The Body Positive and Fat Acceptance Movement

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auntblabby
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13 Apr 2017, 2:46 am

barbarKain wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
I am continually frustrated at the fact that just about anything that tastes remotely good, is usually not so good for one's health.


Agree. I'm on the low carbohydrate diet for 3 months, feel really good. Sometimes I eat burgers and noticed that right after that I feel a bit sick.

a "cheat day" now and then is ok, within limits. for me, the limit is one cheeseburger with fried onions. :chef: or one slice of the works pizza.



friedmacguffins
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13 Apr 2017, 12:31 pm

Fat people are objectifying their caretakers, with demands of food, pleasure, and acceptance.

Honestly -- it sounds cushy, posh.

My only question, at this point, is whether your waiters / butlers / fluffers are willing masochists, and if fat people are comfortable with that. Do both sides of this agreement acknowledge the situation for what it is, wholeheartedly.

I mean, if the collapsed, king size bed and bed pan ultimately belong to you, you can just say no. You can choose to kick the person out of that car, with the critically-burdened suspension, and not be the chauffeur, if you don't like to do that. Who is to say that it's your personal, social problem, to fix.



friedmacguffins
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13 Apr 2017, 12:32 pm

barbarKain wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
I am continually frustrated at the fact that just about anything that tastes remotely good, is usually not so good for one's health.


Agree. I'm on the low carbohydrate diet for 3 months, feel really good. Sometimes I eat burgers and noticed that right after that I feel a bit sick.


Hopefully, not from that place, with the Olestra and silly putty chemicals.



Kiprobalhato
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14 Apr 2017, 1:59 am

XFilesGeek wrote:
I was fat. My mom wasn't.

I ate junk because I was depressed, not because of "bad parenting."


did you buy the junk, or did your mom or someone else provide it? allowing it to be accessed, so you could eat it.

it's dumbfounding, the genuine surprise some parents have at their child's weight after they have gone and bought cheap, fattening foods, stocking the pantry with it. (not that this is you)


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Kraichgauer
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14 Apr 2017, 6:16 pm

Kiprobalhato wrote:
XFilesGeek wrote:
I was fat. My mom wasn't.

I ate junk because I was depressed, not because of "bad parenting."


did you buy the junk, or did your mom or someone else provide it? allowing it to be accessed, so you could eat it.

it's dumbfounding, the genuine surprise some parents have at their child's weight after they have gone and bought cheap, fattening foods, stocking the pantry with it. (not that this is you)


Some poorer families can't afford anything but less healthy food.


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friedmacguffins
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15 Apr 2017, 12:39 pm

I am sure they are heavily-funded, via corporate welfare, but, at point-of-sale, wholesome food staples are very cheap, in this time and place.

You have to make the choice, to go either way.

I feel that you can look at a pastry chef stereotype, and say he likes to have his cake and eat it, too. That his choice. I went to a fudge store, in a German town, and the owner was very large. Is anyone feeling a moral dilemma or identity crisis, on reading that. There's a rhyme and a reason, for that, and it doesn't hurt my feelings.

It doesn't need to be helped, and Joe Blow fat-phobe is not the appointed lifestyle coach.

Yes, you are probably a faster runner. Really. Go do that. Enjoy your salad. To each his own. Maybe, you can win a bicycle marathon.



auntblabby
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15 Apr 2017, 12:48 pm

what I don't grok, is on tv there is this program called "evening magazine" showing these beautiful people with no body fat on them, taut and muscular, lean and mean, eating mass quantities of all this rich food at this eatery or that, and they get away with eating like that with never any bad effect, IOW they stay slim and fit. HOW DO THEY DO THIS??! !? can their genes really be that much better than mine? Image



friedmacguffins
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15 Apr 2017, 1:03 pm

These ideas are discussed in the Mediterranean, French, and Atkins diet plans:
https://archive.org/details/letteroncorpulen00bant

Heavy foods are not inherently harmful and even serve to stabilize blood sugar. Once a person has a steady metabolism, it's still possible to have occasional treats, as for a holiday or social event.

My eating is usually, somewhat primal, but I eat plenty of everything, on the day, when everyone does that. I like eating and say that I do. We are lucky for the food.



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15 Apr 2017, 1:27 pm

This is the best thing that's happened in recent years. I stay away from the Fish n Chips most of the time now. I only have sweets on special occasions like Valentines Day, Easter, birthdays and Christmas. I've slipped with the Pringles and Doritos. I'll be replacing those with salad for the next 5 months while salad is cheap. I'll also be saving up my money at the same time so I can afford salad all year round. I also drink Mio water more often than pop. My goal is to get to the point where I'm drinking pure water and Mio water instead of diet soda and Mio water.


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auntblabby
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16 Apr 2017, 2:26 am

^^^^ :wtg:



tensordyne
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17 Apr 2017, 4:17 pm

I have not responded recently. Realize what happened with my anger with @Kraichguaer. Looked up meaning of anger. It happens when someone mistreats you. So how did @Kraichgauer supposedly mistreat myself?

By being smugly indifferent. It is a kind of low-level, lame aggression (my older bro I realized later used to pull the same kind of thing which is why I was so pieved). To be clear it happened when I gave copious reasons but he responded with "No, I just like meat." Uhh, excuse you for not playing the game of being reasonable. That No did not address anything. It was just a big FU to myself cleverely and conceled behind being "social".

Quote:
I haven't​ responded lately but I would like to cover some things.

1. I am not vegan
2. I'm not addicted to any sort of food

My thread isn't about veganism.


Point 1. sure, what is the point in disagreeing, but on two, how do you know?

Addiction Characteristics:

a. You do not need it. Try eating nothing but meat and you will die. Then go eat nothing but plants and you will thrive.

b. It causes you and others harm. The scientific lit on this one is little understood by the general populace but it is clear. Want to die earlier while being overweight, go ahead and eat animal products so you can kill yourself. That is just the tip of the iceberg though.

c. You can't or don't want to give it up. That is the main thing I hear as a response to Vegan arguments "but I like it sooo much", yeah, crack addicts love that ringing feeling too I have heard. Your own experience being the only consideration as to whether something is good, sounds like an argument an addict would make to me.

or psychology today:

Quote:
Addiction is a condition that results when a person ingests a substance (e.g., alcohol, cocaine, nicotine) or engages in an activity (e.g., gambling, sex, shopping) that can be pleasurable but the continuation of which becomes compulsive and interferes with ordinary responsibilities and concerns, such as work, relationships, or health.


In the case of carnism it is health that gets messed up obviously, but this has other effects as well. How many men have had prostate cancer and become impotent? Wives and Lovers get affected. Sounds like an adverse affect of addiction to me.

The thread from my own point of view is about accepting a disease condition based on popular opinions. Why not challenge the basis of this thread? There is an obesity epidemic occuring after all.

Shouldn't science and morality always be on the table as a discussion point? If not, why not? I don't call this an addiction lightly. It is not a derogatory term of shame, it is a medical dianoses.

https://youtu.be/5VWi6dXCT7I
https://youtu.be/0tJyb1wTxg4

I do not care if this thread is not intended to be about Veganism, Carnism, or whatever. The stakes are too high. If I disagree with the very basis of this thread then that is still about the thread, even if I decide not to be a cheerleader for whatever cause the thread advocates. Too bad. :P

Go Vegan!


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Kraichgauer
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17 Apr 2017, 5:08 pm

tensordyne wrote:
I have not responded recently. Realize what happened with my anger with @Kraichguaer. Looked up meaning of anger. It happens when someone mistreats you. So how did @Kraichgauer supposedly mistreat myself?

By being smugly indifferent. It is a kind of low-level, lame aggression (my older bro I realized later used to pull the same kind of thing which is why I was so pieved). To be clear it happened when I gave copious reasons but he responded with "No, I just like meat." Uhh, excuse you for not playing the game of being reasonable. That No did not address anything. It was just a big FU to myself cleverely and conceled behind being "social".

Quote:
I haven't​ responded lately but I would like to cover some things.

1. I am not vegan
2. I'm not addicted to any sort of food

My thread isn't about veganism.


Point 1. sure, what is the point in disagreeing, but on two, how do you know?

Addiction Characteristics:

a. You do not need it. Try eating nothing but meat and you will die. Then go eat nothing but plants and you will thrive.

b. It causes you and others harm. The scientific lit on this one is little understood by the general populace but it is clear. Want to die earlier while being overweight, go ahead and eat animal products so you can kill yourself. That is just the tip of the iceberg though.

c. You can't or don't want to give it up. That is the main thing I hear as a response to Vegan arguments "but I like it sooo much", yeah, crack addicts love that ringing feeling too I have heard. Your own experience being the only consideration as to whether something is good, sounds like an argument an addict would make to me.

or psychology today:

Quote:
Addiction is a condition that results when a person ingests a substance (e.g., alcohol, cocaine, nicotine) or engages in an activity (e.g., gambling, sex, shopping) that can be pleasurable but the continuation of which becomes compulsive and interferes with ordinary responsibilities and concerns, such as work, relationships, or health.


In the case of carnism it is health that gets messed up obviously, but this has other effects as well. How many men have had prostate cancer and become impotent? Wives and Lovers get affected. Sounds like an adverse affect of addiction to me.

The thread from my own point of view is about accepting a disease condition based on popular opinions. Why not challenge the basis of this thread? There is an obesity epidemic occuring after all.

Shouldn't science and morality always be on the table as a discussion point? If not, why not? I don't call this an addiction lightly. It is not a derogatory term of shame, it is a medical dianoses.

https://youtu.be/5VWi6dXCT7I
https://youtu.be/0tJyb1wTxg4

I do not care if this thread is not intended to be about Veganism, Carnism, or whatever. The stakes are too high. If I disagree with the very basis of this thread then that is still about the thread, even if I decide not to be a cheerleader for whatever cause the thread advocates. Too bad. :P

Go Vegan!


I did not mistreat you, though I'm sorry if you thought I did. I am simply stating that I will eat what I like. I was in fact offended by how you had likened me to a drug addict for eating meat. Eating meat is my choice, and hardly an addiction to be saved from.


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auntblabby
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17 Apr 2017, 5:39 pm

it seems to me that many aspies tend to have a stuck groove.



tensordyne
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17 Apr 2017, 5:47 pm

Quote:
I did not mistreat you, though I'm sorry if you thought I did. I am simply stating that I will eat what I like. I was in fact offended by how you had likened me to a drug addict for eating meat. Eating meat is my choice, and hardly an addiction to be saved from.


Not respecting me enough to respond to any of my logic with anything but a
"No, I don't think so", a very mild form of mistreatment for sure. When they pull out the rape carts to impregnate cows, when they put give you drugs instead of competent medical advice, etc, etc. That is real mistreatment.

Well, we are talking at least. Why is meat your choice? Like inviolably your choice? Does that not presume a number of realities? We do not say it is a choice to be able to do what ever we want on other topics. Murder is not allowed, even if you choose it. Face it, if someone calls you out on some behavior, how is it not weak to be all, "well, it is my choice, I like it..." etc?

I am sorry you felt bad about being called an addict, I was being provocative on purpose to challenge you and the narative. Since the addict term literally applies, I can not, and will not, take it back. Although, I have given reasons why I think eating meat is bad and an addiction. Care to address anything I factually mentioned? Because, again, why should you be allowed to argue by fiat? "I think such and such is so...", no outside refs, no internal arguments, nothing, just, "well, that is me!"

If eating meat had only negative affects on yourself, I would gladly leave you alone to die whatever miserable malady is most likely to affect you. Since your addiction requires the painful slaughter and imprisonement of billions of other sentient entities, plus a very real risk to society, sorry man, I just got to call BS when I see it.

Again, to be clear,

"arguments" = strong
"I say so" = weak

Go Vegan!


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Kraichgauer
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17 Apr 2017, 6:16 pm

tensordyne wrote:
Quote:
I did not mistreat you, though I'm sorry if you thought I did. I am simply stating that I will eat what I like. I was in fact offended by how you had likened me to a drug addict for eating meat. Eating meat is my choice, and hardly an addiction to be saved from.


Not respecting me enough to respond to any of my logic with anything but a
"No, I don't think so", a very mild form of mistreatment for sure. When they pull out the rape carts to impregnate cows, when they put give you drugs instead of competent medical advice, etc, etc. That is real mistreatment.

Well, we are talking at least. Why is meat your choice? Like inviolably your choice? Does that not presume a number of realities? We do not say it is a choice to be able to do what ever we want on other topics. Murder is not allowed, even if you choose it. Face it, if someone calls you out on some behavior, how is it not weak to be all, "well, it is my choice, I like it..." etc?

I am sorry you felt bad about being called an addict, I was being provocative on purpose to challenge you and the narative. Since the addict term literally applies, I can not, and will not, take it back. Although, I have given reasons why I think eating meat is bad and an addiction. Care to address anything I factually mentioned? Because, again, why should you be allowed to argue by fiat? "I think such and such is so...", no outside refs, no internal arguments, nothing, just, "well, that is me!"

If eating meat had only negative affects on yourself, I would gladly leave you alone to die whatever miserable malady is most likely to affect you. Since your addiction requires the painful slaughter and imprisonement of billions of other sentient entities, plus a very real risk to society, sorry man, I just got to call BS when I see it.

Again, to be clear,

"arguments" = strong
"I say so" = weak

Go Vegan!


You could simply accept my apology and explanation, and be polite.
No, animals I eat don't have a choice in the matter. But neither does the mouse have a choice in the matter when it's eaten by the cat, or when a crocodile eats some poor antelope taking a drink from a river, I'm sure the corc didn't ask for the antelope's consent. As I doubt you're going to hold any of this against carnivorous animals, so please, don't hold me to account.
And no, eating animals is not murder.


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auntblabby
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17 Apr 2017, 6:20 pm

I wonder what he would think about fake meat?