26 Apr 2006, 10:52 am
26 Apr 2006, 7:20 pm
26 Apr 2006, 8:16 pm
26 Apr 2006, 8:20 pm
26 Apr 2006, 8:42 pm
Scaramouche wrote:
The figure for civilian deaths in Iraq has now risen to more than 29,000. If 37% are attributed to the US military, that's 10,730. Since and including the WTC attacks in the USA, almost 6,000 people around the world have been killed by Muslim terrorists. Yep, that's right, the US military is racking up almost twice as many kills against civilians.
However, I know that those deaths caused by the USA military are mostly due to negligence rather than homicidal intent. But I really don't think that difference makes the victims any less dead.
However, I know that those deaths caused by the USA military are mostly due to negligence rather than homicidal intent. But I really don't think that difference makes the victims any less dead.
What you're ignoring here is how many people Sadam Hussein murdered. Is'nt that figure about 400,000???
There's lots of things you post ignores,distorts or fabricates. It's just a propoganda piece.
27 Apr 2006, 8:05 am
Scrapheap wrote:
What you're ignoring here is how many people Sadam Hussein murdered. Is'nt that figure about 400,000???
There's lots of things you post ignores,distorts or fabricates. It's just a propoganda piece.
Actually that was another of the Bush regime's lies. There are indeed mass graves in Iraq. They are filled with the dead from Desert Storm. Mostly those who, at the urging of the USA and allied forces, rose up against Saddam Hussein with the promise of outside assistance. They rose up. They were left to fight unsupported. Saddam Hussein, having now clearly identified rebel elements in Iraq, killed them all. In all, about five thousand corpses. The claims of hundreds of thousands are simply false, which England's Prime Minister Tony Blair admitted.
Quote:
Downing Street has admitted to The Observer that repeated claims by Tony Blair that '400,000 bodies had been found in Iraqi mass graves' is untrue, and only about 5,000 corpses have so far been uncovered.
http://observer.guardian.co.uk/politics ... 30,00.html
http://observer.guardian.co.uk/politics ... 30,00.html
Quote:
Downing Street has admitted to The Observer that repeated claims by [British prime minister] Tony Blair (above) that '400,000 bodies had been found in Iraqi mass graves' is [sic. are] untrue, and only about 5,000 corpses have so far been uncovered.
http://www.fpp.co.uk/online/04/07/Iraq_ ... enied.html
http://www.fpp.co.uk/online/04/07/Iraq_ ... enied.html
Quote:
Prime Minister Tony Blair’s office admitted that he exaggerated the number of bodies found in mass graves throughout Iraq by about 88 percent. The Observer revealed June 18 that its own calculations found that 5,000 bodies have been recovered from 55 gravesites; according to the British publication, Downing Street has confirmed the number. The Observer notes that an additional 215 suspected mass gravesites have yet to be examined and confirmed.
During a joint press conference held by Prime Minister Blair and President George W. Bush last year in London, Blair admonished critics of the countries' actions against Iraq, stating: "When we've already discovered just so far the remains of 400,000 people in mass graves -- there is something bizarre about these situations happening, and people saying that they disagree..."
Blair's claim was widely used as further justification for deposing Saddam Hussein. A graphic report from the US Agency for International Development (USAID) released this January entitled "Iraq’s Legacy of Terror: Mass Graves" features the claim on its first page. A USAID press release dated June 15 also contains Blair's assertion.
http://newstandardnews.net/content/?act ... itemid=717
During a joint press conference held by Prime Minister Blair and President George W. Bush last year in London, Blair admonished critics of the countries' actions against Iraq, stating: "When we've already discovered just so far the remains of 400,000 people in mass graves -- there is something bizarre about these situations happening, and people saying that they disagree..."
Blair's claim was widely used as further justification for deposing Saddam Hussein. A graphic report from the US Agency for International Development (USAID) released this January entitled "Iraq’s Legacy of Terror: Mass Graves" features the claim on its first page. A USAID press release dated June 15 also contains Blair's assertion.
http://newstandardnews.net/content/?act ... itemid=717
Quote:
The number of deaths attributed to Saddam Hussein by the West is incomprehensible. If you add them all up, it seems he killed more people than the number who inhabit Iraq. He had to work overtime and must have had advanced weaponry of which no one is aware.
Numbers and techniques abound: 180,000 during the Anfal campaign (Despite the numbers, not one body has been found. Maybe Saddam had a secret vaporizing ray); 5,000 in Halabja (About 300 bodies were found and there is much doubt as to the origin of the gas used against the Kurds); 400,000 in the south of Iraq.
Let’s talk about the 400,000. In November 2003, word came out that more than 400,000 bodies had been discovered in mass graves in the south of Iraq. "The whole country is a mass graveyard" was the slogan of the day. Finally, proof of Saddam being the Butcher of Baghdad was there for the whole world to see. Case closed.
Let’s go forward a few months from the discovery of the almost half million bodies in the south of Iraq. On July 18, 2004, the headline of the day for the British paper The Independent read, "British Prime Minister Admits Graves Claim Untrue." How could that be? George Bush and Tony Blair don’t lie. If we can’t trust them, who can we trust? Certainly not Saddam, even though he told the truth about WMD. That must have been a fluke.
According to the article:
Downing Street has admitted to The Observer that repeated claims by Tony Blair that "about 400,000 bodies had been found in Iraqi mass graves" is untrue, and only about 5,000 corpses have so far been uncovered.
The claims by Blair in November and December of last year (2003) were given widespread credence, quoted by MPs and widely published, including in the introduction to a U.S. government pamphlet on Iraq’s mass graves.
In that publication, Iraq’s Legacy of Terror: Mass Graves, produced by USAID, the U.S. government aid distribution agency, Blair is quoted from 20 November last year: We’ve already discovered, just so far, the remains of 400,000 people in mass graves."
Here’s what the USAID website stated:
If these numbers prove accurate, they represent a crime against humanity surpassed only by the Rwandan genocide of 1994, Pol Pot’s Cambodian killing fields in the 1970s, and the Nazi Holocaust of World War II.
I assume that USAID did not hear about the two million Iraqis who died at the hands of the U.S.-imposed embargo from 1990-2003. After all, they’re Iraqis: they don’t count.
The same article delved into the regression of other elevated figures attributed to Saddam Hussein and the Ba’ath regime in the north of the country. For instance, it mentioned that Human Rights Watch admitted it had to drastically decrease figures of deaths.
The irony here is that not one person went to the north of Iraq to corroborate the figures. Human Rights Watch and other groups just took the figures given to them as accurate. Hania Mufti, who performed research that produced the original inflated figures in the north stated: "Our estimates were based on estimates. The eventual figure was based in part on circumstantial information gathered over the years."
Imagine even the most lowly offense being tried in a U.S. court system and the prosecutor said that his case was based on estimates of estimates. The case would be dismissed and the judge would reprimand the prosecution for even making a case.
However, this is not so with Iraq. Just say "Saddam did it" and affix a preposterous scenario and figures and it is taken for truth. The blood of millions of Iraqis lies on the hands of these despicable groups and people who have tried to outdo themselves in demonizing Saddam Hussein, the Ba’ath Party, and the Iraqi public in general.
The list is long: Human Rights Watch; Amnesty International; all the foreign-domiciled Iraqi stooges who came back to Iraq after April 2003; with the exception of a few individuals, the entire U.S. government (Democrat and Republican alike); Tony Blair; the U.S. mainstream media; and many, many, many more. They all are involved in the mass murder of millions of Iraqis.
The date of July 18, 2004 should be heralded as much as other dates in world history. It was the date on which the truth about Iraqi mass graves was published. However, not one word appeared in the U.S. press. And, within a day or two, Blair quickly changed directions and came up with other ploys to downplay the announcement that he had lied on a massive scale.
If we take a look at the existing 5,000 bodies, most, if not all, are males of military age. It is probable that many were killed by U.S. bombs in Desert Storm. If you look at a map, you will see that the south of Iraq was heavily bombed in January and February 1991. Add to that the possibility of some bodies being from the Iraqi army that fought the 1991 Shi’ite attempt at overthrowing the Iraqi government and we see that the number of innocent civilians killed by Saddam has quickly decreased from 400,000 to many less than 5,000, if any.
The statement "history is written by the victors" is only partially true in the case of Iraq. Here, fairy tales of the most outrageous kind have been written under the guise of history.
Remember July 18, 2004.
http://iraqwar.mirror-world.ru/article/64041
Numbers and techniques abound: 180,000 during the Anfal campaign (Despite the numbers, not one body has been found. Maybe Saddam had a secret vaporizing ray); 5,000 in Halabja (About 300 bodies were found and there is much doubt as to the origin of the gas used against the Kurds); 400,000 in the south of Iraq.
Let’s talk about the 400,000. In November 2003, word came out that more than 400,000 bodies had been discovered in mass graves in the south of Iraq. "The whole country is a mass graveyard" was the slogan of the day. Finally, proof of Saddam being the Butcher of Baghdad was there for the whole world to see. Case closed.
Let’s go forward a few months from the discovery of the almost half million bodies in the south of Iraq. On July 18, 2004, the headline of the day for the British paper The Independent read, "British Prime Minister Admits Graves Claim Untrue." How could that be? George Bush and Tony Blair don’t lie. If we can’t trust them, who can we trust? Certainly not Saddam, even though he told the truth about WMD. That must have been a fluke.
According to the article:
Downing Street has admitted to The Observer that repeated claims by Tony Blair that "about 400,000 bodies had been found in Iraqi mass graves" is untrue, and only about 5,000 corpses have so far been uncovered.
The claims by Blair in November and December of last year (2003) were given widespread credence, quoted by MPs and widely published, including in the introduction to a U.S. government pamphlet on Iraq’s mass graves.
In that publication, Iraq’s Legacy of Terror: Mass Graves, produced by USAID, the U.S. government aid distribution agency, Blair is quoted from 20 November last year: We’ve already discovered, just so far, the remains of 400,000 people in mass graves."
Here’s what the USAID website stated:
If these numbers prove accurate, they represent a crime against humanity surpassed only by the Rwandan genocide of 1994, Pol Pot’s Cambodian killing fields in the 1970s, and the Nazi Holocaust of World War II.
I assume that USAID did not hear about the two million Iraqis who died at the hands of the U.S.-imposed embargo from 1990-2003. After all, they’re Iraqis: they don’t count.
The same article delved into the regression of other elevated figures attributed to Saddam Hussein and the Ba’ath regime in the north of the country. For instance, it mentioned that Human Rights Watch admitted it had to drastically decrease figures of deaths.
The irony here is that not one person went to the north of Iraq to corroborate the figures. Human Rights Watch and other groups just took the figures given to them as accurate. Hania Mufti, who performed research that produced the original inflated figures in the north stated: "Our estimates were based on estimates. The eventual figure was based in part on circumstantial information gathered over the years."
Imagine even the most lowly offense being tried in a U.S. court system and the prosecutor said that his case was based on estimates of estimates. The case would be dismissed and the judge would reprimand the prosecution for even making a case.
However, this is not so with Iraq. Just say "Saddam did it" and affix a preposterous scenario and figures and it is taken for truth. The blood of millions of Iraqis lies on the hands of these despicable groups and people who have tried to outdo themselves in demonizing Saddam Hussein, the Ba’ath Party, and the Iraqi public in general.
The list is long: Human Rights Watch; Amnesty International; all the foreign-domiciled Iraqi stooges who came back to Iraq after April 2003; with the exception of a few individuals, the entire U.S. government (Democrat and Republican alike); Tony Blair; the U.S. mainstream media; and many, many, many more. They all are involved in the mass murder of millions of Iraqis.
The date of July 18, 2004 should be heralded as much as other dates in world history. It was the date on which the truth about Iraqi mass graves was published. However, not one word appeared in the U.S. press. And, within a day or two, Blair quickly changed directions and came up with other ploys to downplay the announcement that he had lied on a massive scale.
If we take a look at the existing 5,000 bodies, most, if not all, are males of military age. It is probable that many were killed by U.S. bombs in Desert Storm. If you look at a map, you will see that the south of Iraq was heavily bombed in January and February 1991. Add to that the possibility of some bodies being from the Iraqi army that fought the 1991 Shi’ite attempt at overthrowing the Iraqi government and we see that the number of innocent civilians killed by Saddam has quickly decreased from 400,000 to many less than 5,000, if any.
The statement "history is written by the victors" is only partially true in the case of Iraq. Here, fairy tales of the most outrageous kind have been written under the guise of history.
Remember July 18, 2004.
http://iraqwar.mirror-world.ru/article/64041
27 Apr 2006, 11:26 am
27 Apr 2006, 12:04 pm
28 Apr 2006, 5:52 pm
28 Apr 2006, 10:55 pm
28 Apr 2006, 11:37 pm
29 Apr 2006, 2:14 am
29 Apr 2006, 6:09 am
29 Apr 2006, 6:39 am
01 May 2006, 11:35 am
01 May 2006, 11:41 am
Scaramouche wrote:
By negligence, I was referring more to the idea of considering it acceptable to attack targets withni a city when you know you've got a 15% error rate, for example. As in "We aimed for the ammo dump, but if we kill a hundred civilians, well, war is hell, killing civilians happens, and it's just colateral damage..." Not giving a crap and shooting anyway, regardless of civilians being in the area, is negligent homicide.
As for collusion among insurgents, remember that half the time they're attacking each other rather than the invaders.
Maybe they'll be worn down, maybe it'll get worse. Only time will tell, I guess.
As for collusion among insurgents, remember that half the time they're attacking each other rather than the invaders.
Maybe they'll be worn down, maybe it'll get worse. Only time will tell, I guess.
We have learned the hard way. Instead of attacking the village, we are inside the village playing beat cop and developing trust. Over time, we will fall under the umbrella of protection from the community. Nobody will want anything bad to happen to their "bobby"
