Board index › Topical Discussion › Politics, Philosophy, and Religion

Question for all whom revolve around philosophy ?

Page 1 of 1 [ 15 posts ] 

Previous topic | Next topic

NomadicAssassin
Velociraptor
Velociraptor

User avatar

Joined: 4 Mar 2009
Age: 31
Gender: Male
Posts: 449

07 Mar 2009, 4:14 pm

I'm not a huge fan of philosofy, but i do find it very elabrate, and i geuss in a some what of an odd way beautiful, if that makes sense to said subject of this topic. Why is it that Aspies ( me :) ), have such a hard time dipicting what many "NT's" call normal reactions? Is it that theres something wrong with us or NT's? Finally to the last section of my question, How can one determine that which is normal and that which is not..... i suppose many people of the public consider anything that happens quite frequently to be normal, but that's in so many ways illogical and unrealistic?

Quote:
Pardon any of my grammer and word mistakes


_________________
It's not that I'm so smart, it's just that I stay with problems longer.

Albert Einstein


Postperson
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 9 Jul 2004
Age: 67
Gender: Female
Posts: 4,023
Location: Uz

07 Mar 2009, 4:16 pm

oh they have mirror neurons or something, mindreading, telepathy...

normal is whatever the majority do or are. if the majority had purple skin, that would be 'normal'.



Henriksson
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 23 Nov 2008
Age: 33
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,534
Location: Sweden

07 Mar 2009, 7:31 pm

Postperson wrote:
oh they have mirror neurons or something, mindreading, telepathy...

normal is whatever the majority do or are. if the majority had purple skin, that would be 'normal'.

Quoted For Truth. We should be independant, not buckle down to peer pressure.


_________________
"Purity is for drinking water, not people" - Gospel of the Flying Spaghetti Monster.


Awesomelyglorious
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 17 Dec 2005
Gender: Male
Posts: 13,157
Location: Omnipresent

07 Mar 2009, 10:28 pm

Henriksson wrote:
Quoted For Truth. We should be independant, not buckle down to peer pressure.

We should act in our perceived best interest.



twoshots
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 26 Nov 2007
Age: 39
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,731
Location: Boötes void

07 Mar 2009, 11:10 pm

Awesomelyglorious wrote:
Henriksson wrote:
Quoted For Truth. We should be independant, not buckle down to peer pressure.

We should act in our perceived best interest.

Yeah, all the cool people are doing it.


_________________
* here for the nachos.


stonemask
Tufted Titmouse
Tufted Titmouse

User avatar

Joined: 28 Feb 2009
Age: 38
Gender: Male
Posts: 28
Location: in some tree

08 Mar 2009, 12:50 am

Normal is a state in which one tries to achieve mediocrity. At the same time one tries to receive praise from ones peers, for being more normal than they are. Yet they are the ones you are copying to induce that state. trying to achieve fame, at least within ones own peer group, by being the same as they are. when one finally comes to this way of being and thinking you are not only not well liked with the respective group you are looked upon as strange. this train of thought would lead one to believe there is no such thing as normal. There by making weird the actual "normal" state. I think the trick to surviving is not changing our selves but trying to change the group its self.


_________________
All can see the masks we wear, but the mask of stone is the one they fear.


ruveyn
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 21 Sep 2008
Age: 88
Gender: Male
Posts: 31,502
Location: New Jersey

08 Mar 2009, 12:58 am

stonemask wrote:
Normal is a state in which one tries to achieve mediocrity. At the same time one tries to receive praise from ones peers, for being more normal than they are. Yet they are the ones you are copying to induce that state. trying to achieve fame, at least within ones own peer group, by being the same as they are. when one finally comes to this way of being and thinking you are not only not well liked with the respective group you are looked upon as strange. this train of thought would lead one to believe there is no such thing as normal. There by making weird the actual "normal" state. I think the trick to surviving is not changing our selves but trying to change the group its self.


Not true. Normality sometimes means a state of proper function or form. We normally have two arms and two legs. That is what our genes dictate. We need the symmetry for balance.

Sometimes normality means a sufficient capability. So a normal IQ (also average) is around 100 or so. With a 100 IQ a person should be able to read, reason and calculate. He might not be a genius (which is unusual), but having this level of intelligence suffices for most tasks.

You are taking the word normal to mean average or common which by definition is in the middle of the range, hence mediocre.

ruveyn



Sand
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 15 Sep 2007
Age: 99
Gender: Male
Posts: 11,484
Location: Finland

08 Mar 2009, 1:09 am

ruveyn wrote:
stonemask wrote:
Normal is a state in which one tries to achieve mediocrity. At the same time one tries to receive praise from ones peers, for being more normal than they are. Yet they are the ones you are copying to induce that state. trying to achieve fame, at least within ones own peer group, by being the same as they are. when one finally comes to this way of being and thinking you are not only not well liked with the respective group you are looked upon as strange. this train of thought would lead one to believe there is no such thing as normal. There by making weird the actual "normal" state. I think the trick to surviving is not changing our selves but trying to change the group its self.


Not true. Normality sometimes means a state of proper function or form. We normally have two arms and two legs. That is what our genes dictate. We need the symmetry for balance.

Sometimes normality means a sufficient capability. So a normal IQ (also average) is around 100 or so. With a 100 IQ a person should be able to read, reason and calculate. He might not be a genius (which is unusual), but having this level of intelligence suffices for most tasks.

You are taking the word normal to mean average or common which by definition is in the middle of the range, hence mediocre.

ruveyn


Please elaborate the difference between average and normal. Anybody with extraordinary abilities but normal genetics is not any more normal.



Legato
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 17 Jan 2008
Age: 37
Gender: Male
Posts: 822

08 Mar 2009, 3:42 am

There is no normal in any meaningful sense. What is normal for me is not what is normal for you. What is normal for American society is not normal to any individual American. Normal is nothing more than a purely subjective presumption of what we think things are most likely to be like when placed in context with past experience. And we are most likely wrong, anyway.



NomadicAssassin
Velociraptor
Velociraptor

User avatar

Joined: 4 Mar 2009
Age: 31
Gender: Male
Posts: 449

08 Mar 2009, 10:17 pm

Well, now that we are all thinking.

A question I ponder upon alot, "To have no man means to have no war,
but to have war means to end men"

Is this truth or just a quiet, muted, but not forgotten whisper of Utopia?



........ or am i just making my self look more deprived of words ..... and in simple terms stupid, please be honest, no critisism is ever taken in my opinion to not be constructive :sunny:


_________________
It's not that I'm so smart, it's just that I stay with problems longer.

Albert Einstein


ruveyn
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 21 Sep 2008
Age: 88
Gender: Male
Posts: 31,502
Location: New Jersey

09 Mar 2009, 12:53 pm

Sand wrote:

Please elaborate the difference between average and normal. Anybody with extraordinary abilities but normal genetics is not any more normal.


Something acts normally if it functions as it was designed or capable of doing. A ship which sails (or steams) and does not sink and can be steered is acting normally. Another way of putting it is that a thing is normal if it fulfills its telos.

Hence an acorn is normal if it produces an oak tree. A tomato seed is normal if it germinates and makes a tomato plant.

ruveyn



Sand
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 15 Sep 2007
Age: 99
Gender: Male
Posts: 11,484
Location: Finland

09 Mar 2009, 1:59 pm

ruveyn wrote:
Sand wrote:

Please elaborate the difference between average and normal. Anybody with extraordinary abilities but normal genetics is not any more normal.


Something acts normally if it functions as it was designed or capable of doing. A ship which sails (or steams) and does not sink and can be steered is acting normally. Another way of putting it is that a thing is normal if it fulfills its telos.

Hence an acorn is normal if it produces an oak tree. A tomato seed is normal if it germinates and makes a tomato plant.

ruveyn


And a genius (say Einstein) is normal if he does abnormal things?



ruveyn
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 21 Sep 2008
Age: 88
Gender: Male
Posts: 31,502
Location: New Jersey

10 Mar 2009, 1:46 am

Sand wrote:

And a genius (say Einstein) is normal if he does abnormal things?


No. A genius is an original thinker. That is not abnormal, but it is statistically atypical. Our minds are for thoughts and that is what geniuses produce.

ruveyn



Sand
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 15 Sep 2007
Age: 99
Gender: Male
Posts: 11,484
Location: Finland

10 Mar 2009, 2:33 am

ruveyn wrote:
Sand wrote:

And a genius (say Einstein) is normal if he does abnormal things?


No. A genius is an original thinker. That is not abnormal, but it is statistically atypical. Our minds are for thoughts and that is what geniuses produce.

ruveyn


Since you consider original thinking not abnormal we have different conceptions of the term.



ruveyn
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 21 Sep 2008
Age: 88
Gender: Male
Posts: 31,502
Location: New Jersey

10 Mar 2009, 4:50 am

Sand wrote:
ruveyn wrote:
Sand wrote:

And a genius (say Einstein) is normal if he does abnormal things?


No. A genius is an original thinker. That is not abnormal, but it is statistically atypical. Our minds are for thoughts and that is what geniuses produce.

ruveyn


Since you consider original thinking not abnormal we have different conceptions of the term.


Telos is the end or purpose or ultimate state of being for anything. Telos of x is what x is for. Minds or for thinking. Hands are for grasping. Hearts are for pumping blood.

Normal means capable of achieving the telos. The telos of an acorn is to become an oaktree. The telos of a tomato seed is to become a tomato plant. etc. etc. etc

You are using the term to mean statistically typical. By that standard, mediocrity is normal. By the standard of telos, mediocrity is deficient.

ruveyn