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cyberdora
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17 Apr 2025, 9:20 pm



kokopelli
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17 Apr 2025, 9:29 pm

"If it's interesting, it's probably wrong."

He's sure right about that.



cyberdora
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17 Apr 2025, 9:54 pm

Scientist dude said that so he doesn't "geek out" his words.
truth is, water vapour, methane and Dimethyl Sulphide strongly indicates
a) the planet is covered in water
b) CH4 and DMS indicate there are algae in the water as exactly the same signs are detected over earth.



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20 Apr 2025, 5:44 pm

I wonder if Trump will cut any NASA funding so his Co-President can send (exploding) rockets there for profit.


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cyberdora
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23 Apr 2025, 3:44 am

It would be funny if the residents of Planet 54PXP1 were also wondering the same thing after they detected "gas" in our solar system?



kokopelli
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25 Apr 2025, 10:55 am

Or maybe not.

From https://www.npr.org/2025/04/25/g-s1-62610/biosignatures-k2-18b-james-webb-exoplanet-doubt:

Quote:
Jake Taylor of the University of Oxford, who studies the atmospheres of far-away planets with the James Webb Space Telescope, did a quick reanalysis of the starlight filtering through K2-18b's atmosphere. He used a simple method to look for the tell-tale signals of gas molecules of any kind.

...

The results he got suggested that there's too much noise in the data to draw any conclusions.

...

What this new work shows is that "the strength of the evidence depends on the nitty gritty details of how we interpret the data, and that doesn't pass the bar for me for a convincing detection," says Laura Kreidberg, an expert on the atmospheres of distant planets at the Max Planck Institute for Astronomy in Germany who didn't work on the original research team or this new analysis.



cyberdora
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25 Apr 2025, 8:38 pm

^^^ to be fair even the lead researchers from Cambridge cautioned their findings do not prove life on the planet. While its probably easy to poke holes in claims of detecting chemicals light years from earth, the strengths of the findings are worth noting.

In three separate scans of the planet's atmosphere the Cambridge team used 3 different analytical techniques since 2023 and were able to replicate similar findings in terms of
a) water vapour indicating the planet has water
b) Dimethyl Sulphide (DMS is an indicator of microalgal respiration/photosynthesis) was present.
Replication is usually a requirement for scientific plausibility
Since then both Oxford and Max Planck have indicated the signal to noise ratio in their attempts to detect signatures of life may cast doubt on drawing conclusions about the original findings, they do however provide a springboard for further investigation (rather than shutting down investigation). As mentioned, our ability to detect gases on other planets is improving and perhaps better methods of calibration might reduce the statistical noise and improve the confidence in the readings.



Last edited by cyberdora on 25 Apr 2025, 8:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

funeralxempire
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25 Apr 2025, 8:39 pm

I wonder if they'll be included in the next round of US tariffs. :lol:


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cyberdora
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25 Apr 2025, 8:40 pm

Woke algae?



funeralxempire
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25 Apr 2025, 8:43 pm

cyberdora wrote:
Woke algae?


We've heard crazier. :lol:

But seriously, it seems statistically likely that life of some sort exists beyond our planet, even if I'm highly skeptical of claims that life from other planets has visited earth.


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cyberdora
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25 Apr 2025, 8:58 pm

^^^ Its been established that microbial life can travel through space in both spores and hibernated freeze dried form in comets and in space winds. Much of the microbial growth on the Russian space station MIR included microbes that inoculated the station from space. Collection slides on weather balloons sent to orbital positions over earth have also collected spores of organisms which have been able to be grown in agar/broth culture later.

therefore given water is present elsewhere in the universe and given material has been travelling around the universe for billions of years prior to the formation of the earth its not only likely microbial life exists elsewhere, but that earth itself might have been inoculated by spores several billion years ago. Concept is called panspermia.

Logic dictates if microbes exist on other earth like planets then over billions years there is a probability advanced sentient life has arose millions of times across the universe long before earth cooled down for life to emerge here. Statistically it's actually far more likely other advanced life forms have chosen not to reveal themselves to us > we humans are the only advanced beings in the universe. the latter theory makes no sense given what we know about how life evolved on earth.



kokopelli
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26 Apr 2025, 12:47 am

cyberdora wrote:
^^^ to be fair even the lead researchers from Cambridge cautioned their findings do not prove life on the planet. While its probably easy to poke holes in claims of detecting chemicals light years from earth, the strengths of the findings are worth noting.

In three separate scans of the planet's atmosphere the Cambridge team used 3 different analytical techniques since 2023 and were able to replicate similar findings in terms of
a) water vapour indicating the planet has water
b) Dimethyl Sulphide (DMS is an indicator of microalgal respiration/photosynthesis) was present.
Replication is usually a requirement for scientific plausibility
Since then both Oxford and Max Planck have indicated the signal to noise ratio in their attempts to detect signatures of life may cast doubt on drawing conclusions about the original findings, they do however provide a springboard for further investigation (rather than shutting down investigation). As mentioned, our ability to detect gases on other planets is improving and perhaps better methods of calibration might reduce the statistical noise and improve the confidence in the readings.


I think it is quite probable that life exists elsewhere, but it is far too early to claim that we have found it.

Water is common in this universe. Finding signs of water vapor is not a sign of finding life. At best, it is a sign of finding a planet that might be able to sustain life.

As for DMS, it is not a sure sign of life. Finding it calls for future research, not for vastly premature conclusions.



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26 Apr 2025, 1:10 am

I believe ..... 8O


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cyberdora
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26 Apr 2025, 2:28 am

kokopelli wrote:
Finding it calls for future research, not for vastly premature conclusions.


Agreed, but we can share the researcher's initial enthusiasm and prospects we are getting closer.



kokopelli
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Yesterday, 7:53 pm

It could easily be thousands of years before we find actual signs of life outside our solar system.

Skepticism is a very important part of science. We shouldn't go heading off on wild goose chases based on what we might want to believe.

It might be worth remembering that we have found organic molecules, some reportedly fairly complex, in space for years. None of that is any sign of life.

Also, we must keep in mind that life was extremely unlikely in the early Universe. It takes time to build up the atoms we have via nucleosynthesis. Stellar nucleosynthesis works okay for lighter elements, but most of our elements required supernova nucleosynthesis. There are suggestions that for any advanced civilization to form such ours, it has to have elements formed from supernova nucleosynthesis to account for the amount of heavier elements we have. Naturally, if there is any kind of life in these "spores", a supernova would destroy them far out into space. It would take a very long time for spores to be able to cross such a large distance.

Remember the "oumamua" interstellar visitor? It is going very fast -- something like 50 to 60 miles per second. At that rate, it would take many thousands of years to arrive from another planet with life and for that to happen, the "spores" would have to be accelerated to very high speeds by some mechanism that seems little more than science fiction.

I don't buy into the "panspermia" conjecture at all. Even more, we don't need it. It is enormously more likely that the organic molecules that are the building blocks of life formed naturally in Earth's atmosphere that that some "spores" from outer space made it here and started life.



cyberdora
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Today, 2:22 am

kokopelli wrote:
Remember the "oumamua" interstellar visitor? It is going very fast -- something like 50 to 60 miles per second. At that rate, it would take many thousands of years to arrive from another planet with life and for that to happen, the "spores" would have to be accelerated to very high speeds by some mechanism that seems little more than science fiction.


A world authority - Prof Avi Loeb says oumamua could easily be millions of years old given the antiquity of the universe could be a relic from a long extinct civilisation traversing space before entering our solar system. With that in mind the spores might hitch a ride on comets or asteroids or objects like oumamua from other galaxies.