Are leftists too harsh towards the average American?

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31 Jan 2018, 11:17 am

Hi all. I think that I've spent enough time criticising the right lately. Today, I want to criticise some of the people on the political left. I want to address a common left-wing phrase that I hear too often.

"The problems with the United States of America come from American culture! We need to tell average Americans that they are the problem!"

I will admit that I have made jokes about stereotypical Americans in the past, but I'm not proud of that. I shouldn't have done that. In the past, I have made some tasteless jokes about "fat, lazy Americans" ... but some liberals seem to take these jokes completely seriously. Sometimes it goes too far. That's what I want to address.

Here is a video that absolutely everyone needs to see.
VVV

TL;DW: This video demonstrates that American laws are entirely made by the upper class. Corruption is fully legal in the United States. As a result, American laws are created by the upper class. As a result, America does not function as a true democracy should.

Of course, this can only mean that average Americans are not responsible for the actions of the US government. Thus, American culture cannot influence US policy. After all, most billionaires are motivated by Nietzschean self-interest, not cultural or religious norms.

This is why America seems so self-contradictory to an objective observer. America is "self-contradictory" because it doesn't even function as a single social entity. The conflict between the American upper class and the American lower classes isn't even an "internal conflict" since the upper class is so separated from the middle and lower classes.

Most Americans are Christian. The American government regularly butchers people in the third world (many of whom are Christian) without informing the average American. The American masses value hard work. The American upper class values parasitic behavior. Additionally, most Americans follow the principles of xenia in a way that would please Zeus himself. Christopher Hitchens pointed this out in his review of Borat.

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/fighting_words/2006/11/kazakh_like_me.html

American culture does have a few definite problems, but most of these problems are, again, caused by the upper class. As I mentioned before in other posts, the American news media is manipulated by corporate donors. This gives Americans an unrealistic worldview.

In other words, the liberals who blame average Americans for the actions of the American elites are confusing cause with effect. The problems with the average Americans are generated by the American upper class, not the other way around.

Thus, we will not solve anything by ranting about how awful the average American is. The average American isn't even responsible for what his government does.

Furthermore, hatemongers exist in other countries too. Canada has Paul Fromm. England has Nick Griffin. Greece has Nikolaos Michaloliakos. I could go on like this all day.

Despite this, Canada has better government policies because anti-corruption legislation makes democracy possible. There are some cultural differences between America and Canada, but these are not causes. They are symptoms.

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LoveNotHate
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31 Jan 2018, 12:01 pm

Worried about Trump-stoked exodus of immigrants, Canada discourages illegal crossings
http://www.latimes.com/local/california ... story.html

Illegal Immigrants Flee To Canadian Border As Trump Cracks Down On Immigration In The U.S.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/andyjsemot ... 83b9a3715a

Pablo Rodriguez, a member of the Canadian Parliament of the "Liberal Party" is discouraging South Americans and Hatians from coming to Canada.

We need to get the word out, Canada has free heath care. Come bring your children, bring your extended family. Get your kids signed up for free Canadian schools, apply for welfare programs, get your family on the free health care ....

Who cares if Americans have an ugly image; it would be a boon to the US to "off-load" needy people to Canada.

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DarthMetaKnight
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31 Jan 2018, 12:17 pm

LoveNotHate wrote:

Good. I'm glad that illegal immigrants are coming to Canada. Why shouldn't people want proper health care?

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ASPartOfMe
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31 Jan 2018, 12:19 pm

DarthMetaKnight wrote:

TL;DW: This video demonstrates that American laws are entirely made by the upper class. Corruption is fully legal in the United States. As a result, American laws are created by the upper class. As a result, America does not function as a true democracy should.

Of course, this can only mean that average Americans are not responsible for the actions of the US government. Thus, American culture cannot influence US policy. After all, most billionaires are motivated by Nietzschean self-interest, not cultural or religious norms.

This is why America seems so self-contradictory to an objective observer. America is "self-contradictory" because it doesn't even function as a single social entity. The conflict between the American upper class and the American lower classes isn't even an "internal conflict" since the upper class is so separated from the middle and lower classes.

Most Americans are Christian. The American government regularly butchers people in the third world (many of whom are Christian) without informing the average American. The American masses value hard work. The American upper class values parasitic behavior. Additionally, most Americans follow the principles of xenia in a way that would please Zeus himself. Christopher Hitchens pointed this out in his review of Borat.

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/fighting_words/2006/11/kazakh_like_me.html

American culture does have a few definite problems, but most of these problems are, again, caused by the upper class. As I mentioned before in other posts, the American news media is manipulated by corporate donors. This gives Americans an unrealistic worldview.

In other words, the liberals who blame average Americans for the actions of the American elites are confusing cause with effect. The problems with the average Americans are generated by the American upper class, not the other way around.

Thus, we will not solve anything by ranting about how awful the average American is. The average American isn't even responsible for what his government does.

Furthermore, hatemongers exist in other countries too. Canada has Paul Fromm. England has Nick Griffin. Greece has Nikolaos Michaloliakos. I could go on like this all day.

Despite this, Canada has better government policies because anti-corruption legislation makes democracy possible. There are some cultural differences between America and Canada, but these are not causes. They are symptoms.

I would go farther than that and would say that the defining feature for a lot of "progressive" "thought" is based on the idea that Americans or at least Americans who do not think like them are racist, sexist, morons and uncultured. They might have different approaches to solving this "problem" from language policing to violence.

Joe Kennedy's Democratic response to the state of the union shows that Dems know they need to appeal to this part of the base. Behind the nice delivery was a crass appeal to class and identity politics.

As much as I am anti Trump I fear that if the predicted Dem "wave" in 2018 and 2020 occurs this will only validate their toxic thoughts and hubris and we will replace one nightmare with another.

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DarthMetaKnight
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31 Jan 2018, 12:53 pm

ASPartOfMe wrote:

As much as I am anti Trump I fear that if the predicted Dem "wave" in 2018 and 2020 occurs this will only validate their toxic thoughts and hubris and we will replace one nightmare with another.

I'm pretty sure that corporate "liberalism" is dead at this point.

Liberalism and leftism aren't totally dead, but the American masses are never going to trust corporate "liberalism" ever again after the repulsive s**t that Hillary Clinton said about Bernie Sanders.

That's one thing that the Trumpers are right about.

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Disconaut
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31 Jan 2018, 7:01 pm

LoveNotHate wrote:

I'm not sure if you're being sarcastic, but please do NOT encourage this. Canadian citizens pay for health care through our income tax, so you are essentially stealing our healthcare and leeching off us. I'm sorry the election didn't go how you wanted it to, but Americans do not have a right to our health care.

Why do Americans treat the world like its own personal buffet?

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31 Jan 2018, 7:38 pm

Disconaut wrote:

Don't be so heartless. Maybe some people need Canada's healthcare to live.

Quote:

Why do Americans treat the world like its own personal buffet?

Hold the phone. There is a huge difference between taking free healthcare when you need it and Western imperialism.

American imperialism exists because the American upper class can manipulate the government as much as it wants. Most American citizens do not knowingly support imperialism. There are a few as*holes who know what the US military is really doing and don't care, but most American militarists sincerely believe that the US government is democratic and, therefore, they believe that the US military exists to protect American liberties.

They're not evil. They're just misinformed. A lifetime of corporate-approved, militaristic indoctrination will do that.

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Disconaut
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31 Jan 2018, 7:49 pm

DarthMetaKnight wrote:

Disconaut wrote:

Don't be so heartless. Maybe some people need Canada's healthcare to live.

Its not heartless. Do you let strangers sleep in your bed, eat your food, and wear your clothes? I'm guessing no. If they need our healthcare, they can apply for citizenship.

Quote:

Its not "free health care". Its paid for with our income taxes. Again, a health care system Americans do not have the right to use. You're displaying typical Americentrism. Canada is not America's backup resource shed. We're our own sovereign nation, and I sincerely hope any American stupid enough to try stealing our healthcare is punished to the fullest extent of the law. Even setting foot in Canada is a privilege, not a right, if you aren't Canadian.

I really don't care the election didn't go your way. It's not Canada's problem, and neither is your broken healthcare system. How about you try and fix it instead of leeching off of us?

Also - have fun even trying this. You seem to think its easy, but where are you going to get a provincial health insurance card as an American? You can visit the ER without it, but you will have no medical records or Canadian birth certificate. The police will then be called, and you will be taken back to the USA, where you will likely be punished. And rightfully so.

Canada has humanitarian aid programs. Just not for Americans.

LoveNotHate
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31 Jan 2018, 8:35 pm

Disconaut wrote:

DarthMetaKnight wrote:

Disconaut wrote:

Don't be so heartless. Maybe some people need Canada's healthcare to live.

Its not heartless. Do you let strangers sleep in your bed, eat your food, and wear your clothes? I'm guessing no. If they need our healthcare, they can apply for citizenship.

They don't have to apply for citizenship.

They can say "I seek asylum".

Last year, "According to the Canadian government, 9,335 people made asylum claims at land ports of entry between January and October, including those picked up after crossing the border from the United States at unauthorized locations. That is more than double the average of annual claims made from 2011 through 2016.".
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national ... fdce85179c

"More than 20,000 asylum seekers crossed the border from the US in 2017 over fears of being deported by the Trump administration"
https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/91 ... -arrive-US

So, the number of Canadian "asylum seekers" has gone way up, since Trump took office.

One worry for Canadian immigration is that the 250,000 Haitians and El Salvadorians that Trump ordered to leave the US -- will flee to Canada.

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Last edited by LoveNotHate on 31 Jan 2018, 8:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.

DarthMetaKnight
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31 Jan 2018, 8:50 pm

Disconaut wrote:

You're displaying typical Americentrism.

Apparently you haven't seen my post history. I have no allegiance to any country because every government currently in existence is illegitimate. I stand for humanity and humanity alone. Several people on this site actually consider me to be an anti-American hatemonger.

People who are on the verge of death have the right to save their own lives by any means necessary. That's a fact. That's a universal human right.

Quote:

Canada is not America's backup resource shed. We're our own sovereign nation, and I sincerely hope any American stupid enough to try stealing our healthcare is punished to the fullest extent of the law.

Canada, much like America and Australia, was created by murdering indigenous people. Same s**t, different as*hole.

Quote:

Even setting foot in Canada is a privilege, not a right, if you aren't Canadian.

The white bois who murdered Canada's indigenous people were British. I guess that they had no right to do what they did.

Quote:

I really don't care the election didn't go your way. It's not Canada's problem, and neither is your broken healthcare system. How about you try and fix it instead of leeching off of us?

America will never have universal health care until the American Anti-Corruption Act is passed. Several innocent people will die of preventable diseases before that happens.

Quote:

Also - have fun even trying this. You seem to think its easy, but where are you going to get a provincial health insurance card as an American? You can visit the ER without it, but you will have no medical records or Canadian birth certificate. The police will then be called, and you will be taken back to the USA, where you will likely be punished. And rightfully so.

Canada has humanitarian aid programs. Just not for Americans.

Thank you for demonstrating that Canadian patriotism is just as vile and revolting as any other sort of patriotism. We humans all belong to the same species. Patriotism is a cancer that blinds us and allows billionaire elites to rule over us and kill us.

You are no better than Donald Trump.

"For example, take Suharto's Indonesia, which is a brutal, murderous state. I think Canada was supporting it all the way through, because it was making money out of the situation. And we can go around the world. Canada strongly supported the US invasion of South Vietnam, the whole of Indochina. In fact Canada became the per capita largest war exporter, trying to make as much money as it could from the murder of people in Indochina. In fact, I'd suggest that you look back at the comment by a well known and respected Canadian diplomat, I think his name was John Hughes, some years ago, who defined what he called the Canadian idea, namely 'we uphold our principles but we find a way around them'. Well, that's pretty accurate. And Canada is not unique in this respect, maybe a little more hypocritical."
- Noam Chomsky

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31 Jan 2018, 11:02 pm

DarthMetaKnight wrote:

People who are on the verge of death have the right to save their own lives by any means necessary. That's a fact. That's a universal human right.

Uhh... organ stealing is cool with you?

Just checking, I may need spare parts one day.

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DarthMetaKnight
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31 Jan 2018, 11:35 pm

Mikah wrote:

DarthMetaKnight wrote:

People who are on the verge of death have the right to save their own lives by any means necessary. That's a fact. That's a universal human right.

Uhh... organ stealing is cool with you?

Just checking, I may need spare parts one day.

Well ... If I had to kill somebody in order to avoid an early death, I'd probably kill somebody.

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31 Jan 2018, 11:59 pm

DarthMetaKnight wrote:

Mikah wrote:

DarthMetaKnight wrote:

People who are on the verge of death have the right to save their own lives by any means necessary. That's a fact. That's a universal human right.

Uhh... organ stealing is cool with you?

Just checking, I may need spare parts one day.

Well ... If I had to kill somebody in order to avoid an early death, I'd probably kill somebody.

And that's a universal human right?

Well if immigrants, refugees, border hoppers and other undesirables are putting strain on their health system to the point where Canadians are dying due to lack of healthcare provision, then Canadians can shoot on sight.

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Last edited by Mikah on 01 Feb 2018, 12:01 am, edited 1 time in total.

auntblabby
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01 Feb 2018, 12:00 am

I believe the bulk of leftists are disgusted at the bloody-minded naiveté [voting for pols they believe hate the same people they do] of so many non-upper-class righties in amuuurica who think that the GOP really has their best interests at heart, when in fact they are just tools in the GOP's ultimately unpatriotic plans to make this a banana republic.

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03 Feb 2018, 5:52 pm

If the left insults the average American, the average American won't vote for them.

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auntblabby
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03 Feb 2018, 8:53 pm

no leftist has openly insulted this lefty average amuuurican.

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