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TW1ZTY
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29 Dec 2018, 7:46 am

That every time the US commits war crimes on civilians or POWs they somehow get away with it?

I think that's the one thing I truly hate about my own country. We never get held accountable for the horrible and cruel things we do during times of war and Americans NEVER feel any guilt over it. They either deny it or they say crap like "Well we saved countless lives by ending the war that way!". :roll:

I think Americans always get their way by being bullies and our own culture borders on narcissism. Sometimes I really am ashamed to be an American. :|



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29 Dec 2018, 8:14 am

It's okay, I don't hold it against you, personally.
But that's the part I really like about German history: that the German federal republic was born out of undeniable catastrophe, which makes the Germans a bit more careful .... they have been so wrong before, they know what being wrong can lead to.
The rest of the world somehow interprets German history as some kind of transcendent evil that came over the Germans. But that's wrong. They thought they were right and acted accordingly.


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TW1ZTY
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29 Dec 2018, 9:05 am

shlaifu wrote:
It's okay, I don't hold it against you, personally.
But that's the part I really like about German history: that the German federal republic was born out of undeniable catastrophe, which makes the Germans a bit more careful .... they have been so wrong before, they know what being wrong can lead to.
The rest of the world somehow interprets German history as some kind of transcendent evil that came over the Germans. But that's wrong. They thought they were right and acted accordingly.


I feel the same way about Japan too. I'm glad that both countries were able to eventually rebuild after the war. :)



envirozentinel
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29 Dec 2018, 9:12 am

The Japanese can have a laugh every time an American drives a Toyota!

On a more serious note I love the way Hiroshima and Nagasaki were rebuilt and especially the peace park in Hiroshima. A beautiful city.


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TW1ZTY
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29 Dec 2018, 9:18 am

envirozentinel wrote:
The Japanese can have a laugh every time an American drives a Toyota!

On a more serious note I love the way Hiroshima and Nagasaki were rebuilt and especially the peace park in Hiroshima. A beautiful city.

I never knew they were able to rebuild those cities after what happened That really makes me feel better. :D



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29 Dec 2018, 9:35 am

Google them to see how beautiful they are.


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TW1ZTY
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29 Dec 2018, 9:48 am

I just looked at an article about Hiroshima and it does indeed look beautiful. That makes me happy. :D

I hope that nothing like that bombing ever happens again.



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29 Dec 2018, 7:25 pm

Quote:
I feel the same way about Japan too. I'm glad that both countries were able to eventually rebuild after the war


uhm... take a look at the way japan is dealing with its war crimes .... I'm not sure if they learn much about the rape of Nanjing in school, in the way germans get treated to holocaust documentaries from age 12 or so.

I saw paintings showing the massacre in the Chinese national gallery, but nothing speaking about the things the Japanese did when I was in Japan. - yes, atomic bomb memorials, but these are museums for the atrocities someone else inflicted on them. Not museums of how awful they have been to others.
they have this shrine for kamikaze pilots, which the prime minister visits every year... Imagine Angela Merkel visiting a chapel dedicated to SS troops .... imagine such a chapel even existing!

And ... Japan has the world's 4th most powerful army, and the world's 8th largest defense budget (says wikipedia).


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TW1ZTY
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29 Dec 2018, 7:37 pm

shlaifu wrote:
Quote:
I feel the same way about Japan too. I'm glad that both countries were able to eventually rebuild after the war


uhm... take a look at the way japan is dealing with its war crimes .... I'm not sure if they learn much about the rape of Nanjing in school, in the way germans get treated to holocaust documentaries from age 12 or so.

I saw paintings showing the massacre in the Chinese national gallery, but nothing speaking about the things the Japanese did when I was in Japan. - yes, atomic bomb memorials, but these are museums for the atrocities someone else inflicted on them. Not museums of how awful they have been to others.
they have this shrine for kamikaze pilots, which the prime minister visits every year... Imagine Angela Merkel visiting a chapel dedicated to SS troops .... imagine such a chapel even existing!

And ... Japan has the world's 4th most powerful army, and the world's 8th largest defense budget (says wikipedia).



Do Americans bother to teach students about the rape and torture of naked Iraqi POWs in Abu Ghraib? Most Americans I know seem to pretend like that never happened, and it happened not long ago at all.

And knowing how the news in my country lies I'm positive that's not the only time the US ever did things like that.

At least Japan got punished for what they did.



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29 Dec 2018, 8:07 pm

But you are right about Japan because racism and xenophobia is still pretty bad there. They should feel more guilty about the things they did, but I think that having their country almost completely destroyed by bombs was enough to scare them into becoming the peace loving country that they are today.

To be perfectly and brutally honest I wish something like that would happen and scare the US out of being so gung-ho about war and violence all the time. I believe that's the only way my country will ever change. It's horrible but it's the truth.



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29 Dec 2018, 8:11 pm

America thinks it can do no wrong, if you say anything negative you are "Unpatriotic"
Because apparently not loving a line someone drew in the sand you happened to be born in is a bad thing?

I hate this place to.


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TW1ZTY
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29 Dec 2018, 8:14 pm

Arganger wrote:
America thinks it can do no wrong, if you say anything negative you are "Unpatriotic"
Because apparently not loving a line someone drew in the sand you happened to be born in is a bad thing?

I hate this place to.

I don't hate this country so much as I do the government and some of our countrymen. I would love it if things changed for the better.



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30 Dec 2018, 12:23 am

TW1ZTY wrote:
We never get held accountable for the horrible and cruel things we do during times of war and Americans NEVER feel any guilt over it.


Well if it makes you feel better, here's one American who DOES feel guilty over it. Having grown up in the Middle East most of my life, and now having Iraqi and Afghan friends who are in the US because of threats to their lives, I feel physically sick whenever I think about America's war crimes. And any other regime or terrorist group's war crimes for that matter. It's just especially painful and embarrassing when it happens to be my own country. :cry:


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TW1ZTY
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30 Dec 2018, 12:35 am

Galadnarthiel wrote:
TW1ZTY wrote:
We never get held accountable for the horrible and cruel things we do during times of war and Americans NEVER feel any guilt over it.


Well if it makes you feel better, here's one American who DOES feel guilty over it. Having grown up in the Middle East most of my life, and now having a lot of Iraqi and Afghan friends who are now in the US because of threats to their lives, I feel physically sick whenever I think about America's war crimes. And any other regime or terrorist group's war crimes for that matter. It's just especially painful and embarrassing when it happens to be my own country. :cry:


It actually does make me feel better. I wish I knew more Americans like you outside of the internet. :)

I think that the first time I ever truly felt ashamed of my country was when I learned about what happened in Abu Ghraib several years ago. That was such a monsterous thing to do and I felt that our soldiers who did that twisted evil s**t should have been executed for it. But then when I try to talk about it every other American just blows it off like they just don't give a damn. Just like they do every other war crime we commit. We brag about being a country that treats everybody fairly and humanely compared to every other country on the planet and I learned a long time ago that is NOT true and never has been. :(



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30 Dec 2018, 4:42 am

TW1ZTY wrote:
That every time the US commits war crimes on civilians or POWs they somehow get away with it?

I think that's the one thing I truly hate about my own country. We never get held accountable for the horrible and cruel things we do during times of war and Americans NEVER feel any guilt over it. They either deny it or they say crap like "Well we saved countless lives by ending the war that way!". :roll:

I think Americans always get their way by being bullies and our own culture borders on narcissism. Sometimes I really am ashamed to be an American. :|

Japanese weren’t held accountable either. Neither were a lot of horrible nazis.
Worlds a horrible place that needs horrible people to keep going it seems.
We couldn’t hold the Japanese accountable cause we needed them for the Cold War.
Same reason we didn’t hold nazis accountable.
Difference is the Japanese don’t feel they did anything wrong and honor war criminals. Germans today don’t honor nazis and are accepting of their past crimes.



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30 Dec 2018, 4:45 am

Arganger wrote:
America thinks it can do no wrong, if you say anything negative you are "Unpatriotic"
Because apparently not loving a line someone drew in the sand you happened to be born in is a bad thing?

I hate this place to.

Japan’s the same way, Same for some European nations, Russia, China. He’ll china will lock you up for being unpatriotic or suggesting they don’t own the whole China sea.
Using google gps on your phone is a crime as it uses the United Nations maps that only allow claim 200 miles off th coast. China claims international waters.