Why Satanists may be the last, best hope to save abortion..

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https://www.churchofsatan.com/

No, but they are the largest group and have influenced basically every group that's come up since. Even Satanic faiths that aren't part of so-called 'rational Satanism' have still been influenced by CoS and LaVey.

The Satanic Temple also fits under the description that goldfish gave, so does the First Satanic Church. Even other groups that claim to be further from LaVey's influence end up demonstrating it, like the Temple of Set.

Thing is I'm not sure I'd call them proper Satanists. Satan is just a figure head to them. It's like a Church that calls itself the Church of Christ, but doesn't believe Christ was a historical person, doesn't believe the Resurrection was real, etc. The Church of Self Interest and Hedonism is a better description imo.

I used to fixate on that aspect more but have come to accept that if they're using Satan as a mascot to draw attention to their rejection of toxic Christian norms that calling themselves Satanists helps draw attention to their more active rejection of that stuff compared to other atheists and secular humanists.

There are Satanists out there who actually do worship Satan as a for real entity. They generally aren't public about their beliefs.

While I’m a bit uncomfortable talking about this in a thread with so much Satan discussion, here goes.

It comes down to the real life reasons women end up having abortions. Without writing a book, lack of comprehensive, affordable healthcare and lack of proper information about conception top the list. So when healthcare and information access are increased, abortion goes down dramatically. When poverty is decreased, abortion goes down dramatically. Address these factors, and you pretty much solve the issue. You not only decrease abortion dramatically, but you also improve the outcomes for pregnant women and babies across the board. We have an embarrassingly high maternal and infant mortality rate for a developed nation; I don’t know why the pro-life political movement doesn’t seem to care about those babies. There will always be some abortions that are more elective, but those women also have the resources to get their abortions somewhere else if need be, so you really can’t affect those outcomes. You also can’t affect the abortions done out of medical necessity unless we get the medical profession to change its terminology; even removal of a dead fetus enters the data as an abortion. The proof the measures work is in the Netherlands, which has a lower abortion rate than most countries where it is illegal.

You should also be aware that I’ve had two different friends who have said they would never have had abortions if it had been legal at the time. They were underage and forced into it by adults. One had no idea that what her boyfriend talked her into was sex.

Societal attitudes towards out of wedlock birth also factor in, as does making it possible for teen mothers to complete their education by providing free childcare.

As Christians all these other measures should be things we support. They are part of caring for our neighbors.

Fear of something you don't understand isn't rational


These are like a gathering of comi-con enthusiasts who dress up for the fun of it and do re-enactments of what they adopt form their understanding of satan. They are a joke but mostly harmless.

Satan from the bible is a deity worshipped in prehistoric times in the middle east. Even ancient historians are not in consensus what this deity represents. I doubt a bunch of alternative types draped in togas and tatoos who smoke weed, sacrifice chickens and engage in group sex would be wiser on ancient pre-christian gods unless they have a time machine.


Wait, I thought you are a scientist?? why do you carry such thoughts?



I can't speak for what all cults do behind closed doors but my understanding is most of these people who call themselves "satantists" are into heavy metal music and do this as some lifestyle choice. Banning such groups only glamorises the enticement for young rebellious teens to join (as they think its subversive). There are many traditionalist cultures in your neighbourhood from various east Asian and south American countries who also sacrifice animals in the privacy of their own homes, One of the biggest mass sacrifice of animals takes place on the island of Bali where literally thousands of animals are sacrificed to the spirits yet Bali was (pre-COVID) the most popular tourist destination in the world.

I'm not saying we should be free to engage in this type of behaviour (I'm 100% against animal cruelty) but it seems somewhat hypocritical as we all eat slaughtered animals. As for sacrificing babies, that's criminal and such people should be caught and tried but what evidence is there for this?

Last edited by cyberdad on 05 Sep 2021, 7:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I get the appeal of Satan as a fictional character. He is a sexy cool rebel. But a Church whose basic precepts are look out for number one and enjoy yourself in the present seems a bit weak to me. I agree with both of those and their teaching of love those who love you and curse those who curse you, but I hardly see it as the basis of a Church with goth rituals.

They're not very common, but even if they were, who cares?

Yes, even those who adopt "goth rituals" just make this stuff up. Most of these kids have no idea of geography or history so I wouldn't be surprised if they didn't even know who the goths were

A barbarian tribe in central Europe in the early Christian era when the Roman Empire was still a thing. But that's not quite what I meant.

I still remember when the heshers and the punks combined forces and made off with all the gothic womens.

The level of importance attributed to these "rituals" is in the eye if the beholder.

There is no Satan and the only true evil in this world is in humankind.

I think Shakespeare said it best
"hell is empty and all the devils are here"

Somehow that quote reminds me of this dramatic scene from The Tudors. The people laughing like stupid donkeys in such a cruel and hypocritical manner at a disgraced Cardinal Wosley before he commits suicide in his cell is pretty much how I view the entire human race...