My Monster God and I

Post Reply New Topic

Some time ago, my wife got a book on anxiety and depression titled "The Road Less Traveled." in it is a particular chapter of note for me. This chapter covers the author's experiences with a man who at first glance is both atheist and successful: good house, good job, loving wife and child. But he suffers from horrible anxiety and depression.

It takes many sessions of therapy before a central truth is found: deep down, the man isn't really an atheist at all. At his core, he believes that there is a monstrous God-entity out there that hates him and wishes him harm. The author(a psychologist) points out in this chapter that our belief in what a higher power represents springs from our experiences with our parents: if we come from a loving home, we believe in benevolent forces at work in the world. If our parents are abusive and religious, regardless of what we consciously believe to be true, deep down we believe in a monster god that is as willing to abuse us as our parents were.

This reading was a revelation for me, in a way. I've been agnostic for well over a decade, but growing up and even now, I believed in a harsh, judgmental entity that enjoys watching me suffer. Not always consciously, mind you. Even now, I make sacrifices of things I enjoy for no reason other than in hopes of staving off disaster beyond my control. My therapist says I'm always on guard in my own personal Watchtower, preparing for the worst to happen. I still have flashbacks to earlier, worse times, and worry that at any moment, could be thrown back into a similar situation.

As pointed out by both the book and my therapist, certainties we form as children are incredibly hard to dismiss as adults. We are so impressionable as children, our minds pliant. But once we age, it's like firing clay in a kiln. We become rigid and harder to change.

I started this topic because, though I'm working on changing things, it's a slow process, and I'm scared of what it means if I can't change my beliefs. Having schizophrenia in my family, I worry that believing in an entity that would take time in its existence to cause me harm for grins is a borderline schizotypical thought, however subconscious it may be. And even with schizophrenia fears aside, I despair of continuing my life with this dragging me down. How can one function when the deepest part of you thinks you're cursed by a force you can never defeat? And does my Asperger's make this even harder? How can my perception of the entire world as a painful, damning place not also influence that core belief?

In a very real way, this is what faith is for me. It's twisted and ugly, but it's just as strong, unshakeable, and in my worst moments, seemingly justified as any faith out there.

Please note, I posted this in this thread because it seems topical. I'm not looking to discuss theology or Jesus or whatever. What I'm more interested in is the core conceit of parents influencing the shape of god-figures, and how negative god-images can affect depression and anxiety. Also of note is how this affects suicidal thinking. I would wager, for example, that a great many suicides among gay males in religious families come from a similar issue: they think God hates them and wishes them harm, which is a terrible tragedy. I am also convinced that this has played a large role in many of my own bouts with suicidal ideation.

Essentially, the issue boils down to this: what do you do when no matter what you logically assure yourself, you believe at your core that an omnipotent entity hates you?

I think Church and religion had a great deal with my anxiety and panic attack issues at a young age. I don't know why people feel it is important to tell the more gory Bible stories to kids, especially kids of only 4 or 5. I think the possibility of kids not being able to integrate what they are taught about the Bible is too great to begin teaching them about it at that age. I know it happened to me, I know I'm not the only one. All it taught me was that people were happy at the prospect of dying, and that accepting Jesus is the only thing that mattered, not anything you do in this world. It took a long time for Sundays to feel normal for me, without a gloomy shade of gray overlaying the day and everything about it. Even looking at pictures of Biblical scenes made me feel strange and dreadful, as it reminded me of my panic attacks.

Not precisely where I was going with that, truth be told. However, my dad being Mormon an constantly having church members coming over uninvited was indeed a stressor for me growing up.

I'm an agnostic and I have very similar issues to what you speak of. I was raised Catholic, and whilst my parents were fine, I had an awful time in Catholic school. Even when I was a child (a very religious one at that) I was convinced that God hated me. I had the terror of hell and it would keep me up all night, trying to read my children's Bible, and wondering if I'd go to hell or not (I figured I probably would).

It didn't help that I was mostly attracted to other women in my teenage years. My Mum is a non-denominational Christian and she would tell me how 'unnatural' she thought homosexuality was. Even though Catholicism isn't particularly vehemently condemnatory of lesbianism, I still had this idea that God hated me for it. I still do subconsciously. Even when you replace the word God with 'nature', I still think nature hates me because I'm so 'unnatural' and all.

So yes, I'm consciously an agnostic and subconsciously a dystheist. I've had depression since childhood and pyschotic symptoms sometimes. There's no history of schizophrenia in my family, but my grandmother was bipolar and hyper religious.

Sorry I didn't really bring anything to the debate, other than confirming that the phenomenon you speak of exists.

Thanks, puddingmouse! It seems I may have been better served putting this topic elsewhere(though where precisely escapes me)., but your post is appreciated.

Diverging from the topic of the thread for a second:

I know this may not help(as I have said, notions we get when we're young are hard to dispel), but homosexuality is not an unnatural thing at all. It occurs in many species, and there is evidence to suggest that it may be nature's birth control. Furthermore, I read an article some months back in my Human Development class that bisexuality and homosexual experimentation are more common in women than in men for reasons unknown.

Furthermore, my wife's bisexual, and actually prefers women to men in general. Anyone tells her that she's unnatural or an abomination, and I'll kick their f&*king teeth in. So know at least that you've got two people in your corner on this, for what it's worth.

So it is not Atheism that is the cause of his problems, but his unreasonable belief in a supernatural being.

Kindly take the time to read the entire post in question before automatically taking offense. Faith can be an incredibly healthy thing for many people, I feel. The problem is the fact that his parents abused him, and it instilled in him a twisted form of faith. That is the fault of his parents. Had he not been treated so, He likely would have a solid and healthy faith, something which I endorse.

I would hope that most people of faith would also be upset about what happened to this person, and would want for him an actually healthy relationship with a God. I have spoken to a friend of mine about this previously who is Jewish(and more Orthodox than many, at that) to actually approach my own problem from a theological perspective.

Yeah, this kind of problem is not really overly shocking. The transition from theist to non-spiritual often can have psychological consequences for those of certain backgrounds.

Here's my thoughts on the matter:
1) Work to create intellectual structures that are highly opposed to this false notion of deity. The more you can deeply ingrain in yourself a set of beliefs that is skeptical, the more you can use cognitive dissonance against your notions of God.
2) Alter some elements of your life. Basically, the idea is to establish a bit of a breaking away from your old notions. So, this can be something like a change in haircut, a change in location, etc, so long as the idea is to break away from who you have been, especially things you may associate in any way shape or form with this notion.
3) Persistently do not give into this notion. Even though it may have some pull, break habits of giving into the sacrifices, and whenever something like this comes to mind both rationalize it away and distract yourself from it.

The central issue is that retraining is probably what is needed. This means undercutting anything that is part of this old habit, and training new habits to move away from this. The process is probably doable, but.... I don't know how long it may take. I know that some people really really have trouble overcoming their issues with God, where it takes them years, and after they get over the hurdle, they start to feel a lot better about the situation.

Kindly take note of the fact that I took no offense, as the person's post has merely confirmed what I have been claiming for years - that belief in unprovable things causes suffering.


Faith proves nothing. Feelings prove nothing.


Then we agree - his twisted faith caused his problems long after he escaped his parents' abuse.


This is his fault for allowing his parents' influence over him to continue into adulthood.


If God wants to have a healthy relationship with the man, then why not let God deal with it? Religious people meddling in other people's lives seems to inspire more guilt and shame than love and hope.


Irrelevant. Your problems are yours, and no one else's.

Hi Fnord,

In which plague did your "Your problems are yours, and no one else's" stance ever work for anyone for civilization?

Tadzio

Would you please point out where Sagroth claimed to have the Plague?

"At his core, he believes that there is a monstrous God-entity out there that hates him and wishes him harm."

I would say many people believe this.

Hi Fnord,

"The Plague" is a powerful metaphorical study of human life and its meaning in the face of any adversity. Much like autistic spectrum disorders tend to impact a wide range of social interactions in pursuing many varied major life activities per individuals involved. An attempted "balance" between individual concerns versus the groups' concerns is difficult, to self-contradictory, especially with the many individuals making the group and the group determining the individual.

Tadzio

Fnord:

I took your original post in this thread in the complete opposite of its intended meaning(the eye roll smiley gets me every time).

And that is what flavored my response to you: I thought you were offended because I insulted religion. It seems nothing could be further from the truth.

In any event, the rationale for my friend helping me from a theological perspective is the assumption that if I can consciously reject organized religion but still hold it in my subconscious, then perhaps attempting to rewrite a relationship with a God figure instead of denying outright could help. I don't trust organized religion in general, but I trust him.

You will learn very quickly that when you put your faith in stories and superstition it leads to nothing but more pain and grief.

I don't, but I went through great efforts to deprogram myself from my religious upbringing. Still, I understand your post only too well. My subconsciousness merely puts it into different terms: "The entire world / humanity seems to hate me, everything I do turns into a disaster, I'm such a total loser" and so on. It's essentially the same kind of feeling, only that I don't anthropomorphize the cold and uncaring universe that sometimes seems to have it in for me. Instead, I blame myself and other people around me.