What's with us and suicide?

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When I mean 'us' I mean the overarching norms of the global populace.

I'm just baffled by the seemingly fetishistic intellectual obstinance to the idea that plenty of people who don't want to be here have valid reasons and that such reasons do exist. Some of the times I get reminders of this from looking at the haven, someone has nothing, sees no sign nor possibility for things to get better. Sometimes, if they know themselves, odds are they're right. People then chime in with all kinds of utterly asinine things that, I hate to say it, are such thin gruel that they seem to offer more proof to the OP that they're actually right than anything else.

What I don't understand is why society doesn't just get to the point of having a counseling process. Meaning: a psychologist sits down with you, gets in depth about your life, who you are, what your possibilities are. Their objective is to, over a series of at least a years worth of meetings, verify with you that you are in fact making the best choice for who you are and how you feel/interpret the world. Mind you - not every mindset or personality-type that's dystonic to living or being human is necessarily distorted. They would look through the persons reasons and - especially if this person knows that they only possibility for them going forward is becoming an emotional black hole and then being a weight on the system when, in their loneliness, they contract some terminal illness or need to be placed in a nursing home. If a person has options they haven't considered in terms of still living - they try to help guide that person in that direction, if they end up in agreement that the person's options are tapped out then they start the procedure to have a formal medical process arranged to make it painless. People could plan wills this way, people could do what they needed to to make sure their loved ones were taken care of, and it would be much better than people needing to take nasty measures covertly and then even worsening what people left in the wake of it are stuck with both emotionally and financially.

The fetish with the idea that all must live, that suicide must be prevented at all costs, that anyone who'd think such a thing needs to be rescued - its just that, a fetish. It seems like if anything the people who really want to die but choose not to, especially the emotions of other people who do care about them, they're really trying to assuage someone else's problems - sometimes its appropriate, often enough its seemingly more inappropriate of the people who are imposing the pouting - after all if they're really suffering and you really love them, you should be able to let them go.

Do you think I'm summing up the view most people have here at WP:PPR or am I missing something?

The only thing I see wrong is when people used the threat or implied threat of suicide to get what they want, whether it be material goods, cash money, behavior changes in others, or just a little extra attention for themselves. If someone really wants to off themselves, then why don't they just do it?

I pretty much agree & although I've never been suicidal myself, it gives me some emotional comfort to know that Switzerland is not far away in case I or any of my close friends ever need the services of Dignitas.

Well in the end it really is that individuals choice what they want to do, but it should never be encouraged and there should be help availible to suicidal people. It is a quite complex problem in which many factors have to be considered. I mean even if someone is what the taxpayers call a 'burden on society.' should they be obligated to kill themself over that and how bad they must feel to be considering suicide in the first place....or do they deserve to get some help with that.

It is a rather complex issue so I can't say how I feel about it in every senerio......I mean if someone seriously has no quality of life, no change of really getting any quality of life and really just wants it to end it should ultimately be up to them. But even then it is hard to be of the veiw that they 'should' also though I feel like if there where such policies to allow people acess to painless suicide it could be abused like someone might want to further convince someone who does have a chance of feeling better in life that they should just do it...so yeah its hard to say if something like that would actually work and if it would be the right thing to do or not.

Suicide is a waste of a perfectly good and capable person. Those who are suicidal just refuse to see that in themselves.

techstepgenr8tion, I mostly agree with you. But since we in the U.S. don't necessarily have a better option than posting in the Haven, thin gruel may have to suffice for long enough to let the mental disturbance pass. I don't get that sense of serious intellectual consideration from the I wanna die posts there.

Regarding doctor assisted suicide: for many seriously ill people, just having the option makes dealing with the sickness easier. I imagine that knowing that I had the means to peacefully end my life would make facing a terrible disease a lot less worrisome.

However Jesus -- according to his self-appointed spokespeople -- disagrees, and that settles it.

This thread reminds me of Michigan's Jack Kevorkian. Mostly I see the rise of such a figure as a strange symptom of the medical system's often terrible inability to address and offer real pain management.

As disturbing as Kevorkian and his death machine was to many people and our culture in general I think he fought a worthy cause based on compassion and I respect him.

In general regarding suicide and many other issues we have to realize we don't have the authority to control other people and their bodies. The few exceptions might be cases of true insanity when the person is frankly not in control of their body or their faculties.

I have four reasons for being against suicide:

We are not the owners of our own lives, we are the stewards our civilization. Our existence owes something to our fellow man, even those yet to be born.

Suicide goes directly against our natural inclination to survive and perpetuate our own lives.

Suicide is a public deceleration and as such it sets an example, and a bad one, to those who need to be shown solidarity in life, not death.

My last reason is religious, God gave us our lives, they are not ours to take.