Passengers support Autistic girl forced off plane

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Moromillas
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10 May 2015, 7:12 pm

Magneto wrote:
Moromillas wrote:
FMX wrote:
Was she actually a threat to anyone? Probably not.


No, not probably, definitely not. Autism or Asperger's doesn't cause you to turn violent, and nor does a 15 year old girl become violent. So, no -- not a threat, not even a slight chance.

I don't know, biting someone is fairly violent...


No one's biting anyone.



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10 May 2015, 10:27 pm

*sigh*

The mother told them her daughter could bite and scratch if she doesn't get what she wants which I think was the real reason why they landed the plane and kicked them off. Violence is not okay so it was for the safety of the other passengers. If the mother hadn't made that threat, I bet they wouldn't have gotten kicked off.


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11 May 2015, 8:29 am

I keep reading that the mom "threatened". The mom explained what could happen if her daughter had a meltdown. That is not the same as a threat at all. Who had control, at that point, of whether the child melted down? Not the mother, therefore how could her words be a threat? If she didn't give that information, everyone would be criticizing her for not letting the flight attendant know what was happening.
I've flown a lot, domestically and internationally, so here's some things I know:
1) Flight attendants are frequently narcissistic, gossipy, uneducated jerks who like to abuse whatever authority they're given. Especially the American ones.
2) Airline food is small, prepackaged, and there are extras. Getting that kid some hot food would have taken about 30 seconds and cost the airline $0 (mom offered to buy it).

This story is really about an ignorant pig of a flight attendant who got "revenge" by having a family kicked off a plane.
I should add, United is my least favorite airline to fly. They have creaky planes that sound like they're going to fall apart midflight, and they always put one at least one piece of my luggage on a different plane. That means I have to go to their office to find it, or sometimes fill out papers and have it delivered later. They deserve to go out of business quickly.



Aristophanes
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11 May 2015, 9:36 am

I just read this article on yahoo's site and read the comments there...we truly live in a world of gleeful ignorance. Some of my favorites:

"The other passengers and airline should sue the girl's family for the disruption so they learn their lesson."

"I'm a special education teacher, I know how autistic kids work. It sounds like the girl had poor parenting and was used to getting everything she wants. I see that with a lot of my students, they choose not to behave and you have to be vigilant enforcing rules with them. Autistics are the worst, they'll continue to do things you explicitly tell them not to regardless of the punishment you hand out. I love all my students but I'd rather not deal with autistics if my job didn't require it."

"Airline sensitivity training for autism? How about if you're mentally ill you just don't get on a flight where you're a danger to everyone else."

"The mom's first mistake wasn't asking for a meal it was getting her child vaccinated in the first place. Bet she wishes she could go back in time and change that but now she's got a daughter with brain damage. I don't feel sorry for her, she made her own stupid choice."



Aristophanes
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11 May 2015, 9:43 am

YippySkippy wrote:
I keep reading that the mom "threatened". The mom explained what could happen if her daughter had a meltdown. That is not the same as a threat at all. Who had control, at that point, of whether the child melted down? Not the mother, therefore how could her words be a threat? If she didn't give that information, everyone would be criticizing her for not letting the flight attendant know what was happening.
I've flown a lot, domestically and internationally, so here's some things I know:
1) Flight attendants are frequently narcissistic, gossipy, uneducated jerks who like to abuse whatever authority they're given. Especially the American ones.
2) Airline food is small, prepackaged, and there are extras. Getting that kid some hot food would have taken about 30 seconds and cost the airline $0 (mom offered to buy it).

This story is really about an ignorant pig of a flight attendant who got "revenge" by having a family kicked off a plane.
I should add, United is my least favorite airline to fly. They have creaky planes that sound like they're going to fall apart midflight, and they always put one at least one piece of my luggage on a different plane. That means I have to go to their office to find it, or sometimes fill out papers and have it delivered later. They deserve to go out of business quickly.

Well, meltdown doesn't mean the same for us as it does NT's. We hear meltdown and know it generally is nothing more than an emotional release, generally non-violent and very temporary. To NT's it sounds like crazy madman is gonna go super duper crazy and rampage, kill, and destroy everything he sees until someone stops him.



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11 May 2015, 11:01 am

Aristophanes wrote:
Well, meltdown doesn't mean the same for us as it does NT's. We hear meltdown and know it generally is nothing more than an emotional release, generally non-violent and very temporary. To NT's it sounds like crazy madman is gonna go super duper crazy and rampage, kill, and destroy everything he sees until someone stops him.

I was a bit surprised at the response of the airline staff because I figured that the average person doesn't know what "meltdown" means. I'd never heard the term before I started reading about Asperger's Syndrome.



League_Girl
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11 May 2015, 11:54 am

Aristophanes wrote:
YippySkippy wrote:
I keep reading that the mom "threatened". The mom explained what could happen if her daughter had a meltdown. That is not the same as a threat at all. Who had control, at that point, of whether the child melted down? Not the mother, therefore how could her words be a threat? If she didn't give that information, everyone would be criticizing her for not letting the flight attendant know what was happening.
I've flown a lot, domestically and internationally, so here's some things I know:
1) Flight attendants are frequently narcissistic, gossipy, uneducated jerks who like to abuse whatever authority they're given. Especially the American ones.
2) Airline food is small, prepackaged, and there are extras. Getting that kid some hot food would have taken about 30 seconds and cost the airline $0 (mom offered to buy it).

This story is really about an ignorant pig of a flight attendant who got "revenge" by having a family kicked off a plane.
I should add, United is my least favorite airline to fly. They have creaky planes that sound like they're going to fall apart midflight, and they always put one at least one piece of my luggage on a different plane. That means I have to go to their office to find it, or sometimes fill out papers and have it delivered later. They deserve to go out of business quickly.

Well, meltdown doesn't mean the same for us as it does NT's. We hear meltdown and know it generally is nothing more than an emotional release, generally non-violent and very temporary. To NT's it sounds like crazy madman is gonna go super duper crazy and rampage, kill, and destroy everything he sees until someone stops him.


She said her girl will TRY AND SCRATCH, and that is where they reacted. To that.

I keep seeing parents use the word meltdown and then mention aggression and what does that tell everyone there about meltdowns? I even see people on the spectrum call an aggression a meltdown and how does that even help?


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11 May 2015, 12:16 pm

Here is another article with more detail


https://gma.yahoo.com/woman-claims-she- ... ories.html


It also explains why she couldn't bring food on the plane and she said her daughter was special needs not autistic. But she still said she would try and scratch after she mentioned the word meltdown.


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11 May 2015, 1:34 pm

So the message to parents seems to be this: when you fly, don't tell anyone your kid is autistic. Don't give them any warning or heads-up whatsoever, because they might kick you off the flight. Just wing it and hope for the best, and if your kid acts up just pretend you're as surprised as they are. Got it. Seems like a stupid way to go about things, but then the world is often a stupid, stupid place.



Aristophanes
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11 May 2015, 2:09 pm

League_Girl wrote:
Aristophanes wrote:
YippySkippy wrote:
I keep reading that the mom "threatened". The mom explained what could happen if her daughter had a meltdown. That is not the same as a threat at all. Who had control, at that point, of whether the child melted down? Not the mother, therefore how could her words be a threat? If she didn't give that information, everyone would be criticizing her for not letting the flight attendant know what was happening.
I've flown a lot, domestically and internationally, so here's some things I know:
1) Flight attendants are frequently narcissistic, gossipy, uneducated jerks who like to abuse whatever authority they're given. Especially the American ones.
2) Airline food is small, prepackaged, and there are extras. Getting that kid some hot food would have taken about 30 seconds and cost the airline $0 (mom offered to buy it).

This story is really about an ignorant pig of a flight attendant who got "revenge" by having a family kicked off a plane.
I should add, United is my least favorite airline to fly. They have creaky planes that sound like they're going to fall apart midflight, and they always put one at least one piece of my luggage on a different plane. That means I have to go to their office to find it, or sometimes fill out papers and have it delivered later. They deserve to go out of business quickly.

Well, meltdown doesn't mean the same for us as it does NT's. We hear meltdown and know it generally is nothing more than an emotional release, generally non-violent and very temporary. To NT's it sounds like crazy madman is gonna go super duper crazy and rampage, kill, and destroy everything he sees until someone stops him.


She said her girl will TRY AND SCRATCH, and that is where they reacted. To that.

I keep seeing parents use the word meltdown and then mention aggression and what does that tell everyone there about meltdowns? I even see people on the spectrum call an aggression a meltdown and how does that even help?


Well, stop using the word meltdown. It's basically used in the NT world when they see behavior they think is "crazy":

"Jim got fired today. He had a total meltdown as he was leaving."

Um, yes, he just got fired is he supposed to not emotionally feel that? Lol. So 95% of the population views it as taboo or tied to the word nuclear at the front-- it just doesn't have a positive connotation at all, which makes it easy for pea-brain flight attendants to confuse the two uses of the word in their mind.



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11 May 2015, 2:17 pm

YippySkippy wrote:
So the message to parents seems to be this: when you fly, don't tell anyone your kid is autistic. Don't give them any warning or heads-up whatsoever, because they might kick you off the flight. Just wing it and hope for the best, and if your kid acts up just pretend you're as surprised as they are. Got it. Seems like a stupid way to go about things, but then the world is often a stupid, stupid place.



I have strong feelings against aggression so if anyone is prone to it, I think the pilot was in the right because safety always comes first and I wouldn't feel comfortable sitting close to someone who may scratch and autism would have nothing to do with, I do not fear autism, I fear violence. And she did not get kicked off the plane she is autistic, she was kicked off because the mother said she will try and scratch. I saw in two other articles she will lash out at others so the mother did mean she will try and scratch others.

And I thought autism doesn't cause violence so why do people keep saying she got kicked off for being autistic or for fear of autism? It was due to the possibility that she might scratch others. If the mother wouldn't have said that she may lash out if they don't do what she wants, then they wouldn't have been kicked off in the first place.


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11 May 2015, 2:24 pm

Aristophanes wrote:
League_Girl wrote:
Aristophanes wrote:
YippySkippy wrote:
I keep reading that the mom "threatened". The mom explained what could happen if her daughter had a meltdown. That is not the same as a threat at all. Who had control, at that point, of whether the child melted down? Not the mother, therefore how could her words be a threat? If she didn't give that information, everyone would be criticizing her for not letting the flight attendant know what was happening.
I've flown a lot, domestically and internationally, so here's some things I know:
1) Flight attendants are frequently narcissistic, gossipy, uneducated jerks who like to abuse whatever authority they're given. Especially the American ones.
2) Airline food is small, prepackaged, and there are extras. Getting that kid some hot food would have taken about 30 seconds and cost the airline $0 (mom offered to buy it).

This story is really about an ignorant pig of a flight attendant who got "revenge" by having a family kicked off a plane.
I should add, United is my least favorite airline to fly. They have creaky planes that sound like they're going to fall apart midflight, and they always put one at least one piece of my luggage on a different plane. That means I have to go to their office to find it, or sometimes fill out papers and have it delivered later. They deserve to go out of business quickly.

Well, meltdown doesn't mean the same for us as it does NT's. We hear meltdown and know it generally is nothing more than an emotional release, generally non-violent and very temporary. To NT's it sounds like crazy madman is gonna go super duper crazy and rampage, kill, and destroy everything he sees until someone stops him.


She said her girl will TRY AND SCRATCH, and that is where they reacted. To that.

I keep seeing parents use the word meltdown and then mention aggression and what does that tell everyone there about meltdowns? I even see people on the spectrum call an aggression a meltdown and how does that even help?


Well, stop using the word meltdown. It's basically used in the NT world when they see behavior they think is "crazy":

"Jim got fired today. He had a total meltdown as he was leaving."

Um, yes, he just got fired is he supposed to not emotionally feel that? Lol. So 95% of the population views it as taboo or tied to the word nuclear at the front-- it just doesn't have a positive connotation at all, which makes it easy for pea-brain flight attendants to confuse the two uses of the word in their mind.



The mother said her daughter may try and scratch and if you look it up online, you will find two other articles that mention that she would lash out at others so the mother did mean that she will try and scratch others. If the mother hadn't mentioned that her daughter may do that, chances are they wouldn't have gotten kicked off. But safety comes first.

It will be like me saying "If I don't get my food, maybe if I have an anxiety attack, maybe you will then help me if I start to hit others or throw things I can get my hands on." Yeah that will go well. But would I be kicked off because they feared anxiety disorders or because it was for the safety of others and what I said? I could replace the word with meltdown. I always thought a meltdown was crying and screaming and having all these emotions inside of you and you cannot calm down, not that it meant doing aggression and destroying property and throwing things lol. But that is the word people use for aggression including ASD people. They like to blame violence on a meltdown.


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12 May 2015, 6:27 am

YippySkippy wrote:
So the message to parents seems to be this: when you fly, don't tell anyone your kid is autistic. Don't give them any warning or heads-up whatsoever, because they might kick you off the flight. Just wing it and hope for the best, and if your kid acts up just pretend you're as surprised as they are. Got it. Seems like a stupid way to go about things, but then the world is often a stupid, stupid place.


No, the message is: Don't threaten the crew, that if your child doesn't get some hot food now, she is going to start scratching people. Once you say that, the captain would be irresponsible to do anything other then to get you off the plane as soon as possible.


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russdm
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12 May 2015, 2:48 pm

It sounds to me like the mother's comments mean that she is holding some kind of barely controlled aggressive dog, like her daughter will attack on command or something. It just comes across as her being flippant and sarcastically difficult. There were better ways to phrase how the daughter would react to problems, and adding the part about when they would listen doesn't sound very safe sounding, more like the mom would unleash her or something. She should/could have explained in a better way that sounds less sarcastic and semi-threatening than she side.

I don't think the pilot had any other option to land the plane because despite what we might hope, there are chances that some meltdowns will have violence that can not be controlled and Autistic individuals may not always be able to re-assert control without having accidentally hurt someone. In the extremely rare instance, some may not even care. Despite that, the pilot would not have known what kind of person he was dealing with, and with the terrorist scares (legitmate and otherwise), landing and checking with the police was more right to do.

In my opinion, the mother shares some blame for presenting the issue in a fairly threatening sounding fashion which caused concerns; the flight attendant shares blame for perhaps not reporting matters/details completely accurately possibly; there is blame to go around here, but none on the daughter I think.



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12 May 2015, 11:39 pm

Aristophanes wrote:
I just read this article on yahoo's site and read the comments there...we truly live in a world of gleeful ignorance. Some of my favorites:

"The other passengers and airline should sue the girl's family for the disruption so they learn their lesson."

"I'm a special education teacher, I know how autistic kids work. It sounds like the girl had poor parenting and was used to getting everything she wants. I see that with a lot of my students, they choose not to behave and you have to be vigilant enforcing rules with them. Autistics are the worst, they'll continue to do things you explicitly tell them not to regardless of the punishment you hand out. I love all my students but I'd rather not deal with autistics if my job didn't require it."

"Airline sensitivity training for autism? How about if you're mentally ill you just don't get on a flight where you're a danger to everyone else."

"The mom's first mistake wasn't asking for a meal it was getting her child vaccinated in the first place. Bet she wishes she could go back in time and change that but now she's got a daughter with brain damage. I don't feel sorry for her, she made her own stupid choice."

Yahoo comments are alway awful regardless of the story.


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Moromillas
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13 May 2015, 3:07 am

YippySkippy wrote:
So the message to parents seems to be this: when you fly, don't tell anyone your kid is autistic. Don't give them any warning or heads-up whatsoever, because they might kick you off the flight. Just wing it and hope for the best, and if your kid acts up just pretend you're as surprised as they are. Got it. Seems like a stupid way to go about things, but then the world is often a stupid, stupid place.


You're very close, one of the few that seem to be catching on. Though it's not just for flying, and not just for parents with AS kids.

We need to pretend we're as NT as humanly possible, keep our heads down, and our mouths shut, or else -- That's the message.