Cultural Appropriation
Today I read an article about what cultural appropriation is. Now I'm wondering, so is it ever ok as a white woman to "use another's culture." E.g. in dress, in music, in language, in movement, etc. There are things I genuinely appreciate from other cultures, but at the same time I don't want to cause pain in anyone.
Then I wonder about the fluidity of culture. Cultures change. One of the reasons cultures change is the result of interaction between cultures and between people and culture. For example, today we see a toga and think Roman. Yet (according to Wikipedia) "The toga was based on a dress robe used by native people, the Etruscans." So the Romans appropriated dress from the Etruscans. Or the fez. We think today of Turkish people wearing the fez, but it actually was a importation from the west. So attributes of different cultures are added and taken away and modified.
I think the underlying issue is that it's about power. Someone of a minority can legitimately look at someone of a majority using something of their culture and see it as an expression of power. The ability to adopt another culture's aspects IS power.
But the solution is not to stick to your own culture in every way and in everything. That would mean putting yourself into a stereotype of whatever culture you're in. The solution is to be empathetic. And if you genuinely appreciate an aspect of another culture, and want to play the instrument, wear the clothes, dance the moves, sing the music, cook the food, etc., then you should find a manner to do it that shows your appreciation and respect for that culture with humility. And doing those actions isn't a right. You should stop if you are causing offense, even unintentionally.
Thoughts??
?
We already had a thread about belly dancing (if thats what you're taking about) a coupla years ago.
My opinion: go ahead and belly dance all that you want.
On the other hand: my life in eighth grade would have been a lot easier if the Western World had not "culturally appropriated" algebra from the Arabs! So in my humble opinion we should start being "sensitive", and let the Arabs keep algebra to themselves. We have been insensitively miss using algebra for seven hundred years now. And it just makes me steamed! But women shaking their hips to music- we can borrow that!
I have no problem with this and in the US I am a minority.
Where I live, actually, I am a minority. Those who are descendants of Tainos and/or Africans (although most are a mix of Tainos Indians/Africans/Spanish and/or other) brought into the island have now been complaining about anyone whom they consider white to be listening and dancing to our folk type music here, go figure. They claim it is the music THEY and their ancestors created, not the Spaniards or whites on the island. However, they also complain and feel we are racist when we listen to Spanish music from Spain. With some people, you just can't win. People need to stop this ridiculous stuff or things will only get worse.
Last edited by whatamess on 21 Oct 2015, 2:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Cultural appropriation is in every single culture and society. It's inescapable. However, I think there's a big difference between sharing a culture, and taking it to use the way you want to use it. Some people seem to forget this and I've seen arguments over white women wearing saris, where many people from India say they love it when people wear them, yet Americans continue to say it's racist/culture appropriation/etc and it shouldn't be done.
One person was getting very mad at white girls wearing saris, saying they couldn't wear it unless she invited them to, but how does she know someone else didn't invite them to wear it? It'd be like someone telling me I can't wear my kimono because they personally didn't invite me, while there have been many Japanese people encourage me to wear it.
Now, wearing something like one of those "native American" costumes for Halloween, especially one with the feathered headress... ugh. Even me with my whole "share cultures" attitude hates the racially stereotyped costumes. We saw a Scotsman outfit where they had shot glass holders sewn into the fly plaid because ya know, Scotsmen are always drunk and it was just one of those things that left a sour taste in my mouth. I can see the humor in it, but I still don't like it. Wasn't as bad as the horned Viking St. Patrick's day helmet I saw. That got me so mad, but then when I complained about it, no one even had a clue as to *why* I was mad... :/ Mom equated it to making a KKK hood with Happy Black History Month on it. These days though, it seems like it's perfectly fine to mess around with cultures as long as they're Northern European.
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Cultural appropriation is one way for societies to advance. If you look at cultures that are closed to the rest of the world, they never succeed. So I would say that, for the most part, this is good.
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Jacoby
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Cultural appropriation doesn't exist because you can't own culture
Cultural appropriation is a concept invented by bleeding heart liberals and their white guilt, our evil racist white crimes should stop us from partaking in any other cultures...
Cultural appropriation proponents are segregationists and racists themselves
Last edited by Jacoby on 21 Oct 2015, 8:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
I've worn barong at Filipine events, hanbok at Korean events, at kilt at Scots events. No one has ever criticized me for it ... except for a few who made fun of my legs in Glasgow ...
Cultural appropriation is one of the dumbest concepts I have ever come across in my life.
As was said by glebel, if your culture spreads and is taken up into other cultures it helps your own culture.
As was said by Jacoby, you can't own culture.
And trying to own culture and restrict other cultures from adopting things from other cultures just means stagnation for all cultures concerned. Even the culture being "protected" will feel this artificial pressure to stick to "their culture" instead of evolving organically with time.
And about the "bleeding heart liberals", oh I know the people you're talking about alright, but such people really aren't liberals. Even if they think they are and tell you that they are. If you Google the word "liberal", the first thing that comes up, well, at least it did for me:
1.
willing to respect or accept behaviour or opinions different from one's own; open to new ideas.
"liberal views towards divorce"
2.
(of education) concerned with broadening a person's general knowledge and experience, rather than with technical or professional training.
That is in direct opposition to those who would believe in the concept of cultural appropriation.
Then I wonder about the fluidity of culture. Cultures change. One of the reasons cultures change is the result of interaction between cultures and between people and culture. For example, today we see a toga and think Roman. Yet (according to Wikipedia) "The toga was based on a dress robe used by native people, the Etruscans." So the Romans appropriated dress from the Etruscans. Or the fez. We think today of Turkish people wearing the fez, but it actually was a importation from the west. So attributes of different cultures are added and taken away and modified.
I think the underlying issue is that it's about power. Someone of a minority can legitimately look at someone of a majority using something of their culture and see it as an expression of power. The ability to adopt another culture's aspects IS power.
But the solution is not to stick to your own culture in every way and in everything. That would mean putting yourself into a stereotype of whatever culture you're in. The solution is to be empathetic. And if you genuinely appreciate an aspect of another culture, and want to play the instrument, wear the clothes, dance the moves, sing the music, cook the food, etc., then you should find a manner to do it that shows your appreciation and respect for that culture with humility. And doing those actions isn't a right. You should stop if you are causing offense, even unintentionally.
Thoughts??
You're right. We White Americans should only stick to White American culture!
American culture meaning:writing in the Roman alphabet, and using the Hindu Arabic number system, worshiping the God of the ancient Hebrews of the Middle East, and speaking a language that is a creole (of Anglo Saxon, Norse, French, and Latin) called "English" (not "American").
Absolutely!
I've read this before and along with it a really good (albeit incredibly long) explanation as to why it's true.
I think a shorter version of my previous post would be "Don't mock/degrade/insult other cultures/people" which goes along with the golden rule of living in general, "Don't be a douchebag."
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Kraichgauer
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We Americans pride ourselves on being a melting pot, with each group coming here leaving their distinct mark on our culture. So appropriate away! We all speak English, even if our people didn't all come from England; everyone has a Christmas tree in December even if they aren't German, and plenty of kids of all races affect the rap culture even if they're not black. Not a damn thing wrong with it.
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Wait, barong is both a knife and a formal shirt? Talk about dressing sharp...
American culture meaning:writing in the Roman alphabet, and using the Hindu Arabic number system, worshiping the God of the ancient Hebrews of the Middle East, and speaking a language that is a creole (of Anglo Saxon, Norse, French, and Latin) called "English" (not "American").
Absolutely!
Exactly!
Furthermore, only americans are allowed to wear denim, only asians should do asian martial arts, only black people should play jazz and blues, no one should ever eat any food from other parts of the world, only indians should ever use the number 0 and eveyone who isn't Swedish should stop playing Minecraft!
...yeah, no.
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Wait, barong is both a knife and a formal shirt? Talk about dressing sharp...
American culture meaning:writing in the Roman alphabet, and using the Hindu Arabic number system, worshiping the God of the ancient Hebrews of the Middle East, and speaking a language that is a creole (of Anglo Saxon, Norse, French, and Latin) called "English" (not "American").
Absolutely!
Exactly!
Furthermore, only americans are allowed to wear denim, only asians should do asian martial arts, only black people should play jazz and blues, no one should ever eat any food from other parts of the world, only indians should ever use the number 0 and eveyone who isn't Swedish should stop playing Minecraft!
...yeah, no.
Wait, does that mean non-black people have to forgo rock and roll and metal as well, since they were influenced by jazz and the blues? I'm not even sure we could keep country music!
And since I don't have any French heritage that I know of, should I not drive a car since the first person who invented the gas engine was French? (Or Belgian... he had a French name...)
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Jacoby
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Wait, barong is both a knife and a formal shirt? Talk about dressing sharp...
American culture meaning:writing in the Roman alphabet, and using the Hindu Arabic number system, worshiping the God of the ancient Hebrews of the Middle East, and speaking a language that is a creole (of Anglo Saxon, Norse, French, and Latin) called "English" (not "American").
Absolutely!
Exactly!
Furthermore, only americans are allowed to wear denim, only asians should do asian martial arts, only black people should play jazz and blues, no one should ever eat any food from other parts of the world, only indians should ever use the number 0 and eveyone who isn't Swedish should stop playing Minecraft!
...yeah, no.
Wait, does that mean non-black people have to forgo rock and roll and metal as well, since they were influenced by jazz and the blues? I'm not even sure we could keep country music!
And since I don't have any French heritage that I know of, should I not drive a car since the first person who invented the gas engine was French? (Or Belgian... he had a French name...)
but where did the guitars and most other instruments come from that made blues and jazz? europe oh no! no music for anyone!