָה לֹא תְחַיֶּה ס
^this is a paragraph marker so
מְכַשֵּׁפָה לֹא תְחַיֶּה

first word (from the right)
מְכַשֵּׁפָה
root
כָּשַׁף kashaph
to whisper so a whisperer
it is the word used for magician in Daniel 2:2

second word is non controversial לֹא (lo) is not.

the root of the last word is חָיַה (chayah)
to revive.

I think at worst it should be translated as a DNR for witchs.
but is could be a prohibition on whisperers (gossips)

funny enough google translate renders it (from modern hebrew) as

Quote:
Hag no regeneration


I am thinking the intention was don't help witches or employ them.
too bad so many people had to burn over a little verse.


_________________
?We must not look at goblin men,
We must not buy their fruits:
Who knows upon what soil they fed
Their hungry thirsty roots??

http://jakobvirgil.blogspot.com/


androbot2084
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 23 Mar 2011
Age: 63
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,447

11 Sep 2011, 8:09 pm

The correct interpretation may mean banishment rather than the death penalty. I cannot believe that the bible would demand the death penalty for an astrology reading. However if human sacrifice is involved that would be a different story.



Kraichgauer
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 48,506
Location: Spokane area, Washington state.

11 Sep 2011, 8:47 pm

androbot2084 wrote:
The correct interpretation may mean banishment rather than the death penalty. I cannot believe that the bible would demand the death penalty for an astrology reading. However if human sacrifice is involved that would be a different story.


I can't speak about fortune tellers in the ancient Middle east, but among my pre-Christian ancestors in Europe, it was common to disembowel a human sacrifice, and for the Godi, Druid, or whatever you want to call the holy man to attempt reading future events in the bloody innards.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer



Tadzio
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 2 Sep 2009
Age: 72
Gender: Male
Posts: 877

12 Sep 2011, 2:38 am

I was taught that it means a person shouldn't seek help from a witch, even if the person's life depended upon the help from a witch.



Joker
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 19 Mar 2011
Age: 35
Gender: Male
Posts: 7,593
Location: North Carolina The Tar Heel State :)

12 Sep 2011, 2:40 am

The salem wtich trials in my view really had more to do with blame then it did with religion its so sad that non of those people practiced witchcraft yet where accused and burned to the stake its not right at all



naturalplastic
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 26 Aug 2010
Age: 69
Gender: Male
Posts: 35,189
Location: temperate zone

14 Sep 2011, 7:59 pm

Tadzio wrote:
I was taught that it means a person shouldn't seek help from a witch, even if the person's life depended upon the help from a witch.


You mean "dont suffer [ the company] of a witch..." for the purpose of you yourself to surive ( ie "to live")?

Youve gotta be joking.

Thats an unlikely meaning to put into the phrase.

As rendered into English it can only mean that "witches are so evil that they are pathetic and killing them is the right because it puts them out of their misery (like putting down an animal)."



ruveyn
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 21 Sep 2008
Age: 88
Gender: Male
Posts: 31,502
Location: New Jersey

14 Sep 2011, 8:38 pm

JakobVirgil wrote:

the root of the last word is חָיַה (chayah)
to revive.

.


The infinitive for resuscitate. Revive is not a good translation. Better would be to enable to live since the biblical Hebrew is in the causative binyan

is להחיות



phil777
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 20 May 2008
Age: 38
Gender: Male
Posts: 4,825
Location: Montreal, Québec

14 Sep 2011, 9:41 pm

Kraichgauer, I know what you're talking about actually, I knew the french term from a heroic fantasy comic book, but I forgot about it. -.- Can't even find the bloody (secondary) character on the internet. >:^(



Vigilans
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 19 Jun 2008
Age: 36
Gender: Male
Posts: 12,181
Location: Montreal

14 Sep 2011, 10:01 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:
androbot2084 wrote:
The correct interpretation may mean banishment rather than the death penalty. I cannot believe that the bible would demand the death penalty for an astrology reading. However if human sacrifice is involved that would be a different story.


I can't speak about fortune tellers in the ancient Middle east, but among my pre-Christian ancestors in Europe, it was common to disembowel a human sacrifice, and for the Godi, Druid, or whatever you want to call the holy man to attempt reading future events in the bloody innards.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer


I think that is called Haruspex or Anthropomancy


_________________
Opportunities multiply as they are seized. -Sun Tzu
Nature creates few men brave, industry and training makes many -Machiavelli
You can safely assume that you've created God in your own image when it turns out that God hates all the same people you do


Fnord
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 6 May 2008
Age: 67
Gender: Male
Posts: 60,858
Location: Stendec

14 Sep 2011, 10:36 pm

Anthropomancy is divination by human sacrifice (details are best left unsaid).

Extispicy is the practice of using anomalies in animal entrails to predict or divine future events.

Haruspicy is the inspection of the entrails of sacrificed animals, especially the livers of sacrificed sheep and poultry.

Wikipedia has an article on Methods of Divination.

Personally, I think that if any one of the methods described actually worked, it would be the only method being practiced; and since all forms of divination have been or are still being practiced, it is safe to say that none of them actually work. Besides, there is no valid material evidence to support any claim that any method of divination actually works - it's all in the minds of the believers.


_________________
 
The previous signature line has been cancelled.


91
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 30 Oct 2010
Age: 39
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,063
Location: Australia

14 Sep 2011, 10:39 pm

androbot2084 wrote:
The correct interpretation may mean banishment rather than the death penalty. I cannot believe that the bible would demand the death penalty for an astrology reading. However if human sacrifice is involved that would be a different story.


This view may be correct, but I cannot say for sure. The choice of Hebrew for a death sentence is usually more explicit than this. It could however mean a death sentence, I don't really know. All I can say for certain is that the OT prescribes death for punishment, as does the NT, what was revoked however was our ability to judge the difference in others. The Parable of the Tares explicitly forbids such actions; it is the only Parable Jesus explained in full detail. This view is supported also in Mat 7:1-5 and in many other places.


_________________
Life is real ! Life is earnest!
And the grave is not its goal ;
Dust thou art, to dust returnest,
Was not spoken of the soul.


phil777
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 20 May 2008
Age: 38
Gender: Male
Posts: 4,825
Location: Montreal, Québec

14 Sep 2011, 10:48 pm

Haruspex is closer to what I remember. Thanks Vigilans. :P I think it's known as "haruspice" in french, but i'm not quite sure.



Tadzio
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 2 Sep 2009
Age: 72
Gender: Male
Posts: 877

14 Sep 2011, 11:48 pm

Bierce also writes about the "organ of common-sense" in his "Fantastic Fables" (page 144) with
"From The Minutes""The number of men known to me who are not in some important respects fools"

naturalplastic wrote:
Tadzio wrote:
I was taught that it means a person shouldn't seek help from a witch, even if the person's life depended upon the help from a witch.


You mean "dont suffer [ the company] of a witch..." for the purpose of you yourself to surive ( ie "to live")?

Youve gotta be joking.

Thats an unlikely meaning to put into the phrase.

As rendered into English it can only mean that "witches are so evil that they are pathetic and killing them is the right because it puts them out of their misery (like putting down an animal)."


No, my Gods say, for the modern day, psychiatrists don't want the competition, especially with the "spectrum of autism". Spectrums: "The Mind Game: Witchdoctors and Psychiatrists" E. Fuller Torrey (1972). How many spectres are in any spectrum? Or am I on the wrong planet again?

Tadzio



shrox
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 11 Aug 2011
Age: 60
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,295
Location: OK let's go.

14 Sep 2011, 11:52 pm

What do you call a 17th century girl who is good at math?


WITCH!! !



Kraichgauer
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 48,506
Location: Spokane area, Washington state.

15 Sep 2011, 2:09 am

shrox wrote:
What do you call a 17th century girl who is good at math?


WITCH!! !


In all honesty, it probably depended where the girl in the 17th century lived, and what her religious environment entailed.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer



91
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 30 Oct 2010
Age: 39
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,063
Location: Australia

15 Sep 2011, 2:55 am

shrox wrote:
What do you call a 17th century girl who is good at math?


Margaret Cavendish


_________________
Life is real ! Life is earnest!
And the grave is not its goal ;
Dust thou art, to dust returnest,
Was not spoken of the soul.