05 Jun 2010, 4:40 pm
05 Jun 2010, 9:10 pm
06 Jun 2010, 5:09 am
06 Jun 2010, 5:11 am
06 Jun 2010, 5:50 am
06 Jun 2010, 8:15 am
WARNING: Inductive reasoning alert !
I think that we must be careful to avoid falling into the trap of inductive reasoning.
Inductive reasoning works like this.
Take two facts and then create a new fact from them.
For example
1. The life form sitting next to me is a dog
2. The lifeform sitting next to me is on a sofa
So all lifeforms which sit next to me on the sofa are dogs (Very silly idea).
Some people are doing equally silly things regarding gun control
A better method is to make a hypothesis and then test it.
In this case you can create the hypothesis that "A high rate of gun ownership is associated with a high level of gun crime".
You need to then test the hypothesis, the best way I see to do it is to plot a X/Y graph of the gun ownership rate (guns per 1000 people) against the rate of violent gun crimes (in terms of violent crimes per 1000 people). You would need to do this for many different countries (not just UK and USA). Then see if a correlation exists between the two.
If no relationship is seen then the hypothesis is wrong, if you do see a relationship then it is possible that the hypothesis is right. Perhapes those who have strong views in favour of either strict or weak gun control laws should go, gather the data and plot the graphs for the rest of us to look at.
It might be a better thing to do than getting hot and bothered.
_________________
Health is a state of physical, mental and social wellbeing and not merely the absence of disease or infirmity
I am not a jigsaw, I am a free man ! Diagnosed under the DSM5 rules with autism spectrum disorder, under DSM4 psychologist said would have been AS (299.80) but I suspect that I am somewhere between 299.80 and 299.00 (Autism) under DSM4.
06 Jun 2010, 8:43 am
06 Jun 2010, 11:18 am
06 Jun 2010, 11:34 am
Raptor wrote:
Jaydee wrote:
John_Browning wrote:
Another example of how well "gun-free" zones work. 
The "gun-free" zones (countries with strict firearms regulations) sure work quite a lot better than the places where guns can be bought by every Tom, Dick or Harry at the nearest mall. Tragic incidents like this will happen, but do not say that gun regulations do not work, because they do.No, they do not work. There is no logical way for them to work.
What do they accomplish? Making something illegal does not make it impossible to obtain.
We’re not talking about taking things from babies in a playpen. You can’t keep people from getting what they want if they want it bad enough. A classic example would be the War on Drugs, what a joke!
About all you get is that the law abiding citizens, in fear of the law, are disarmed and unable to protect themselves against deadly force which gives the criminal element a target rich environment to operate generally un-opposed.
Personally, I feel much safer in a state where I’m lawfully permitted to carry a concealed handgun. This at least gives me fighting chance as long as I have a chance to react.
06 Jun 2010, 4:07 pm
06 Jun 2010, 4:34 pm
Jaydee wrote:
Quote:
No, of course some crazy people are impossible to stop from obtaining a gun and going on a murder-spree. And if you want a gun bad enough and you're willing to break the law to own it, then so be it. BUT research has shown that normal gunowners' guns are more often than not used against them in a crisis situation. They end up getting shot by their own guns, they end up shooting innocent people by mistake, or they facilitate homicide in the family, a man killing his wife or vice versa, a kid shooting his mom. That's just tragic. Few of the guns owned by an average American comes out as a useful tool for protection against violence only.
Who’s research, HCI (Handgun Control Inc)? I’ve heard that “statistical data” before and most of us independent minded gun people don’t buy into it.
Certainly the opportunity is there for your own gun to be turned on you and it DOES happen but not nearly enough to warrant NOT having a gun in fear of that happening. Your chances of getting killed or injured by everyday risks are much higher and many of these are avoided by more caution. For example I’m much more concerned about getting killed/injured on the 25 mile drive to work then back than about getting shot with one of my own guns.
That’s just one example and I don’t see a need to do a whole list of every day possibilities.
This is really a matter of weighing the risks rather than hand-wringing over all the possibilities.
If you live in fear of being shot out of anger by a family member then you have other issues to deal with.
Quote:
Get the guns away from people.
Good luck!
Try something easier like making the earth turn in the opposite direction.
Quote:
I'm also quite sure that a burglar holding a gun would prefer not to fire a gun against an unarmed houseowner. He is in the house, after all, "just" to rob. If he meets an armed man, however, then the chance for the houseowner to get away alive is minimal. Killing a robber in order to protect one's silverware or flatscreen-tv is so not worth it.
I could pick this apart and write a volume about it but I’ll get to the most important part of it.
My home is my castle: I have not stocked it with posessions bought with my own money just to have others to come and take them at will.
More than that it’s an invasion of my domain! It’s hard for me to imagine anyone not being infuriated by the idea having their home breeched.
I will assume just out of prudence that anyone breeching my home is an armed intruder and I'll act accordingly.
Another thing I can assure you of is that a series of burglars getting capped in an area will put a stop to it better than anything else ever could.
10 Jun 2010, 10:35 am
11 Jun 2010, 7:49 am
11 Jun 2010, 11:03 pm
MotherKnowsBest wrote:
Raptor wrote:
Jaydee wrote:
John_Browning wrote:
Another example of how well "gun-free" zones work.
The "gun-free" zones (countries with strict firearms regulations) sure work quite a lot better than the places where guns can be bought by every Tom, Dick or Harry at the nearest mall. Tragic incidents like this will happen, but do not say that gun regulations do not work, because they do.No, they do not work. There is no logical way for them to work.
What do they accomplish? Making something illegal does not make it impossible to obtain.
We’re not talking about taking things from babies in a playpen. You can’t keep people from getting what they want if they want it bad enough. A classic example would be the War on Drugs, what a joke!
About all you get is that the law abiding citizens, in fear of the law, are disarmed and unable to protect themselves against deadly force which gives the criminal element a target rich environment to operate generally un-opposed.
Personally, I feel much safer in a state where I’m lawfully permitted to carry a concealed handgun. This at least gives me fighting chance as long as I have a chance to react.
Of course they don't. The fact that the UK has some of the tightest gun laws in the world and also one of the lowest gun death rates in the world is mere coincidence.
The UK also has some ridiculous assaults, violent crime, and a creeping police state...
11 Jun 2010, 11:06 pm
John_Browning
Veteran
Joined: 22 Mar 2009
Age: 42
Gender: Male
Posts: 4,456
Location: The shooting range
12 Jun 2010, 1:18 am
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