True Beliefs Have No Survival Value?

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I recently read an argument by Alvin Plantinga against belief in Naturalism & Evolution, the crux of which lay in the idea that "true beliefs as such have no survival value." It is only our behavior that must have survival value and many untrue beliefs could also lead to survival behavior.

He suggested that evolution, acting only on behavior, would result in true beliefs less than half of the time since there are so many beliefs other than the true beliefs that could result in survival behavior. Therefore, if you believe in Naturalism & Evolution you are probably wrong in your belief since the mechanism that got you to that belief would only produce true beliefs less than half the time.

Last edited by spdjeanne on 29 Nov 2007, 1:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

But wouldn't you probably be wrong for the same reasons that evolution is probably wrong?

By beliefs, are you talking about religious values?

Only if you believe I'm just a product of Naturalism & Evolution. What if Naturalism & Evolution are not the only ways to see the world?

No, I'm talking about everyday beliefs. I could believe that rain is the venom of evil spirits and that I shouldn't go out in it or it might kill me. I could also believe that if I go out in the rain I might get cold and my immune system won't work as well leaving me susceptible to diseases that could kill me. Either way, I won't go out in the rain and I probably won't get sick and die. Why should evolution favor one of these beliefs over the other if they both result in the same behavior?

If you're saying that what you believe doesn't really matter in whether or not something is true, I agree there. Thoughts in themselves don't control what is and isn't.

I'm not saying anything. I'm trying to discuss an argument I read recently by a guy named Plantinga against the belief in Naturalism & Evolution.

so, like ... If you believe that your lucky rabbit's foot is imbued with cosmic energy, it may make you more confident and likely to perservere and succeed?

Yes, like any belief that will make you behave in a way that makes it more likely that you survive.

Evolution doesn't select for true beliefs, only survival behavior. Therefore, if you believe you are a product of evolution, how can you be so sure your beliefs in Naturalism and Evolution are true since evolution does not select for true beliefs?

Maybe it will help this topic if I voice a little of my opinion. I don't agree that evolution does not select for true beliefs. People are tool users and in order to make technology effective, we must have a basic understanding of cause and effect, which requires beliefs that are somewhat true. Our survival has been so entwined with our use of technology that true beliefs have to have some survival value.

You truly believe in your friends, they truly believe in you, and you form a cohesive team.

You have faith and confidence that you will succeed, from believing in something perhaps.

Humans are generalists - they can do so many things. The idea of evolution (or perhaps more accurately, competitive exclusion in ecology) is based on niches. Different niches favor different beliefs.

And there's time scale - some behaviors/beliefs may be adaptive in the short term, but not so good long term. Presumably, strength is always fairly good, but aggressiveness can backfire over time when people figure a person/culture out.

OK, so far nobody has had any reaction to the actual argument that I stated at the beginning of this thread as to why it is improbable that Naturalism & Evolution is a true belief if we are a product of Naturalism and Evolution.

how can believing something make something happen?

What does this have to do with Plantinga's argument against Naturalism & Evolution?

Everyone acts on their beliefs. Sometimes our beliefs are very different but we end up doing the same thing. The point is that evolution only acts on behavior not on belief and so does not select for the truth of belief only the effectiveness of the behavior resulting from it. Therefore, Evolution does not make it likely that people believe things that are likely to be true. It only makes it likely for people to believe things likely to help them behave in a way so that they will survive.

IF Evolution generates people who believe things that are unlikely to be true, then if we are a product of evolution, isn't our belief in evolution also unlikely to be true?