Transgender buyer's remorse, aka "detransitioning"

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If I understand it correctly, gender is a part of who you feel you are, from what perspective you experience the world.

^ More like which of the two teams you were randomly assigned to play for at the gym class. It's doesn't matter because you get to play the same game either way.

...But some whine about not being happy with it anyway.

It's all about being a good sport about it and playing well with others.

I get it Pepe, I feel the same way.

I have a decent grasp on gender, because I feel somewhat gender apathetic towards myself. I can get up, I can do a job, I can read books, I can garden, I can love on animals, I can help kids with autism, that's all I need. I can make a clinical observation about myself by looking in the mirror and matching up how I look to the science books. I buy clothes that keep me from getting arrested for indecent exposure and I'm good.

I devote no time to myself genderwise, or sexually. I have a very hard time connecting the dots with an absorption to anything male or female. I just am, that's it.

Pepe, I understand that there wasn’t criticism intended by you.

I’m trying to tell you a reason why people may be INFERRING criticism.

Maybe you don’t care.

But you sound like you care that people think you are being critical when you are not. So if you care about that - I offered a possible why that is happening.

If you don’t care, or that wasn’t helpful, I am fine with that. I am also done because that’s all I’ve got.

It's interesting to me how many people within this thread are a reporting a sense of gender apathy / a lack of gender.

Personally, growing up people used to call me a shortened male version of my name and use male pronouns to deliberately annoy me. I hated it. Absolutely hated it.

Some days I feel more neutral. Where I consider myself a woman by technicality, but it's not an important part of my identity. Then there are days where it is an important aspect and I feel a sense of happiness when I am referred to as a lady.

I have days where I want my chest to look flat, so I dress accordingly. Yet I also have days where I am conscious about how how small my chest is, so I dress differently to make my chest a little more apparent. Personally, I've felt this way since puberty. Not sure why. I consider myself a slightly gender nonconforming woman. A dapper femme. It just feels right.

On occasion I've experimented with drag. It does annoy me being referred to as she when I'm in character. Been a while since I've done so though. That's more about capturing a cosplay character rather than gender. Oh dear. My inner nerd is showing.

My close friend had similar experiences.
She's kind of nonbinary but deliberate misgendering was - as she later analyzed it - a deliberate play on a topic where she was feeling unsure about herself, deliberate playing with her weakness.
It was subtle but extremely toxic.

Yep, but I am so much more than my gender.
My gender isn't really a big part of my life, partly because I am older and partly because I am a virtual hermit in real life.
Staving off dementia is so much more important to me.

I suspect gender identity is more important for ppl still in the process of finding themselves.
I.E., In the process of self-actualisation.

I was suicidal for a decade when I was younger, but not because of my gender confusion.

We are on the same page.

They inferred INCORRECTLY.

May I suggest you explain my position to ppl who have misunderstood my position?

But am I autistic? I was diagnosed over Zoom/whatever it was during the pandemic, the assessors never even met me. Of course, you were not to know that Pepe.

I suspect I'm just a random weirdo.

But in general, humans seem to be a pretty nasty bunch.

Hm, well, the UK is quickly going downhill. It used to be the norm for Brits to be polite and welcoming to new people. But for the last few years it seems that if you are new, you are fair game to be mocked and insulted.

Many Brits think politeness is too woke and PC for them to bother with now

When I was in north England countryside in 2003, people were really nice, you could have a polite conversation even with a worker mowing the town greens. I was impressed and I wanted my own country to be like that.
I heard things worsened a lot since then.

I went to London, England in 2003. It was an enjoyable but very crowded experience, then. If what the news reports regarding immigration is true, it would be crammed cheek and jowl now. It's hard for me to maintain positivity when I am unable to claim my personal space. Maybe they are struggling with that? There's a housing shortage, that doesn't invite warm feelings.

I'm off topic and playing devil's advocate, mostly because it's happening where I live too. I have a heart for the underdog. I will usually find one disadvantaged person a pay period and give to them, I'll give a little more around the holidays. Recently, I gave to a woman who was pregnant and holding a 'refugee' sign. I thought she would be grateful/relieved for the $20 USD I gave her. But, she grabbed hold of my hand (I was in my car at a red light) and started asking for $100. When I told her that I'd given her all I could spare, she asked for $40. She never let go of my hand until I told her again that $20 was all I had to give. She then dropped my hand, stuck the $20 in her purse and walked off to the next person.

I'm used to dealing with drunks, I guess. They are probably not thinking beyond that next sample size bottle of hard liquor. They are thrilled with $5. This woman was completely unfazed by what I might have had to give up to give her $20 from a small paycheck. This doesn't inspire friendliness, but rather fear. I don't like it when people touch me uninvited, I really don't like it when I am trying to be kind. I will still give, but the next time I will roll the window down just an inch and stick the money out through the crack.

This reminds me of totalitarianism; state over individual; which is usually regarded as bad. As a trans lady officially diagnosed with persisting gender dysphoria, I feel qualified to give my opinion on this: I can't play the game if I'm not on the right team. I simply can't. The mental repercussions from being on the wrong team would drive me to 'quitting' the 'game' if I couldn't be myself. Thankfully I am getting the treatment I need and am accepted on the girls' team, but the point is that a trans person simply could not play the game, or would play it with great difficulty, if they weren't on the right team. They (I) can't be a good sport or play well with others if they (I) aren't on the right team. I hope this clears it up a little

In my observations, it's much more important to people who don't fit the societal expectation of a gender binary - cis-male/cis-female, and largely because of how they're treated by other people.

I'm glad they're beginning to teach the existence of trans people in elementary school curriculums. It'll teach existence first, and with it tolerance/acceptance, and then there won't be so many trans murders and suicides. Trans kids will grow up realizing they're just one option on the spectrum of people that pop out into the world and that's okay. Far fewer will be kicked out of their family homes/disowned, socially rejected and so on.

MOST people don't have to go through much of a process of "finding themselves," when it comes to gender identity so there is no real struggle or difficulties. I've always known I was male (cis-gendered male) and never thought or felt anything otherwise, and that fit society's expectations all around me of my appearance and mannerisms etc so there wasn't any "finding myself," at all when it came to gender. I think this is true for most people and the struggles are those of trans and non-binary people that don't fit societal expectations of who they're assumed to be based on their appearance.

Not a good analogy. Alas, men and women do not get to play the exact same game either way.

It seems to me that it's more analogous to being assigned to the wrong game, or to the wrong role within the game (e.g., in baseball, someone who's a decent pitcher but a lousy catcher being assigned to be catcher).

I think it's important to continue to reform society so that both women and men have more options and are treated more equally. Perhaps then fewer people might feel the need to take the physically radical step of changing their bodily sex.

But no matter how many societal reforms are made, it is likely that women and men will still be different enough, and treated differently enough, that changing one's gender and bodily sex is the only workable option for some people.

Last edited by Mona Pereth on 19 Dec 2022, 11:06 am, edited 3 times in total.