churchill tribute too shocking for norwich!

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hecate
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14 Mar 2006, 9:59 am

a statue portraying winston churchill in a straight-jacket was removed after complaints were received that the sculpture was in "bad taste."

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jh ... altop.html

the statue was meant to represent churchill's personal struggle with mental illness and to deliver the message that people with mental health problems are capable of contributing to society. the straight-jacket was meant to symbolise "the stigma which restricted many mentally ill people."

i am disappointed that the statue was removed. it could've been worse - they could've represented mental illness the same way as the writers of blackadder did: pencils up his nostrils and a pair of pants on his head. :lol:

.....and all of this shocking controversy happened in my own home town of sleepy, little norwich. i'm scared to leave my home in case they've got the riot police out!



Silver_Shadow
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14 Mar 2006, 10:48 am

I heared it on the radio this morning, i can understand where they are coming from with saying that it was insulting to Churchhill and representing the stigma which restricts many mentally ill people.
I think that it should have been left up due to the fact that it was made with the intension of symbolysing churchill's strugles and that of all other non-NT's.
Oh well...



Laz
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14 Mar 2006, 11:27 am

I prefer the interpretation of churchill from the may day riots a few years ago where someone gave his statute in London a Mohawk 8)



Tequila
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14 Mar 2006, 12:40 pm

Storm in a teacup issue.



Emettman
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14 Mar 2006, 1:50 pm

hecate wrote:
the straight-jacket was meant to symbolise "the stigma which restricted many mentally ill people!


As opposed to the straight-jackets thought to restrict some mentally ill people?
Charlotte Bronte in a straight jacket? No, that might be even more dodgy.

If they wanted to depict his depression,
and promote thought and discussion,
why not use the symbolism he did?
The Black Dog

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.....and all of this shocking controversy happened in my own home town of sleepy, little norwich. i'm scared to leave my home in case they've got the riot police out!


You should worry! In my town of Bury St. Edmunds rioting folk tore down the Abbey Tower.
In 1327, admittedly, but they didn't replace it for twenty years.
You never know when this sort of level of debate might break out again.



hecate
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14 Mar 2006, 5:20 pm

Emettman wrote:
If they wanted to depict his depression,
and promote thought and discussion,
why not use the symbolism he did?
The Black Dog

that's a good idea. i get the impression that they chose the straight jacket because they were trying to get a little publicity for their cause.

Emettman wrote:
You should worry! In my town of Bury St. Edmunds rioting folk tore down the Abbey Tower.
In 1327, admittedly, but they didn't replace it for twenty years.
You never know when this sort of level of debate might break out again.

:lol: that's nothing - we had a full scale rebellion, as recently as 1549! yes, the threat of anarchy is ever-present in norwich.



psych
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14 Mar 2006, 6:50 pm

instead of messing about with statues they could have area-bombarded residential Germany with anthrax. After all, its what he would have wanted.

OR

simply eradicate some 'uncivilized tribes' like the Kurds with that hallmark of post-war civility - mustard gas. After all, thats what he did.

On second thoughts - the straight jacket will do just nicely :lol:



Kleptomaniac
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17 Mar 2006, 9:12 am

I stole it. Shh.



kevv729
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18 Mar 2006, 11:02 pm

You think I could buy it. :lol:

Even I do suffer depression for 20 plus years in My Life. Depression should be taken more seriously. Even Churchill I think might have approved.


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Emettman
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19 Mar 2006, 3:18 am

kevv729 wrote:
Depression should be taken more seriously. Even Churchill I think might have approved.


I think that's the divide: whether this statue takes depression seriously, or whether it fails to.

I doubt Churchill would have liked it. I'm pretty certain what Lady Churchill's response would have been. She burned the Sutherland portrait that showed him "disrespectfully" aged.

(I've got my 25-year long service badge for depression, too)



kevv729
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22 Mar 2006, 10:40 pm

Oh well then it does make a good statement though about depression I think.


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hecate
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23 Mar 2006, 1:26 pm

i think that the message they're trying to give is that - as many people attribute the outcome of WWII to churchill - what would the present day be like if he had been institutionalised for his mental illness? and, also, what things could other mentally ill people have achieved, had they not been discriminated against?



yoyobek
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23 Mar 2006, 1:38 pm

too bad the statue got taken down but maybe it'll inspire other groups to do similar kind of projects with more long term goals in mind (it would be really good if a statue like that was erected permanently). campaign group rethink who organised the unveiling of the winston churchill statue have this written on their site..... it makes a strong argument why stigma and discrimination against mentally ill people is everyone's loss, not just the mentally ill people's:-

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Costs

1. Mental health problems cost the country £77 billion a year, much of the cost is in lost taxation from people being refused the chance to work. (Social Exclusion Unit. June 2004)
2. The human costs of employment discrimination are even higher – two thirds of men over the age of 35 with mental health problems who take their own lives are unemployed. (Social Exclusion Unit. June 2004)
3. Over 900,000 adults claim sickness and disability benefits for mental health conditions – a larger number than the total number of people claiming jobseekers’ allowance. (Social Exclusion Unit. June 2004)



Emettman
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23 Mar 2006, 1:44 pm

hecate wrote:
what would the present day be like if he had been institutionalised for his mental illness?


Depression be blowed: he'd have been Kennedy'd long before for his drinking!
German cartoonists got at him for that.

And he had som remarkably stupid and unworkable ideas as well as some brilliant ones.
Most fortunately he had a staff who could work with and round such a brilliant and erratic individual.


Ah, now *there's* a thought. All I need is an understanding and efficient staff.



hecate
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23 Mar 2006, 4:33 pm

i've just realised, that last statement may have made me sound like a bit of a churchill enthusiast (it was meant to be an example of what another person might think).

Image

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How am I supposed to play with myself in this thing?

*winston churchill turns in his grave*