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At least 17 dead in Florida School Shooting

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Tim_Tex
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20 Feb 2018, 2:45 pm

RainbowUnion wrote:
League_Girl wrote:
Please don't be autistic


I don't believe he was. However, remember the Batman movie mass shooting? I do think that guy was.


I think James Holmes had schizophrenia.


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20 Feb 2018, 2:49 pm

Tim_Tex wrote:
RainbowUnion wrote:
League_Girl wrote:
Please don't be autistic


I don't believe he was. However, remember the Batman movie mass shooting? I do think that guy was.


I think James Holmes had schizophrenia.


He was highly educated, with an advanced degree that is very hard to finish...and he couldn't get a job. He also had that look. Yes, you cant tell autism by looking at someone but...you know what I mean right, that Aspie look?


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20 Feb 2018, 3:17 pm

psychiatric assessment was that Holmes had paranoid schizophrenia, the same as Ted Kazcysinski the unibomber

Another diagnosis that leads to mass killings



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21 Feb 2018, 12:00 pm

RainbowUnion wrote:
He was highly educated, with an advanced degree that is very hard to finish...and he couldn't get a job. He also had that look. Yes, you cant tell autism by looking at someone but...you know what I mean right, that Aspie look?

His college classmates described him as a "dunce".

Highly educated but lower IQ it seems.

"In 2012, Holmes's academic performance declined,and he scored poorly on the comprehensive exam in the spring. The university was not planning to expel him; however, Holmes was in the process of withdrawing from the university.Three days after failing a key oral exam at the university in early June 2012, Holmes dropped out of his studies without further explanation."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Hol ... s_murderer)


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23 Feb 2018, 3:41 pm

I don't think very many people think this is the ideal solution..

https://www.facebook.com/groups/futrump ... 136226070/


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23 Feb 2018, 9:32 pm

if the NRA types get their way and mandate arming all teachers, it will be a land office business for the legal profession the very minute an inept but "trained" teacher accidently shoots an innocent student. it is the height of arrogance and ableism to insist that everybody is equally well-suited to handle firearms in critical situations, especially when the supposed professionals in this regard [cops] have been known to screw up alarmingly often. if cops who are trained in the first place to do this for a living screw up, what does that say about everybody else?



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23 Feb 2018, 9:41 pm

^bingo


it appears the same people who want to arm teachers also cry about taxation being theft and take every opportunity to cut them more and more - do they think training all these teachers to handle guns responsibly and effectively is free? :roll:

who's paying for it?

in my experience, most high school teachers were hardly any less disjointed than the students they wrangle on a daily basis.


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24 Feb 2018, 11:50 am

goldfish21 wrote:
This guy decided to be part of the solution:

https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php? ... 7513365065


He's an idiot as are those others participating in #oneless.
It's not just what he said ,dumb as it was, but what he does. He has made a video of himself committing a federal felony. Rifles are required by law to have a barrel length of 16" or more (18" for shotguns). By cutting it off any length less than that, even that ridiculously short length that shitforbrains has cut his down to, makes it an SBR (Short Barreled Rifle).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Short-barreled_rifle

From the article:
Quote:
Short-barreled rifle (SBR) is a legal designation in the United States, referring to a shoulder-fired, rifled firearm, made from a rifle, with a barrel length of less than 16 in (41 cm) or overall length of less than 26 in (66 cm), or a handgun fitted with a buttstock and a barrel of less than 16 inches length. In the United States, an SBR is an item regulated by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (BATFE) as a Title II weapon. In the absence of local laws prohibiting ownership, American civilians may own an SBR provided it is registered with the BATFE, and a $200 tax is paid prior to taking possession of or creating the firearm.


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In the United States, it is a federal felony to possess an SBR unless it is registered with the ATF to the person who possesses it. Class 2 manufacturers, Class 3 dealers and government agencies will transfer these firearms tax exempt but individuals must pay a tax of $200 to manufacture or transfer an SBR. ATF notification is required when transporting an SBR across state lines; this is accomplished by filing Form 5320.20 in advance of the travel date. SBRs may not be taken into states where they are prohibited except with prior approval from the ATF.


To add insult to injury, he did not destroy the AR-15 and even as it is it in it's F'ed up state will still fire as many rounds as you want to put through it as the parts that make it work as a firearm by definition are still intact. It will not fire semi-auto with 5.56 (.223 Rem) ammo since he cut the gas tube which is above the barrel but it would fire semi-auto with a .22 LR conversion kit.

Shitforbrains probably threw the two halves of the cut rifle in the trash can and now some kid or anyone else can find it and pull it out. A replacement barrel, gas tube, and handguards can be bought from several online sources as well as the barrel wrench to replace the barrel with. Instructions on how to it (it's easy) can be found in several online sources. On an AR-15 It's only the lower receiver (and not even the internal parts of it) that you have to do the same paperwork and NICS check as purchasing a whole weapon. Legally speaking; ALL of the other parts are as easy to buy as a two liter bottle of Coke.

Shitforbrains should have just cut the lower receiver in two and that would have legally and effectively destroyed the rifle and satisfied his need to feel better :roll: :roll:, and not opened himself up to federal and probably state charges (which he created proof of committing a crime with this idiotic video :roll:)

About all this #oneless stupidity has done for me and several other AR-15 owners is make us want to buy another one.


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24 Feb 2018, 12:05 pm

Kiprobalhato wrote:
^bingo


it appears the same people who want to arm teachers also cry about taxation being theft and take every opportunity to cut them more and more - do they think training all these teachers to handle guns responsibly and effectively is free? :roll:

who's paying for it?

in my experience, most high school teachers were hardly any less disjointed than the students they wrangle on a daily basis.


I would be for allowing armed teachers and other school employees strictly on a volunteer basis. As a CYA measure, the board of education and/or the state would probably (and wisely) require those carrying in school to undergo some tactical handgun training provided by either local LE agencies or a private trainers with periodic re-qualification.

The guns would be required to be kept well concealed and always on the person carrying it, not left in an unlocked desk. Who all is authorized to carry would be kept confidential.

I'ts not a perfect solution but better than waiting on the cops to show up to do something. There's a saying that when seconds count the police are only minutes away.


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24 Feb 2018, 12:42 pm

All the times authorities were warned about Nikolas Cruz

▪ Feb. 5, 2016: A Broward Sheriff’s Office deputy is told by an anonymous caller that Nikolas Cruz, then 17, had threatened on Instagram to shoot up his school and posted a photo of himself with guns. The information is forwarded to BSO Deputy Scot Peterson, a school resource officer at Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School.

▪ Sept. 23, 2016: A “peer counselor” reports to Peterson that Cruz had possibly ingested gasoline in a suicide attempt, was cutting himself and wanted to buy a gun. A mental health counselor advises against involuntary committing Cruz. The high school says it will conduct a threat assessment.

▪ Sept. 28, 2016: An investigator for the Florida Department of Children and Families rules Cruz is stable, despite “fresh cuts” on his arms. His mother, Lynda Cruz, says in the past he wrote “hate signs” on his book bag and had recently talked of buying firearms.

▪ Sept. 24, 2017: A YouTube user named “nikolas cruz” posts a comment stating he wants to become a “professional school shooter.” The comment is reported to the FBI in Mississippi, which fails to make the connection to Cruz in South Florida.

▪ Nov. 1, 2017: Katherine Blaine, Lynda Cruz’s cousin, calls BSO to report that Nikolas Cruz had weapons and asks that police recover them. A “close family friend” agrees to take the firearms, according to BSO.

▪ Nov. 29, 2017: The Palm Beach County family that took in Cruz after the death of his mother calls the Palm Beach Sheriff’s Office to report a fight between him and their son, 22. A member of the family says Cruz had threatened to “get his gun and come back” and that he has “put the gun to others’ heads in the past.” The family does not want him arrested once he calms down.

▪ Nov. 30, 2017: A caller from Massachusetts calls BSO to report that Cruz is collecting guns and knives and could be a “school shooter in the making.” A BSO deputy advises the caller to contact the Palm Beach sheriff.

▪ Jan. 5, 2018: A caller to the FBI’s tip line reports that Cruz has “a desire to kill people” and could potentially conduct a school shooting. The information is never passed on to the FBI’s office in Miami.

▪ Feb. 14, 2018: Nikolas Cruz attacks Stoneman Douglas High. Peterson, the school’s resource officer, draws his gun outside the building where Cruz is shooting students and staff. He does not enter.

http://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/c ... 84874.html


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24 Feb 2018, 2:02 pm

There were trained people with firearms on site during the shooting - they didn't go in and deal with the shooter.

https://www.cnn.com/2018/02/23/politics ... index.html

So, what exactly good are armed people as a deterrent or to deal with the live situation unfolding? :?

Perhaps it's a better solution to figure out how to keep guns out of the hands of people like Nikolas Cruz..


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24 Feb 2018, 3:25 pm

Conspiracists are horrible, but you can disagree with Parkland teens on policy

Quote:
In the wake of the horrific slaughter in Parkland, Fla., a cadre of energized and understandably traumatized teenagers has flooded Washington and the airwaves to say remarkably passionate, occasionally extreme things about guns and the need for gun control.

Because these teens are politically effective, a bunch of goons, buffoons and trolls have floated conspiracy theories aimed at discrediting them.

At the same time, quite a few advocates of gun control, including many who claim the mantle of “objective” journalism, have taken the view that these kids cannot be criticized or gainsaid in any way. Apparently, it’s fine to push kids suffering from post-traumatic stress — or the still-grieving parents of murdered children — in front of cameras in order to drive public policy, but it’s an affront to decency to disagree with what they say or question the practice of using victims this way.

(No, it’s not morally equivalent to some of the horrendous things the swamp-dwellers have said about these kids, but that’s a low bar.)

Of course, the parents and the surviving kids aren’t being forced to do anything. They clearly want to be heard, and they have every right to do what they’re doing. Indeed, they’re entitled to their rage and grief. They are right to be furious.

But fury, in and of itself, is the enemy of reason. This point was once obvious to many of the people eagerly hiding behind these children to wage a political battle. In the wake of the 9/11 attacks — and countless terrorist attacks since then — the op-ed pages and the airwaves bulged with cautions that we not let “vengeance” or “anger” cloud our judgment.

I can scarcely imagine that the same people touting the unimpeachable wisdom of children would have the same position if the children of terror attack victims called for, say, a ban on Muslims entering the country.

Of course, the response from many people to this counterfactual would be, “But that’s a bad idea,” or, “That would be unconstitutional.”

And that’s my point exactly.

Of course, in real life it doesn’t always work that way. Sometimes, credibility or moral authority carries more weight than arguments. And perhaps more often, passion and emotion sways.

For instance, the NRA, not content with its public-policy and constitutional victories over the last decade, has taken to fomenting rage and resentment against “elites” and the media with all the precision of an unmanned fire hose.

As best as I can glean from some of the ads, the point seems to be that you should keep paying your dues because the NRA is the only thing that will keep gun owners from being triggered (so to speak) by The New York Times.

The introduction of child combatants in this political war seems only fitting in the never-ending cycles of exaggeration. So now we can hear children shout, “If you’re not with us, you’re against us!” Or, “If you’re against us, you’re in favor of murdering children!”

Of course I feel sorry for the victims, and I support their right to parrot the extreme rhetoric of their elders. I don’t feel sorry for the NRA.

When you turn the volume to 10 on everything, you shouldn’t be surprised when your opponents invent an even louder 11. But I am disgusted by the entire spectacle, and I feel sorry for a country that thinks any of this remotely normal.


The teens are being accussed of being “crisis actors”. My Facebook page has been flooded with this s**t.


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24 Feb 2018, 4:21 pm

The NRA are having a problem hiding this relationship
https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/magazine/m ... s-suicide/

In 2010 in the U.S., 19,392 people committed suicide with guns, compared with 11,078 who were killed by others.

Research by Harvard medical school suggests that if guns were banned then the rate of suicide would be reduced (fact) given there is higher chance of successfully killing yourself with a gun compared to using a kitchen knife or pills

My own theory is all of these mass shooters have a death wish and in the back of their mind know they will die in a blaze of glory



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24 Feb 2018, 4:37 pm

ASPartOfMe wrote:
Conspiracists are horrible, but you can disagree with Parkland teens on policy
Quote:
In the wake of the horrific slaughter in Parkland, Fla., a cadre of energized and understandably traumatized teenagers has flooded Washington and the airwaves to say remarkably passionate, occasionally extreme things about guns and the need for gun control.

Because these teens are politically effective, a bunch of goons, buffoons and trolls have floated conspiracy theories aimed at discrediting them.

At the same time, quite a few advocates of gun control, including many who claim the mantle of “objective” journalism, have taken the view that these kids cannot be criticized or gainsaid in any way. Apparently, it’s fine to push kids suffering from post-traumatic stress — or the still-grieving parents of murdered children — in front of cameras in order to drive public policy, but it’s an affront to decency to disagree with what they say or question the practice of using victims this way.

(No, it’s not morally equivalent to some of the horrendous things the swamp-dwellers have said about these kids, but that’s a low bar.)

Of course, the parents and the surviving kids aren’t being forced to do anything. They clearly want to be heard, and they have every right to do what they’re doing. Indeed, they’re entitled to their rage and grief. They are right to be furious.

But fury, in and of itself, is the enemy of reason. This point was once obvious to many of the people eagerly hiding behind these children to wage a political battle. In the wake of the 9/11 attacks — and countless terrorist attacks since then — the op-ed pages and the airwaves bulged with cautions that we not let “vengeance” or “anger” cloud our judgment.

I can scarcely imagine that the same people touting the unimpeachable wisdom of children would have the same position if the children of terror attack victims called for, say, a ban on Muslims entering the country.

Of course, the response from many people to this counterfactual would be, “But that’s a bad idea,” or, “That would be unconstitutional.”

And that’s my point exactly.

Of course, in real life it doesn’t always work that way. Sometimes, credibility or moral authority carries more weight than arguments. And perhaps more often, passion and emotion sways.

For instance, the NRA, not content with its public-policy and constitutional victories over the last decade, has taken to fomenting rage and resentment against “elites” and the media with all the precision of an unmanned fire hose.

As best as I can glean from some of the ads, the point seems to be that you should keep paying your dues because the NRA is the only thing that will keep gun owners from being triggered (so to speak) by The New York Times.

The introduction of child combatants in this political war seems only fitting in the never-ending cycles of exaggeration. So now we can hear children shout, “If you’re not with us, you’re against us!” Or, “If you’re against us, you’re in favor of murdering children!”

Of course I feel sorry for the victims, and I support their right to parrot the extreme rhetoric of their elders. I don’t feel sorry for the NRA.

When you turn the volume to 10 on everything, you shouldn’t be surprised when your opponents invent an even louder 11. But I am disgusted by the entire spectacle, and I feel sorry for a country that thinks any of this remotely normal.


The teens are being accussed of being “crisis actors”. My Facebook page has been flooded with this s**t.


If I remember correctly, there was even a jackass or two here on WP who tired to traffick in that horses**t after Sandy Hook.


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24 Feb 2018, 5:06 pm

cyberdad wrote:
Research by Harvard medical school suggests that if guns were banned then the rate of suicide would be reduced (fact) given there is higher chance of successfully killing yourself with a gun compared to using a kitchen knife or pills


Well in that case I guess we don't have a problem with illicit drugs.
Oh, wait...


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24 Feb 2018, 6:43 pm

Raptor wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
Research by Harvard medical school suggests that if guns were banned then the rate of suicide would be reduced (fact) given there is higher chance of successfully killing yourself with a gun compared to using a kitchen knife or pills


Well in that case I guess we don't have a problem with illicit drugs.
Oh, wait...


You're ridiculous.

Just because some people will still make an effort to obtain illegal items doesn't mean that those items shouldn't be illegal/banned/controlled at all. Especially when it comes to guns.. considering their primary purpose is to kill.


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