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Why is it fair to say Conservatives or Christians areBigots?

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K_Kelly
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02 Jan 2015, 8:44 pm

OK, I'm not a fan either, in fact I'm bothered that the right has become so associated with Christianity. My question is, why can't people just disagree all they want with Conservatives or Christians, but without being nasty or saying they are bigots? Is that really fair? I wonder, it still seems like it happens to Christians and conservatives more than their "opposites". Yelp, I guess I'm a hateful bigot after all.

And why have the traditionalists lost all relevancy with the masses? Don't they have some good points too? Are people who say bad things about conservatives/Christians closed minded? Do you think conservatives are truly bigots?



Dox47
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02 Jan 2015, 9:58 pm

It's not fair, lots of people are just flaming hypocrites.


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andrethemoogle
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02 Jan 2015, 10:15 pm

They're bigots when they discriminate against a group or a person based on their sexuality, religion, gender, social status, etc.

Conservatives the majority of the time tend to fit this, and same with evangelical Christians, who don't actually know much about the religion, but that's another story.



sly279
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02 Jan 2015, 10:43 pm

andrethemoogle wrote:
They're bigots when they discriminate against a group or a person based on their sexuality, religion, gender, social status, etc.

Conservatives the majority of the time tend to fit this, and same with evangelical Christians, who don't actually know much about the religion, but that's another story.


most crhistians don't. just the ones who get on the news and such same with just about any small extremist people the more bad the person is the more screen time they get the more people see them and assume everyone is like that.



Dox47
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02 Jan 2015, 10:49 pm

andrethemoogle wrote:
They're bigots when they discriminate against a group or a person based on their sexuality, religion, gender, social status, etc.

Conservatives the majority of the time tend to fit this, and same with evangelical Christians, who don't actually know much about the religion, but that's another story.


Did you mean to out yourself as a bigot?


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funeralxempire
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03 Jan 2015, 1:52 am

Ultimately many of them are. It's not fair to label all Christians or all political conservatives as bigots, but on a number of issues certain elements self-identify as Christians, self-identify as conservatives and display bigotry towards certain groups. Because other self-identified Christians or other self-identified conservatives fail to challenge their bigoted counterparts it's assumed these views are shared by the entire group.

Why is it fair to call a spade a spade?

sly279 wrote:
andrethemoogle wrote:
They're bigots when they discriminate against a group or a person based on their sexuality, religion, gender, social status, etc.

Conservatives the majority of the time tend to fit this, and same with evangelical Christians, who don't actually know much about the religion, but that's another story.


most crhistians don't. just the ones who get on the news and such same with just about any small extremist people the more bad the person is the more screen time they get the more people see them and assume everyone is like that.


You're both sorta right. The same ones who get media attention often have access to power, so that's what makes them matter and influence people's perceptions.


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Last edited by funeralxempire on 03 Jan 2015, 1:58 am, edited 1 time in total.

Sweetleaf
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03 Jan 2015, 1:58 am

K_Kelly wrote:
OK, I'm not a fan either, in fact I'm bothered that the right has become so associated with Christianity. My question is, why can't people just disagree all they want with Conservatives or Christians, but without being nasty or saying they are bigots? Is that really fair? I wonder, it still seems like it happens to Christians and conservatives more than their "opposites". Yelp, I guess I'm a hateful bigot after all.

And why have the traditionalists lost all relevancy with the masses? Don't they have some good points too? Are people who say bad things about conservatives/Christians closed minded? Do you think conservatives are truly bigots?


It is not fair to say they are all bigots, but it is certainly possible for conservatives and Christians to be bigots, some are.


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luan78zao
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03 Jan 2015, 2:11 am

I'm neither a conservative nor a Christian myself. However, I'd say that it's all about the Narrative. No matter how disastrous the real-world effects of its policies, the Left likes to pretend that it holds the moral high ground. Therefore its enemies, whoever they may be, must be vile, evil, sordid, bigots, Nazis, motivated by hatred of minorities or of the poor.

Anyway it's easier to hang a nasty label on someone than to go to all the trouble of constructing a logical argument against his positions.


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Dox47
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03 Jan 2015, 2:12 am

funeralxempire wrote:
Ultimately many of them are. It's not fair to label all Christians or all political conservatives as bigots, but on a number of issues certain elements self-identify as Christians, self-identify as conservatives and display bigotry towards certain groups. Because other self-identified Christians or other self-identified conservatives fail to challenge their bigoted counterparts it's assumed these views are shared by the entire group.

Why is it fair to call a spade a spade?


Substitute 'Muslim' for 'Christian' and 'terrorist' for 'bigot', and tell me you still support the generalization, especially the failure to condemn equals condoning part.

funeralxempire wrote:
You're both sorta right. The same ones who get media attention often have access to power, so that's what makes them matter and influence people's perceptions.


It seems to me more like the media pays attention to the craziest of the bunch because it gets view/clicks and fits the assumptions of the people who work in media, sorta like how it's always the nut in the tricorn hat that get's interviewed at the Tea Party rally and not the well spoken guy in conventional clothing, or how they always managed to find the dirtiest hippie to film when OWS was around.


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Dox47
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03 Jan 2015, 2:14 am

I also think this guy may be onto something:

I can tolerate anything except the outgroup. It's long, but worth a read.


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funeralxempire
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03 Jan 2015, 2:29 am

Dox47 wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
Ultimately many of them are. It's not fair to label all Christians or all political conservatives as bigots, but on a number of issues certain elements self-identify as Christians, self-identify as conservatives and display bigotry towards certain groups. Because other self-identified Christians or other self-identified conservatives fail to challenge their bigoted counterparts it's assumed these views are shared by the entire group.

Why is it fair to call a spade a spade?


Substitute 'Muslim' for 'Christian' and 'terrorist' for 'bigot', and tell me you still support the generalization, especially the failure to condemn equals condoning part.


If we substitute 'a few' for 'many' and 'terrorist sympathizer' for 'terrorist' I'm on board.

It's not necessarily fair to expect/have to perform constant disavowal, but public perceptions aren't often formed on particularly fair basis.

Dox47 wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
You're both sorta right. The same ones who get media attention often have access to power, so that's what makes them matter and influence people's perceptions.


It seems to me more like the media pays attention to the craziest of the bunch because it gets view/clicks and fits the assumptions of the people who work in media, sorta like how it's always the nut in the tricorn hat that get's interviewed at the Tea Party rally and not the well spoken guy in conventional clothing, or how they always managed to find the dirtiest hippie to film when OWS was around.


I don't disagree with this at all.


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chagya
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03 Jan 2015, 3:32 am

Some Christian Conservatives are. Some Christians and Conservative are, but the are not a majority. They are just very vocal.



Dox47
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03 Jan 2015, 4:01 am

funeralxempire wrote:
If we substitute 'a few' for 'many' and 'terrorist sympathizer' for 'terrorist' I'm on board.

It's not necessarily fair to expect/have to perform constant disavowal, but public perceptions aren't often formed on particularly fair basis.


If you know the perception is unfair, why do you perpetuate it?


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03 Jan 2015, 9:53 am

K_Kelly wrote:
Why Is It Fair To Say Conservatives Or Christians Are Bigots?
Because many of the most vocal of them are bigots. They tend to classify entire groups of people by the behavior of a few, and then demonize (or at least "bad-mouth") those groups to no end despite any and all evidence to the contrary.

This is why I say that it is both fair and just to classify ALL Christians and ALL Conservatives as bigots, because of the behavior of a few of them.



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03 Jan 2015, 10:46 am

No, it's never fair to make sweeping generalizations about any group. Unfortunately, the radicals on both the right and left get the most attention, so it's a common occurrence. I've encountered good Christians who live by the message Jesus taught, and I've encountered the repulsive Michele Bachman type of Christian who use the Bible to justify their prejudices. I also know a few conservatives who are atheists.

Generalizing about an entire group is human. But we possess the intelligence to see the destructiveness of that mindset and evolve.


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03 Jan 2015, 11:26 am

Do you have any suggestions as to how to change the situation? I mean, while I can stop bad-mouthing Christians and Conservatives, there is nothing I've found that seems to get them to at least consider that anyone else's point of view might be at least as valid as their own.