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hanyo
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20 Apr 2012, 11:40 am

"She told the coroner she believed he had taken literally a comment made to him by the link-worker that "he'd be better off dead than in college education"."

It's bad enough that some cruel immature kids bullied him, that part is even more appalling. That person should at the very least lose their job.

I felt bad enough when the school counselor told me that it was my fault that people were mean to me because of the way I acted. I can't even imagine how I would have felt if they told me I should be dead.



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20 Apr 2012, 11:42 am

techstepgenr8tion wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
techstepgenr8tion wrote:
Sometimes people can pound on a person until there's no life left worth living - particularly when every advantage is being stolen and you can tell they'll never be able to make it financially. I agree, better dead than miserable but it goes to show - this world has a lot of people who need a good old fashion chin-checking.



8O wow I hope that isen't a common justification for such behavior.

Lets go back to square one. The people who were messing with him need a chin-checking.


I agree, but still that is a terrible excuse....so I hope that is not seriously the logic such people have, because that is very dangerous indeed.


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techstepgenr8tion
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20 Apr 2012, 12:03 pm

I'm sorry, but I'm really getting the impression that I have no idea what you're saying or where you're going with it.


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Sweetleaf
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20 Apr 2012, 12:28 pm

techstepgenr8tion wrote:
I'm sorry, but I'm really getting the impression that I have no idea what you're saying or where you're going with it.


That I hope people don't seriously think it's ok to beat someone down, because they don't think that person will make it financially.....is what I was saying, in response to you bringing up that point since I think that would be a terrible justification for such behavior towards someone. I don't see what's not to get.


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techstepgenr8tion
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20 Apr 2012, 12:47 pm

What I was getting at is that being pounded on, especially through your formative years, can steal every advantage, ruin you financially, and that I can't relate to people who would scorn a person's decision to commit suicide when things get that bad. Bullying can quite literally ruin lives, the "You did it to yourself" requires a frame of reference that takes a different life and completely different (often very sheltered) set of formative experiences as opposed to what a perpetual bullying victim has at their disposal. For as much as many people go on about empathy its tough to really get any impression that most people have any knack for imagining what living on a completely different path and completely different internal/existential reality would be like nor what it would mean.


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20 Apr 2012, 1:01 pm

techstepgenr8tion wrote:
What I was getting at is that being pounded on, especially through your formative years, can steal every advantage, ruin you financially, and that I can't relate to people who would scorn a person's decision to commit suicide when things get that bad. Bullying can quite literally ruin lives, the "You did it to yourself" requires a frame of reference that takes a different life and completely different (often very sheltered) set of formative experiences as opposed to what a perpetual bullying victim has at their disposal. For as much as many people go on about empathy its tough to really get any impression that most people have any knack for imagining what living on a completely different path and completely different internal/existential reality would be like nor what it would mean.


I think we are in agreement then.


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PastFixations
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20 Apr 2012, 3:06 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:

As for the article I doubt him taking the comment about being better off dead than in college literally was the 'cause' I can see how that could have been a factor if he was already feeling that way, and in pain from all the bullying and such and took it literally, but to point to that as the cause and ignore the long-term bullying and harrasment would be ignorant in my perspective

It is possible he could have taken it literally if he was gullable along with the students 'fueling the fire'.


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20 Apr 2012, 3:08 pm

PastFixations wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:

As for the article I doubt him taking the comment about being better off dead than in college literally was the 'cause' I can see how that could have been a factor if he was already feeling that way, and in pain from all the bullying and such and took it literally, but to point to that as the cause and ignore the long-term bullying and harrasment would be ignorant in my perspective

It is possible he could have taken it literally along with the students 'fueling the fire'.


It certainly is, I just don't think it was just that comment....it could have certainly contributed though especially if he was already depressed.


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20 Apr 2012, 3:17 pm

Yeah I agree that it would not be that comment alone would provoke this action. However that comment may have given him that final bit of ammunition he needed to take his life. If the comment was made on the same day than it does look likely this college staff member will be partly to blame.


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21 Apr 2012, 8:11 am

Let's see:
* Talk about suicide for 7 years (11-18)
* Unavailable social and medical services in Suffolk
* Ignorant staff at West Suffolk College and a good supply of bullies.

His mother got an "apology from Suffolk Police for not dealing with it more robustly". Yeah helpful, after the fact.

So any punishment for bullies or staff.. no?, and definitively no change in policy to hinder this from repeating?, no lessons learned.

(what's a "link-worker" ?)



PastFixations
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21 Apr 2012, 12:32 pm

Keyman wrote:

So any punishment for bullies or staff.. no?, and definitively no change in policy to hinder this from repeating?, no lessons learned.

(what's a "link-worker" ?)

Exactly, I suspect there is no action taken and any bets that the people involved won't apologise for what they did. I bet they knew he had Autism as well.
I dunno what a link-worker is either but I doubt they are all like that. Might be some sort of person who supplies temporary work for the students.


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21 Apr 2012, 1:19 pm

I hope someone sets up a bullies hall of shame photo gallery .. :twisted:
And give the school bad reputation.



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21 Apr 2012, 6:42 pm

Keyman wrote:
I hope someone sets up a bullies hall of shame photo gallery .. :twisted:
And give the school bad reputation.


This is an ongoing issue in schools here in Australia. The victims of bullying are pretty much anyone who doesn't quite fit in with the in-crowd.

The stereotype that bullies are only kids from the poor side of town who get beaten up by their drunken father and take out their frustrations on other kids is not representative of reality. My experience in a private college was that most of the bullying is perpetrated by the rich prefect kids (male and female) who ironically are academically bright and socially successful.

Part of the problem is western society encourages competitiveness and "winner" "loser" type cognition is nurtured in school. The underlying reasons for bullying and social ostracism that leads kids to bully to the point the victim commits suicide are far deeper than we like to admit.



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21 Apr 2012, 6:45 pm

cyberdad wrote:
Keyman wrote:
I hope someone sets up a bullies hall of shame photo gallery .. :twisted:
And give the school bad reputation.


This is an ongoing issue in schools here in Australia. The victims of bullying are pretty much anyone who doesn't quite fit in with the in-crowd.

The stereotype that bullies are only kids from the poor side of town who get beaten up by their drunken father and take out their frustrations on other kids is not representative of reality. My experience in a private college was that most of the bullying is perpetrated by the rich prefect kids (male and female) who ironically are academically bright and socially successful.

Part of the problem is western society encourages competitiveness and "winner" "loser" type cognition is nurtured in school. The underlying reasons for bullying and social ostracism that leads kids to bully to the point the victim commits suicide are far deeper than we like to admit.


Wow its weird there sometimes seems to be that sterotype here, when usually its the ones with the socially popular kids with nice home lives bullying those who have problems at home. I mean I wasn't the one bullying the kids who fit in and had successful parents and all they where the ones bullying me it was like there was a cool club and I was never invited.


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Keyman
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21 Apr 2012, 7:01 pm

I think there's a large proportion of "well adapted" kids that bully because "it's fun" or something exciting to do and see what happens.

The only remedy seems to be a school environment that is positive, or that personnel discipline the bullies straight away, and the last resort that the victim or proxy plainly beat the bullies physically.

Until it's resolved suicides and school shootings will continue. And no one should be surprised thereof.



Sweetleaf
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21 Apr 2012, 7:03 pm

Keyman wrote:
I think there's a large proportion of "well adapted" kids that bully because "it's fun" or something exciting to do and see what happens.

The only remedy seems to be a school environment that is positive, or that personnel discipline the bullies straight away, and the last resort that the victim or proxy plainly beat the bullies physically.

Until it's resolved suicides and school shootings will continue. And no one should be surprised thereof.



Yeah no kidding, and there were times I wanted to show them something 'exciting' but it's probably good I never did.


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