Is being pro-capitalism a conservative position?

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donnie_darko
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09 Feb 2014, 6:56 am

I think it is because people who are really into capitalism tend to shun government and support more traditional forms of hierarchy, like wealth stratification, inheritance, and favor giving religious charities and big business more power over affairs. I guess I would associate capitalism and neoliberalism with the political right for those reasons. I think that libertarians and neoliberals are essentially anti-democratic which is what characterized most of written history.



GivePeaceAChance
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09 Feb 2014, 7:05 am

part of your statement is true - it is conservative

however, Capitalism tends very much to be hierarchical

(LATIMES) — The 85 richest people on Earth have the same amount of wealth as the bottom half of the population, according to a new report that highlights growing income inequality as political and business leaders gather for the annual World Economic Forum in Davos, Switzerland.

Those wealthy individuals are a small part of the richest 1% of the population, which combined owns about 46% of global wealth, according to the report from British humanitarian group Oxfam International.

Read more at http://www.wnd.com/2014/01/85-richest-p ... Ww8ePPE.99


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09 Feb 2014, 10:29 am

LoveNotHate wrote:

Capitalism works because it recognizes that humans are greedy, and self-interested creatures.

http://money.cnn.com/2012/01/04/news/ec ... d_richest/

Jan 2012 data:
-It only takes $34,000 a year, after taxes, to be among the richest 1% in the world.
-29 million Americans are in the world's 1%


Not ALL people are this way, capitalism fails exactly for the reason you have here, the worst of the lot get the biggest gain taking from the many and not caring about them. It needs to be flushed or eventually around 100 people will own all of the rest of the humans on the planet and kill them at will, they are already doing a pretty heinous job.


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LoveNotHate
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09 Feb 2014, 10:37 am

GivePeaceAChance wrote:
LoveNotHate wrote:

Capitalism works because it recognizes that humans are greedy, and self-interested creatures.

http://money.cnn.com/2012/01/04/news/ec ... d_richest/

Jan 2012 data:
-It only takes $34,000 a year, after taxes, to be among the richest 1% in the world.
-29 million Americans are in the world's 1%


Not ALL people are this way, capitalism fails exactly for the reason you have here, the worst of the lot get the biggest gain taking from the many and not caring about them. It needs to be flushed or eventually around 100 people will own all of the rest of the humans on the planet and kill them at will, they are already doing a pretty heinous job.


The reason wealth is concentrated is because labor unions, socialists, democrats don't want to share the wealth with the very poor people.

Capitalist want free trade that will enrich the world's poor. As shown before, tens of millions of Chinese people are being raised out of poverty by capitalism.

Capitalism is about "sharing the wealth". While socialism is about nationalism, and keeping the wealth for oneself and within one's country.

This is why the labor unions, democrats, socialists want to stop free trade agreements because they don't want to share the wealth.



thomas81
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09 Feb 2014, 11:59 am

LoveNotHate wrote:

The reason wealth is concentrated is because labor unions, socialists, democrats don't want to share the wealth with the very poor people.

Capitalist want free trade that will enrich the world's poor. As shown before, tens of millions of Chinese people are being raised out of poverty by capitalism.

Capitalism is about "sharing the wealth". While socialism is about nationalism, and keeping the wealth for oneself and within one's country.

This is why the labor unions, democrats, socialists want to stop free trade agreements because they don't want to share the wealth.


These are all lies. Under free trade, wealth doesnt 'trickledown', it gravitates to the top.

The wealthy don't share their wealth, they horde it. That is why they are rich. Only socialism shares the wealth.

This is why in the worlds countries hat have liberalised econimies you have a burgeoning majority class of serfs ruled, ostracised and dominated by super wealthy oligarchs. Whether it be from the run down urban deserts of Detroit to the filthy, crowded sky rise tower blocks of Hong Kong and Singapore. The Chinese situation isn't improving in the slightest for the vast majority of Chinese. All that is happening is a huge gap in social divide.


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09 Feb 2014, 1:08 pm

LoveNotHate wrote:

Capitalist want free trade that will enrich the world's poor. As shown before, tens of millions of Chinese people are being raised out of poverty by capitalism.


lel

You mean the Chinese are creating a number of massive market bubbles that are prone to explode any time now.



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09 Feb 2014, 1:49 pm

thomas81 wrote:
LoveNotHate wrote:

The reason wealth is concentrated is because labor unions, socialists, democrats don't want to share the wealth with the very poor people.

Capitalist want free trade that will enrich the world's poor. As shown before, tens of millions of Chinese people are being raised out of poverty by capitalism.

Capitalism is about "sharing the wealth". While socialism is about nationalism, and keeping the wealth for oneself and within one's country.

This is why the labor unions, democrats, socialists want to stop free trade agreements because they don't want to share the wealth.


These are all lies. Under free trade, wealth doesnt 'trickledown', it gravitates to the top.

The wealthy don't share their wealth, they horde it. That is why they are rich. Only socialism shares the wealth.

This is why in the worlds countries hat have liberalised econimies you have a burgeoning majority class of serfs ruled, ostracised and dominated by super wealthy oligarchs. Whether it be from the run down urban deserts of Detroit to the filthy, crowded sky rise tower blocks of Hong Kong and Singapore. The Chinese situation isn't improving in the slightest for the vast majority of Chinese. All that is happening is a huge gap in social divide.


thank you, my head almost exploded at the lies of the post, amazing how much they want to take from us and will tell us how good for us it is to NOT have an organization "trust us we are your BENEVOLENT rulers, we would NEVER hurt you we have your best interests at heart"


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09 Feb 2014, 1:56 pm

thomas81 wrote:
LoveNotHate wrote:

The reason wealth is concentrated is because labor unions, socialists, democrats don't want to share the wealth with the very poor people.

Capitalist want free trade that will enrich the world's poor. As shown before, tens of millions of Chinese people are being raised out of poverty by capitalism.

Capitalism is about "sharing the wealth". While socialism is about nationalism, and keeping the wealth for oneself and within one's country.

This is why the labor unions, democrats, socialists want to stop free trade agreements because they don't want to share the wealth.


These are all lies. Under free trade, wealth doesnt 'trickledown', it gravitates to the top.

The wealthy don't share their wealth, they horde it. That is why they are rich. Only socialism shares the wealth.

This is why in the worlds countries hat have liberalised econimies you have a burgeoning majority class of serfs ruled, ostracised and dominated by super wealthy oligarchs. Whether it be from the run down urban deserts of Detroit to the filthy, crowded sky rise tower blocks of Hong Kong and Singapore. The Chinese situation isn't improving in the slightest for the vast majority of Chinese. All that is happening is a huge gap in social divide.


Not lies ... it seems like simple math to me ...

1, Capitalist will take manufacturing jobs to less expensive countries. Jack Welch, the former CEO of GE is famous for saying, "The theoretical best location to build your product is on a ship so you can dock it into whatever country is the least expensive at the time".

2. Jobs taken away from people generally hurt the people they are taken from, and jobs given to people generally help those that get the jobs.

3. This overall results in "wealth sharing". Wealth is transferred from higher cost person A (American person) to lower cost person B (Chinese person).

Capitalist want to share the wealth. I can empathize with the Socialist. They want to hold onto their high paying jobs. I showed above 29 million Americans are the 1% of wage earners in the world. That is 29 million out of 9 billion people. Capitalists will help address that inequality by moving jobs overseas, lowering the standard of living of people in America and raising the living standard of much, much poorer people.



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09 Feb 2014, 2:03 pm

LoveNotHate wrote:
Not lies ... it seems like simple math to me ...

1, Capitalist will take manufacturing jobs to less expensive countries. Jack Welch, the former CEO of GE is famous for saying, "The theoretical best location to build your product is on a ship so you can dock it into whatever country is the least expensive at the time".

2. Jobs taken away from people generally hurt the people they are taken from, and jobs given to people generally help those that get the jobs.

3. This overall results in "wealth sharing". Wealth is transferred from higher cost person A (American person) to lower cost person B (Chinese person).

Capitalist want to share the wealth. I can empathize with the Socialist. They want to hold onto their high paying jobs. I showed above 29 million Americans are the 1% of wage earners in the world. That is 29 million out of 9 billion people. Capitalists will help address that inequality by moving jobs overseas, lowering the standard of living of people in America and raising the living standard of much, much poorer people.


your equations are faulty - obviously you did not read the article I posted

they are hoarding the weath

just look at the walmart family, they keep the money

they move into a town, people who own their own stores get put out of business go to work for minimum wage and then get out on food stamps and can no longer even afford to have a home anymore and lose it and move to a slum, this is capitalism.


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09 Feb 2014, 2:07 pm

Believing in economic freedom has become conservative because socialists have stolen the term liberal.



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09 Feb 2014, 2:18 pm

Jacoby wrote:
Believing in economic freedom has become conservative because socialists have stolen the term liberal.


"freedom" in that sense, just another word for nothing left to lose


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09 Feb 2014, 2:25 pm

Jacoby wrote:
Believing in economic freedom has become conservative because socialists have stolen the term liberal.


Do we currently have 'economic freedom' under this oh so great system of capitalism(with 'socialist' regulations, since pure capitalism doesn't work)...I don't know I'd question what economic freedom really means and if we even have such a thing.


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09 Feb 2014, 2:40 pm

LoveNotHate wrote:
thomas81 wrote:
LoveNotHate wrote:

The reason wealth is concentrated is because labor unions, socialists, democrats don't want to share the wealth with the very poor people.

Capitalist want free trade that will enrich the world's poor. As shown before, tens of millions of Chinese people are being raised out of poverty by capitalism.

Capitalism is about "sharing the wealth". While socialism is about nationalism, and keeping the wealth for oneself and within one's country.

This is why the labor unions, democrats, socialists want to stop free trade agreements because they don't want to share the wealth.


These are all lies. Under free trade, wealth doesnt 'trickledown', it gravitates to the top.

The wealthy don't share their wealth, they horde it. That is why they are rich. Only socialism shares the wealth.

This is why in the worlds countries hat have liberalised econimies you have a burgeoning majority class of serfs ruled, ostracised and dominated by super wealthy oligarchs. Whether it be from the run down urban deserts of Detroit to the filthy, crowded sky rise tower blocks of Hong Kong and Singapore. The Chinese situation isn't improving in the slightest for the vast majority of Chinese. All that is happening is a huge gap in social divide.


Not lies ... it seems like simple math to me ...

1, Capitalist will take manufacturing jobs to less expensive countries. Jack Welch, the former CEO of GE is famous for saying, "The theoretical best location to build your product is on a ship so you can dock it into whatever country is the least expensive at the time".

2. Jobs taken away from people generally hurt the people they are taken from, and jobs given to people generally help those that get the jobs.

3. This overall results in "wealth sharing". Wealth is transferred from higher cost person A (American person) to lower cost person B (Chinese person).

Capitalist want to share the wealth. I can empathize with the Socialist. They want to hold onto their high paying jobs. I showed above 29 million Americans are the 1% of wage earners in the world. That is 29 million out of 9 billion people. Capitalists will help address that inequality by moving jobs overseas, lowering the standard of living of people in America and raising the living standard of much, much poorer people.


Umm you show a very clear lack of understanding as to what socialism is. Also moving jobs overseas much of the time does NOT result in raising living standards.. there is much neglect of the environment, exploitation of the people who never actually end up seeing an improved quality of life. Perhaps read the book Economic Hit Man or do more reasearch in some of the problems free trade contributes to. Capitalism is sort of a psuedo-survival of the fittest system in which having more wealthy makes you 'fitter' and having less makes you unfit. And you claim Capitalism is about 'sharing the wealth' and Socialism is about essentially greed....think you got things a wee bit backwards.


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09 Feb 2014, 2:50 pm

GivePeaceAChance wrote:
LoveNotHate wrote:
Not lies ... it seems like simple math to me ...

1, Capitalist will take manufacturing jobs to less expensive countries. Jack Welch, the former CEO of GE is famous for saying, "The theoretical best location to build your product is on a ship so you can dock it into whatever country is the least expensive at the time".

2. Jobs taken away from people generally hurt the people they are taken from, and jobs given to people generally help those that get the jobs.

3. This overall results in "wealth sharing". Wealth is transferred from higher cost person A (American person) to lower cost person B (Chinese person).

Capitalist want to share the wealth. I can empathize with the Socialist. They want to hold onto their high paying jobs. I showed above 29 million Americans are the 1% of wage earners in the world. That is 29 million out of 9 billion people. Capitalists will help address that inequality by moving jobs overseas, lowering the standard of living of people in America and raising the living standard of much, much poorer people.


your equations are faulty - obviously you did not read the article I posted

just look at the walmart family, they keep the money

they move into a town, people who own their own stores get put out of business go to work for minimum wage and then get out on food stamps and can no longer even afford to have a home anymore and lose it and move to a slum, this is capitalism.[/



1. The article does not state that those people are capitalists. They could be kings, princes, communist oligarchs, dictators, the King of Brunei, crony-capitalists.

2. Walmart puts American businesses out of business, and provides much, much poorer Chinese people with jobs.

Yes, it will suck. The standard of living in Americans is going to fall dramatically. That is the whole point of "sharing the wealth".

29 million Americans are in the 1% "fat cats" income earners of the world, and all the rest of America is in the top 1/3 of income earners in the world. Yes, it will suck for these 309 million "fat cats" Americans to have to share with the 9 billion people on the world.

Hundreds of millions of people live on only a few dollars per day, and have no car, no phone, none of the multitude of goodies that Americans have.

However, this is humanitarianism and it puts a smile on our face at the end of the day :)



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09 Feb 2014, 2:54 pm

LoveNotHate wrote:
GivePeaceAChance wrote:
LoveNotHate wrote:
Not lies ... it seems like simple math to me ...

1, Capitalist will take manufacturing jobs to less expensive countries. Jack Welch, the former CEO of GE is famous for saying, "The theoretical best location to build your product is on a ship so you can dock it into whatever country is the least expensive at the time".

2. Jobs taken away from people generally hurt the people they are taken from, and jobs given to people generally help those that get the jobs.

3. This overall results in "wealth sharing". Wealth is transferred from higher cost person A (American person) to lower cost person B (Chinese person).

Capitalist want to share the wealth. I can empathize with the Socialist. They want to hold onto their high paying jobs. I showed above 29 million Americans are the 1% of wage earners in the world. That is 29 million out of 9 billion people. Capitalists will help address that inequality by moving jobs overseas, lowering the standard of living of people in America and raising the living standard of much, much poorer people.


your equations are faulty - obviously you did not read the article I posted

just look at the walmart family, they keep the money

they move into a town, people who own their own stores get put out of business go to work for minimum wage and then get out on food stamps and can no longer even afford to have a home anymore and lose it and move to a slum, this is capitalism.[/



1. The article does not state that those people are capitalists. They could be kings, princes, communist oligarchs, dictators, the King of Brunei, crony-capitalists.

2. Walmart puts American businesses out of business, and provides much, much poorer Chinese people with jobs.

Yes, it will suck. The standard of living in Americans is going to fall dramatically. That is the whole point of "sharing the wealth".

29 million Americans are in the 1% "fat cats" income earners of the world, and all the rest of America is in the top 1/3 of income earners in the world. Yes, it will suck for these 309 million "fat cats" Americans to have to share with the 9 billion people on the world.

Hundreds of millions of people live on only a few dollars per day, and have no car, no phone, none of the multitude of goodies that Americans have.

However, this is humanitarianism and it puts a smile on our face at the end of the day :)


those people ARE NOT getting any money they are slaves

the monied interests atr the top are getting it ALL - this is Capitalism

the last time I say it you are obviously ignoring facts


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09 Feb 2014, 3:06 pm

LoveNotHate wrote:
GivePeaceAChance wrote:
LoveNotHate wrote:
Not lies ... it seems like simple math to me ...

1, Capitalist will take manufacturing jobs to less expensive countries. Jack Welch, the former CEO of GE is famous for saying, "The theoretical best location to build your product is on a ship so you can dock it into whatever country is the least expensive at the time".

2. Jobs taken away from people generally hurt the people they are taken from, and jobs given to people generally help those that get the jobs.

3. This overall results in "wealth sharing". Wealth is transferred from higher cost person A (American person) to lower cost person B (Chinese person).

Capitalist want to share the wealth. I can empathize with the Socialist. They want to hold onto their high paying jobs. I showed above 29 million Americans are the 1% of wage earners in the world. That is 29 million out of 9 billion people. Capitalists will help address that inequality by moving jobs overseas, lowering the standard of living of people in America and raising the living standard of much, much poorer people.


your equations are faulty - obviously you did not read the article I posted

just look at the walmart family, they keep the money

they move into a town, people who own their own stores get put out of business go to work for minimum wage and then get out on food stamps and can no longer even afford to have a home anymore and lose it and move to a slum, this is capitalism.[/



1. The article does not state that those people are capitalists. They could be kings, princes, communist oligarchs, dictators, the King of Brunei, crony-capitalists.

2. Walmart puts American businesses out of business, and provides much, much poorer Chinese people with jobs.

Yes, it will suck. The standard of living in Americans is going to fall dramatically. That is the whole point of "sharing the wealth".

29 million Americans are in the 1% "fat cats" income earners of the world, and all the rest of America is in the top 1/3 of income earners in the world. Yes, it will suck for these 309 million "fat cats" Americans to have to share with the 9 billion people on the world.

Hundreds of millions of people live on only a few dollars per day, and have no car, no phone, none of the multitude of goodies that Americans have.

However, this is humanitarianism and it puts a smile on our face at the end of the day :)


Is America the only country with the ability to generate wealth? Anyways I don't see how outsourcing jobs to other countries does anything to help the people here. I don't think it should be entirely banned for there to be some outsourcing, nothing wrong with trying to offer jobs and incomes to people in third world countries....but as it stands now it doesn't seem there is enough regulation to keep abuses like exploiting foriegn workers, neglecting safety conditions on the job and destroying environments/ecosystems so it is kind of a myth that this improves their lives. Sharing the wealth doesn't mean neglect the people here in this country to help Chinese people get wealthier...how then does that wealth continue being shared if it just goes to the Chinese? I can't help but think your idea would lead to the U.S becoming a third world country which I am not so sure would exactly solve anything.


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