Aspie theologians and religious leaders?

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I'm wondering if anyone knows of any theologians or religious leaders that were likely to have had Aspergers? It seems that I can find plenty of scientists or engineers that are either diagnosed aspies orlikely aspies, but I can't think of any aspie theologians. The thing is that I have little interest in science or computers beyond the pragmatic level (yes, I know that is blasphemy to some! ), but one of my obsessions is religion and religious philosophy because it relates to the ultimate meaning of things and to the human experience. So I guess that I am seeking reassurance that I'm not the only aspie with an obsession dealing with religion and religious philosophy.

I can't say I know about any Aspie theologians, but you're definitely not the only one interested in religion-- I've been into it for as long as I can remember! It really sort of ties back into everything, doesn't it?

I believe that Rabbis who wrote talmud were aspies because they were worried about all the detailes of do-s and don't-s and were missing out on the emotional aspects of things. Just to give you one example, in Old Testament there is a verse that you shouldn't cook a certain animal in their own mother's milk. This can be interpretted as a humanistic statement. However, rabbis decided that it must mean that you can't combine meat and milk and eventually they brought it far enough to saying htat you are not allowed to eat meat untill 4 hours after milk, and you can't allowed to eat milk products untill 6 hours after meat. Another example would be Sabbath. Original intention of sabbath is to rest. However, Jews designed a lot of rules associated with it, such as you can't write on Sabbath or use phone, or turn light on or off, etc. This totally destroyed emotional meaning of the holiday and in fact it turned it into even harder work than the work you would do on a daily basis.

By the way, it is also interesting that Jews rock back and forth during prayers, just like autistics do. So it is possible that may be some of the autistic rabbis interpretted their neurological need for rocking as divine, and thus taught the rest of the jews to do the same. I think it is interesting to think simultaneously about legalism AND rocking. Just think about it: two separate autistic traits, legalism and rocking, are present in the same religion which makes it seem like more than just coincidence.

By the way, as far as scientists goes, a lot of them, including Einstein, are of Jewish heritage. In fact, according to stats, 50% of noble prize winners in science are either Jewish or half Jewish. his leads me to say that may be the Jewish people are genetically predesposed to beling aspies. Therefore the two Jewish dominated fields, that is science and Judaism, are both influenced by autistic simptoms.

I have read that statistics shows that autistic people have larger brain than normal people. Likewise, I have read that Jews have larger brain size (and higher IQ) than other races, which shows yet another parallel. It is also interesting to explore the generalization of this line of thought and to say that perhaps all races are affected by Asperger's and the ones with larger brains are affected more. In this case, the explanation for higher IQ of races with larger brain would NOT be a naive statement of bigger means better, but rather it would be a statement that higher IQ is merely a side-benefit of asperger. This would also mean that smaller brain races, such as blacks, are ultra-NT. The fact that Africa is mostly third world fit right in with Temple Granding's statement that "if there were no aspies we would still live in caves". On the other hand, due to the fact that they are ultra-NT they are the ones who invented Jazz. I imagine aspies would NOT enjoy Jazz too much due to their sensory problems.

We can also apply this same theory to men verses women. Men have bigger brains than women and this is what makes men more autistic then women. Therefore, due to this, men are better in sciences than women are. On the other hand, men are WORSE with people and in humanities due to their autism. By the way, it is interesting to note how, due to men's autism, women are generally better in humanities but AT THE SAME TIME men are better in religion. Why is that? Probably because christianity and islam are judeo-based religions, so, since judaism is founded by autistic, the other two religions have "inheretted" autism, hence all three religions are more palattable to autistic male brain.

Jesus...Ghandi...Mohammed...Confucious... the list goes on.

I would imagine that the majority of religious leaders are Narcissists. (This has been my personal experience) It's a cheap and easy route to achieve status within a society.

I disagree that Judaism has anything to do with AS. I think the high proportion of Jewish scientists has to do with the value placed on education by many Jews. Historically, the most righteous thing for religious Jews to do was study...which could carry over to the sciences. Have you met a lot of Jewish aspies? I'm not trying to be a smartass here, just wondering.
...and civilization did begin in Africa, didn't it? Give it some credit! Colonialism and the slave trade certainly didn't help it any...you seem to be relating a lot of world events to AS, but I just don't think it applies to the situation.

Jews didn't have access to education untill this century, due to the antisemitism. I believe Felix Anderson, in 19-th century, was one of the first Jews who encouraged the rest of Jewish community to get some education at the cost of assimilation.

You can still argue that the TORAH education was high priority for the Jews and htis is what set up a context for them to enjoy studying sciences as well once the apportunity arose. But in this case, this still leaves a room for my argument that the REASON torah education became such a high priority for them is that their culture is founded by autistics.

By the way, I have asked one of the rabbis whom I know how much education does he have. It turns out that he doesn't even know what is square root. He only went to elementary school, and that was it. However, he took IQ online and he got it between 140 and 150. So, the only reason for him to do so well is his genetics.



Well, I am one of them (even though I believe in Jesus, I am 100% Jewish genetically) . Also, my mom's friend's son is also Jewish aspi.

Moving on to well known ppl, Albert Einstein is Jewish aspi. In fact, a lot of famous ppl who are aspies, are also Jewish.



If civilization began in Africa, it gives credit to Africa as a continent, as opposed to people who live there. Now, one way it gives credit to Africa as a continent is that in Africa the living conditions are the easiest, hence it was the place where survival was most likely. Now, this very thing is the reason why blacks are less intelligent -- due to such a favorable environment for a living, they don't have as much of a natural selection pressures as do white people, who reside in cold Europe. This also explains why jews are more intelligent -- due to antisemitism, Jews experience A LOT of natural selection, hence only the smartest ones survive.

Now, it might seem that natural selection and autism are two totally different explanations. The way the two fit together is this. Natural selection doesn't make anyone smart. There is something ELSE that make you smart or stupid. Natural selection simply kills off everyone who ENDED UP being stupid leaving only ppl who are smart. Now, if you ask WHY certain ppl ended up being smart or stupid, there are a lot of factors involved, and one of them is autism.




Colonism and slave trade only started few centuries ago. On the other hand the fact that most of the civilization was in Europe goes back to millenia.

You should also realize that Jews were even more persecutted and for longer period of time. However, Jews ended up being smart while blacks just the opposite.

To many generalizations. Some, less, more, many, most, other, all. Those are words that can be used to make a statement more defined. I have met people of all ethicities that are intelligent. Intelligence is not a measure of only reason, logic, comparison and judgment. It is also a measure of experience, sympathy, and compassion. Who is to say that someone of a particular epidermal spectral frequency is more or less aware? Perhaps differentials in education may be due to cultural malfeasance. Let us as a people attempt to see reason behind our beliefs.

Last edited by VesicaPisces on 30 Jul 2006, 2:03 pm, edited 2 times in total.

I never said anything about ALL people of particular ethnicity. I am only talking about statistics. I for one know at least two black people who are very intelligent. So I am only talking about averages and not about individual members of any race.

As far as culture influencing education, I agree. However, if you think about it, it doesn't negate the biological component. After all, culture is created by people. So you can argue the opposite and say that due to people's biologies they chose to create a low culture which ultimately caused negative impact on education of tehir children's children.

Roman, okay...you keep saying that black people are less intelligent, and I find that really offensive. Are you assuming all the people on this site are white, or do you just not care? You said yourself that you know some intellegent black people...and this doesn't make you question your assumptions? I'm Jewish too, and while I agree that there are a lot of smart Jews, I can also tell you that I've met a lot of Jewish people who also happen to be really dumb. How do generalizations help anyone? Also note that in the religion poll on this site, most people are agnostic or christian.

The thing is that if something is offensive it doesn't mean it isn't true. When Galileo said that the earth revolves around sun it was also offensive.



Yes I assumed that everyone here is white. I am sorry about it. I guess it is just psychological thing, I simply assumed it without noticing that I did. Thanks for pointing it out though.



My point is that the AVERAGE black person is less intelligent than AVERAGE white. This does NOT mean that every single black person is less intelligent than every single white person.

Okay, think of it this way. Suppose I am asked to pick 1000 random numbers between 0 and 10. You are asked to pick 1000 random numbers between 1 and 11. In this case, the average of the numbers that I picked is 5, while the average of the numbers that you picked is 6. This means that ON AVERAGE your numbers are greater than mine. HOWEVER, it is wrong to say that every single number that you picked is greated than every single number that I picked. On the contrary, from time to time I pick 10 and you pick 1, and 10 is WAY WAY greater than 1. But it doesn't change the fact that ON AVERAGE my numbers are less than yours.

Let me give you another example. Suppose we want to see who is taller -- the average person over 50 or the average person under 50. Most likely, the average person over 50 will be taller due to the fact that among people under 50 we have a lot of little babies who will lower the average height. However, it is wrong to say that every single person over 50 is taller than every single person under 50 -- after all, we have no reason for saying that 60 year olds are taller than 30 year olds.

The point I am trying to make is that there is a difference between comparison of averages and comparison of individuals. So, ON AVERAGE whites are smarter than blacks. However, as far as indivicuals go, you there are plenty of smart blacks and plenty of stupid whites. So individuals should be judged as individuals, regardless of their race.



Like I said, I am only talking about AVERAGE Jew. The fact that AVERAGE Jew is smart leaves a lot of room for INDIVIDUAL Jews beind damn.



But the point is that I am not trying to "help anyone". I am theorist, so I like to invent all kinds of theories without worrying about their usefulness. This whole black verses white thing is simply my love of theorizing. I am NOT advocating any of its applications -- I do NOT agree with any kind of racial discrimination. Like I said since there are black individuals that are smart, it would be unfair to discriminate against blacks. However, it is interesting to talk about statistics just from theoretical perspective.



Since Jews are a minority, I won't be offending the majority by making them look "better". In fact, a large segment of Christians are zionists, and they are more than happy to say that Jews are smarter than others. Now, I am aware that you might say that some of the other "kind" of christians are antisemitic. But in this case, by your own logic, respecting antisemitism is an offensive thing to do.

I still disagree with you, but since you don't seem to be presenting these ideas as facts, I really don't see the point of arguing it further. I don't see the point of useless theories (your words) either. To me, the end point of our thinking should be to help ourselves or others, not just random speculation. That's my own philosophy, you don't need to agree with it. Just remember-- 99% of statistics are made up on the spot!
Magus, sorry the thread has diverged! Does anyone have some info to get it back on track?

Well, in this case, there won't be any practical use in knowing whether or not there are any aspi theologians, which means that this whole thread would be pointless.

Now, just to track things back, my speculation about races tides with the subject of the thread because I started out by saying how the rabbis who wrote talmud are aspies. I included the rest in order to show how I can encorporate this, together with a lot of other things, into a nice theory which makes it even more interesting.

Black people are slower than white people. They forgot we gave them their rights back with the Emancipation Proclamation in 1863. We reminded them in 1866, 1871, 1875, 1957, 1960, 1964, 1968, 1991, and now that Strom Thurmond and the racists are dead... they still haven't got the picture! They have more rights now than they have in 400 years and they still cry racism at the drop of a dime.

I may study theology in the university when I graduate next year.

I may be an aspie theologian. I study theology and I think I am an aspie (try to get diagnosed this time). I have also wondered if there were others.

Ok, seriously, what is with all this eugenicist bull I keep hearing? Jews are smart, blacks are dumb... NONSENSE. Look, Roman, the same mentality you are now promoting was once used to justify attempts to exterminate you and your entire race. We can both agree that that is not a good thing. So let me make this clear- the amount of melanin in one's skin is NOT related in any way to intelligence. Blacks, Jews, Asians, whites like myself... there is no group difference whatsoever. I am white, and am much more intelligent than the average black, Jew, or Asian. That doesn't mean whites in general are more intelligent, and there are certainly plenty of blacks and Jews who are smarter than myself. The group differences we see in standardised test scores or IQ are partly due to cultural bias in the design of the test, and partly due to the self-fulfilling prophecies we make concerning a particular person. In short, a person who is expected to behave like an idiot will generally do so. Don't try to chalk this up to a supposed racial inferiority, or you begin to tread a dangerous path.