Banning loud children from restaurants, airplanes
My argument was that saying that 'denying someone service is not illegal' is a false statement. I cannot give more details of my case, for reasons already stated. But you can read the actual law yourself on the link below, thus confirming it is very real:
http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/Lex ... 403:EN:PDF
In the United States, it's perfectly legal for businesses to deny service to someone for any number of reasons. They can not deny service to someone on the basis of what is defined as a "protected category." "Behavior" is not considered a "protected category."
The laws in Europe have no bearing on the United States. If you doubt that, go act rowdy and disruptive in any number of businesses located in the United States and watch how quickly you're shown the door.
I don't doubt that at all. Likewise laws in the United States have no bearing on any other countries. Therefore blanket statements about such things on a forum frequented by people from all over the world is a bit daft.
Ichinin
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Joined: 3 Apr 2009
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,653
Location: A cold place with lots of blondes.
Maybe a separate sound proof room should be provided to people like YOU. You're the one with the problem - segregate yourself.
Why should he? Is it a human right to have screaming kids and not tell them to be quiet and learn to respect other human beings? If they are unable to perform that duty, they shouldn't have gotten the damn kids in the first place!
Parents today are so f***ing lazy and disrespectful to others, when i was a kid, my mom always told me to keep it down. When i sat down and screamed that i wanted a toy, she TOOK THE TIME and explained to me that i couldn't get it because they had no money at the time. Do parents to that today? No, because they are f***ing lazy moronic s**thead psychopaths that don't give a sh** about anyone outside of their f***ing family!
Take care of your damn kids! Start performing the parental duty you signed up for!
You always this aggressive and rude about everything? Bet you're f***ing fun to hang out with.
*I* am frustrated about other people being rude and ignorant of other people, and you tell me that *I* am rude? Enough with this "parents are always right" crap. There are parents who do give a s**t about others, and there are PLENTY of others who do not. Guess which one is in majority?
But yeah, i'm f*****g great to be with. And i use cursed language to get my emotions across, there are no emoticons/smileys invented yet that could do my point justice.
_________________
"It is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring" (Carl Sagan)
Picture the scene.
Today at a coffee shop. Dilbert on his lunch hour, reading Kafka's The Trial, and trying to forget all about TPS Reports and Lumbergh.
About 30 seconds after I sat down, two women came in, one carrying what looked like a baby still sniffling from recent crying attempts, and they sat at a table right next to mine.
AWWW CRAP! But but... KAFKA!! ! He's hard to understand as it is.
Upon closer inspection, the kid was actually about 4 or 5! Holy crap why is such a big kid bundled up like a baby and carried cradled on mom's chest?
Awww she's cute! She's still sniffling a little so something bad must have happened.
There she goes she's smiling. And now laughing! Awwww!
<5 minutes later>
WAAAAAAAAAAAA! WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!
Holy what the f**k, was that an air raid siren? Nope it's the 5 year old. She was laughing 10 seconds ago and now she's crying so loud I can't hear myself read.
And now she's smiling again. And laughing?
I went back to Kafka and kept my fingers crossed.
<5 minutes later>
WAAAAAAAAAAAA! WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!
That's when I left.
I'd have left much earlier than that, but hey, this is just proof of what I've always suspected... All kids have bipolar!
Ichinin
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Joined: 3 Apr 2009
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,653
Location: A cold place with lots of blondes.
That statement is a load of crap as court records are open for the public to read.
Basically, if you cannot provide evidence, your whole argument fails as another dreamt up anecdote.
All court records are open for the public to read are they? Prove it.
They are where i live. And i've read court records online from the US, most have been published by reporters in PDF format, they have to buy those from somewhere. There are very few occasions where court records would be sealed, and that requires some extra ordinary circumstances. Protecting the reputation of a corporation would hardly be such a case.
_________________
"It is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring" (Carl Sagan)
Been eating out the past couple of days in various places, and noticed a couple of really pertinent fact. All the BABIES I've seen have generally been well-behaved and happy and not disruptive at all. The people being loud, obnoxious and generally disturbing everyone's meals were not children at all, but teenagers or adults. Shouting, throwing stuff, swearing, running about and generally making themselves a right pain in the ass. Babies don't do any of that. They might get upset, but when you only have one way to communicate your requirements to the outside world, that's what happens.
_________________
"There is a time when the operation of the machine becomes so odious, makes you so sick at heart,
that you can't take part" [Mario Savo, 1964]
Where the heck do you live Macbeth? LOL
If someone had a peaceful baby they can eat in that restaurant, from what i understand. It is the screaming ones that must leave. Parents are usually well aware of their childrens' limitations. Babies are fairly predictable. Unless they have colic or something they either need to be fed, burped, changed or held when they cry.
What I originally wrote was:
Would you kindly explain how a statement starting with, "In the U.S." qualifies as a "blanket statement?" It's pretty clear that I was refering to the United States seeing as I specifically said, "In the U.S." and the eatery whose policy sparked this debate is located in the U.S.
In the future, I would suggest reading posts more carefully, especially if you are going to be calling other people "daft." That was rather rude and unnecessary.
_________________
"If we fail to anticipate the unforeseen or expect the unexpected in a universe of infinite possibilities, we may find ourselves at the mercy of anyone or anything that cannot be programmed, categorized or easily referenced."
-XFG (no longer a moderator)
What I originally wrote was:
Would you kindly explain how a statement starting with, "In the U.S." qualifies as a "blanket statement?" It's pretty clear that I was refering to the United States seeing as I specifically said, "In the U.S." and the eatery whose policy sparked this debate is located in the U.S.
In the future, I would suggest reading posts more carefully, especially if you are going to be calling other people "daft." That was rather rude and unnecessary.
I politely suggest you take a leaf out of your own book and read posts more carefully. Then you would know that I wasn't referring to a statement by you but this one:
EDIT: for clarification
I was denied service a few months ago. I took the organisation to court and won.
What about banning loud kids from church? Stupid parents sitting in the first or second row of church and the pastor is trying to give a sermon and he gets interrupted constantly by a brat! Churches do have nurseries and also there is such a thing as sitting in back of the church or getting a sitter. With airplanes that is the most annoying thing. I was sitting in first class and this kid just wouldn't shut up no matter what the dad told her. I can't stand the whining and stomping of feet. With restaurants, I just avoid all the family type restaurants. My parents and I rarely dine out but when we do we pick really fancy restaurants where no kids go to. Peace and quiet. I'm sooooooooo thankful I don't have kids. I try my best and just avoid going places where a lot of kids hang out.
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Anna
If you're not happy with yourself, you'll never be happy with somebody else. (Don Omar)
About time! I hope the same law will make its way here.
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I seriously wonder if anyone here remembers what they were like as a kid. I was well mannered sometimes but other times when my parents weren't understanding that tonight was not a good restaurant night for me, I wasn't well mannered. I think it's discrimination against children. Many people now are used to abortion defense and dehumanized children in the womb calling them "It", money being the utmost important factor in someone's well being and happiness that people have forgotten that children aren't always going to be on their best behavior and neither were they as children.
I don't like the sound of screaming kids either. Who does??? I do know though that this kind of thinking is just showing that our country is growing less kid friendly. If these restaurants only want adults, they wouldn't make as much money. They have made accomodations in the past. Airplanes used to be way more kid friendly and would have several different items to aid children passengers. Now they just sneer at the thought.
Parents on the other hand especially with autistic children should develop a routine of going to the restroom with their child to calm them down. Workers should give enough time for that or be polite and asking the parents to take their child somewhere to calm down. It's not fair to children with autism who in the past weren't even brought out in public settings. I hear people complain now about just how many autistic children they see now in public settings as if they should all be locked up at home.
About time! I hope the same law will make its way here.
No screaming babies? Babies are going to scream and cry. So you're saying that the moment your poor little ears hears a baby scream or cry out of hunger or needing to be changed that parent should be told to leave that place once and for all?
Oh right because you as a baby never did that..
This isn't just someone with autism who doesn't like the sound of a crying baby, most people don't. However, all this is going to do is lock parents up at home for having children just so those who don't have children can go wherever they choose and give a sigh of relief until, someone else in a particular category annoys them too.
About time! I hope the same law will make its way here.
No screaming babies? Babies are going to scream and cry. So you're saying that the moment your poor little ears hears a baby scream or cry out of hunger or needing to be changed that parent should be told to leave that place once and for all?
Oh right because you as a baby never did that..
This isn't just someone with autism who doesn't like the sound of a crying baby, most people don't. However, all this is going to do is lock parents up at home for having children just so those who don't have children can go wherever they choose and give a sigh of relief until, someone else in a particular category annoys them too.
So? They stay home for a few months while the baby is still too young to go out- that is not ridiculous to expect. People choose to have kids and if they are not ready to miss out on a few dinners out then they should consider waiting a while. If they cant get a sitter then order in. You don't usually get out much in the first few months anyway. If your kid is going through a phase of being obnoxious and disturbing then it is your responsibility to either handle it or not take them any where until they are over the spell. I had to leave stores and restaurants when mine was a toddler, and it was because I didn't want other people to have to listen to her tantrums. I could ignore it. It only lasts a little while. This is part of parenting- it is something people have forgotten or just don't care about any more. I didn't hear kids in public places when I was growing up, and I didn't cause disruptions either. My mom waited until we could handle it before she took us places like restaurants or movies. We had what they call "home training".
Oh yea I avoid going to movies. Too many kids talking so loud. It's like shut the f*** up! Other people want to watch the movie. I have seen parents bring their kids to a R film.
_________________
Anna
If you're not happy with yourself, you'll never be happy with somebody else. (Don Omar)
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