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Tequila
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25 Feb 2013, 10:32 am

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What if the terrorists were Jews?

Would you say the same thing about Jews? Gays? Or any other minority?’ This is one of the witless questions asked of anyone who writes about Islamic extremism. And it is a fascinating point in a way, taking in – as it does – everything other than the facts.

Yesterday another radical Muslim cell in the UK was found guilty of terrorism offences. Irfan Naseer, Irfan Khalid and Ashik Ali had hoped to carry out a wave of suicide bombings in Britain which would have exceeded 7/7 and rivalled 9/11 in terms of impact and casualties. They were radical Islamists, inspired by radical Islamist preachers and had travelled to Pakistan to receive training in bomb-making with the aim of blowing up British people. Troublingly, as the Mail reports:

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‘Nobody in the bomb plotters’ own community tipped the police off with their concerns, despite finding out they were sending young men to terror training camps in Pakistan.

At no point during the 18-month investigation by the West Midlands counter-terrorism unit did anyone in Birmingham’s Muslim community inform on the behaviour of Irfan Naseer, Irfan Khalid and Ashik Ali, raising questions over the health of relations between officers and community leaders.

This was despite the fact the families of four other young men recruited from Sparkhill all intervened to bring them back home the moment they found out the real reasons for them travelling to Pakistan.

Detective Inspector Adam Gough, senior investigating officer, said the extended families of the four men had ‘become aware’ of why they went to Pakistan but, in any case, ‘did not tell us’.’

Now, of course the vast majority of Muslims are as disgusted by the actions of these extremists as everybody else is. But perhaps I can bat the ‘you wouldn’t say this’ question back to some people.

Let us say that a certain percentage of gays or a certain percentage of Jews or any other minority were indeed in this situation. Let us imagine that the cell convicted of attempting to carry out mass murder on the streets of Britain were radical Jews rather than radical Muslims, inspired by Jewish preachers and trained by Jewish terrorist groups in the belief – mistaken or otherwise – that they were acting in the name of their Jewish religion.



xenon13
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25 Feb 2013, 11:20 am

This is why Britain and the US serve Israel as they know that if they don't the letter bombs will start being sent to their officials again...



Tequila
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25 Feb 2013, 12:16 pm

xenon13 wrote:
This is why Britain and the US serve Israel as they know that if they don't the letter bombs will start being sent to their officials again...


Nice allusion to "Jews/Israelis controling U.S. governments" there.

I'm a supporter of Israel and I would welcome it if the U.S. stopped providing Israel with that tiny amount of financial 'aid' (that is really just an indirect bung to the U.S. military). It would be one less thing that anti-Israel nutjobs could beat Israel with, and I'm absolutely sure that Israel could stand on her own two feet in any case. Israel is rich enough and resourceful enough not to need the 'aid'.



xenon13
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25 Feb 2013, 1:22 pm

Isn't it Begin who said "The Arabs have the oil but we have the matches"?



daydreamer84
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25 Feb 2013, 1:28 pm

Yeah I do think there's a double standard. I definitely that if jews started preaching war and terror against muslims a bigger deal would be made.



Tequila
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25 Feb 2013, 1:52 pm

daydreamer84 wrote:
I definitely that if jews started preaching war and terror against muslims a bigger deal would be made.


If Jews started preaching terror and hatred against anyone, it would be squelched in double quick time.



Telekon
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25 Feb 2013, 2:20 pm

Tequila wrote:
I'm a supporter of Israel and I would welcome it if the U.S. stopped providing Israel with that tiny amount of financial 'aid' (that is really just an indirect bung to the U.S. military). It would be one less thing that anti-Israel nutjobs could beat Israel with, and I'm absolutely sure that Israel could stand on her own two feet in any case. Israel is rich enough and resourceful enough not to need the 'aid'.


The problem isn't foreign aid, it is AIPAC's stranglehold over Congress. Our politicians grovel before the Israeli lobby every year because they know who butters their bread. Any American politician who criticizes the Israeli lobby is shouted down by the press and asked to resign. The Senate wouldn't confirm Chuck Hagel's nomination because he criticized the Israeli lobby. You have to kowtow to the Israeli lobby here if you want to hold public office.



xenon13
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25 Feb 2013, 6:33 pm

Tequila wrote:
daydreamer84 wrote:
I definitely that if jews started preaching war and terror against muslims a bigger deal would be made.


If Jews started preaching terror and hatred against anyone, it would be squelched in double quick time.



Oh, who would be squelching the Jews?



ruveyn
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25 Feb 2013, 6:40 pm

[quote="xenon13"]This is why Britain and the US serve Israel as they know that if they don't the letter bombs will start being sent to their officials again...[/quote

Always the anti-semite eh?



Tequila
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25 Feb 2013, 7:08 pm

xenon13 wrote:
Oh, who would be squelching the Jews?


If Orthodox Jewish terrorists were the perpetrators behind the kind of behaviour we've seen from some Muslims/Islamists over the last 20 years, I personally would stamp on the beliefs of Judaism (as I do with the beliefs of Islam) if its texts were found to condone and support such segregationism, racism, homophobia, anti-gay and anti-female and terrorist sentiment in my own country. And any a***hole that would shout "Judeophobia" under those kinds of circumstances would get very short shrift from me, just as those that scream "Islamophobia" do today.

Is that simple enough for you?

ruveyn wrote:
Always the anti-semite eh?


I'd be surprised if this:

Image

Wasn't a favourite image somewhere.



ruveyn
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25 Feb 2013, 8:30 pm

xenon13 wrote:
Tequila wrote:
daydreamer84 wrote:
I definitely that if jews started preaching war and terror against muslims a bigger deal would be made.


If Jews started preaching terror and hatred against anyone, it would be squelched in double quick time.



Oh, who would be squelching the Jews?


I would. I consider Jewish terrorist and embarrassment. It is tough enough being a law abiding Jew, and do not need crazies making my life more complicated than it has to be.

ruveyn



Tequila
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25 Feb 2013, 8:52 pm

ruveyn wrote:
I would. I consider Jewish terrorist and embarrassment. It is tough enough being a law abiding Jew, and do not need crazies making my life more complicated than it has to be.


Spot on, mate. :)



0_equals_true
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25 Feb 2013, 11:36 pm

Jewish terrorist groups do have their apologists.

When some come down from a hilltop, and drive into town and vandalize, or attack children on their way to school, or farmers in their fields, it isn't always taken seriously, or dealt with empathy or compassion to the victims.

And the fact that that some of these settlement that house some of these groups aren't illegal, is a sort of nod to these groups.

There is also the issue that they the start out illegal but is some instances, they are granted established settlement status. It is provocative.

It doesn't excuse Palestinian attacks, it just doesn't entertain the moral high ground, or not in those instances.

The other side is groups that want to celebrate terrorist history, such as the bombing of the King David's Hotel by Irgun. In 2006 Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and former members of Irgun attended a conference commemorating this attack that killed 92 people and injured 46, and the reaction to the official complaint shows some hypocrisy, as it still focuses on the reaction of the British rather than the fact that they still committed an atrocity and wouldn't be similarly apologist had it happened to them.

There is also the issue of the fact we have spent the preceding years fighting Jewish oppression in Europe, so it was very much a slap in the face at the time.



Last edited by 0_equals_true on 26 Feb 2013, 12:17 am, edited 1 time in total.

xenon13
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25 Feb 2013, 11:46 pm

Israeli terrorists attacked US targets in Egypt in 1954 and attempted to have Egyptians blamed.



Kraichgauer
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26 Feb 2013, 3:59 am

ruveyn wrote:
xenon13 wrote:
Tequila wrote:
daydreamer84 wrote:
I definitely that if jews started preaching war and terror against muslims a bigger deal would be made.


If Jews started preaching terror and hatred against anyone, it would be squelched in double quick time.



Oh, who would be squelching the Jews?


I would. I consider Jewish terrorist and embarrassment. It is tough enough being a law abiding Jew, and do not need crazies making my life more complicated than it has to be.

ruveyn


Trust me, that's how people of German extraction like myself feel about Hitler and the Nazis. With the exception of insane Antisemites and racists (who are thankfully a minority), most of us feel a need to voice our disgust with our errant cousins in the Fatherland, back in WWII. Especially us Lutherans.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer



JNathanK
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26 Feb 2013, 11:15 am

Well, there have been Jewish terrorists. Its not impossible for anyone to be one. Look up the USS Liberty attack and the King David Hotel bombing.