ASPartOfMe
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27 Dec 2020, 8:07 pm
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goldfish21
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28 Dec 2020, 2:19 am
^Keep your distance from unmasked people even though you’re wearing yours. Unless your mask is a seal-fitting N95 or P100 respirator, it won’t offer you full protection against breathing in the virus. Masks mostly help us prevent spreading it if we have it, by keeping our droplets to ourselves.. “Namaske,” as they say.. “My mask protects you, your mask protects me.”
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for supporting trump. Because doing so is deplorable.goldfish21
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28 Dec 2020, 2:24 am
kitesandtrainsandcats wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
The American economy wouldn’t be such a mess if governing leaders and citizens alike listened to & followed the guidance of experts like Fauci.
Experts like Fauci, eh?
Quote:
Dr. Anthony Fauci clarified his "guesstimate" and said that between 70 to 85% of the population should be vaccinated to reach herd immunity against the coronavirus.
"We all have to be honest and humble, nobody really knows for sure, but I think 70-85% for herd immunity for COVID-19 is a reasonable estimate," he said on CNN's "State of the Union" on Sunday.
Fauci had previously told The New York Times it could take up to 90% of the US population to get vaccinated to reach herd immunity against the coronavirus. He clarified that the range he states are a "guesstimate," and that the goal was for 70 to 85 percent of the population to be vaccinated.
"We all have to be honest and humble, nobody really knows for sure, but I think 70-85% for herd immunity for COVID-19 is a reasonable estimate," he said on CNN's "State of the Union" on Sunday.
Fauci had previously told The New York Times it could take up to 90% of the US population to get vaccinated to reach herd immunity against the coronavirus. He clarified that the range he states are a "guesstimate," and that the goal was for 70 to 85 percent of the population to be vaccinated.
https://news.yahoo.com/dr-fauci-says-90 ... 59187.html
Yes, like Fauci.
Why do you expect him to know in absolute terms the precise % of the population required to be vaccinated in order to achieve herd immunity vs an estimated range?
It seems, in his expertise on the topic, that there is some high % required but it’s impossible to pinpoint Exactly what the number is. Sounds pretty honest and realistic to me. How does this in any way discredit him or his expertise?
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for supporting trump. Because doing so is deplorable.goldfish21
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28 Dec 2020, 2:34 am
ASPartOfMe wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
The American economy wouldn’t be such a mess if governing leaders and citizens alike listened to & followed the guidance of experts like Fauci. They didn’t, so, this is their own making.
Follow instructions. Stay safe. Respect others. Don’t spread covid. It’s not that difficult. Almost the entire rest of the world is doing it.
And I couldn’t care less about some whiner whining about wanting to hangout and drink with their buddies or whatever other social crap they’re mistaking for a Need. Too bad. Tough it out and wait another handful of months or so until people are vaccinated. Science doesn’t care if you miss hanging out with your drinking buddies or w/e.
Follow instructions. Stay safe. Respect others. Don’t spread covid. It’s not that difficult. Almost the entire rest of the world is doing it.
And I couldn’t care less about some whiner whining about wanting to hangout and drink with their buddies or whatever other social crap they’re mistaking for a Need. Too bad. Tough it out and wait another handful of months or so until people are vaccinated. Science doesn’t care if you miss hanging out with your drinking buddies or w/e.
I am not talking about missing your weekends getting slobbered at the local dive. I am thinking of not being there when your immediate family member dies. Even no hugging extended family or friends for a year plus. To me social distancing is great but NT’s need that sort of thing. The experts have said that this type of thing is damaging and studies have documented the increase in mental health problems since this began. Is it worth it?. I think so better mentally damaged for a time then dead or permanently disabled. But the lockdowns are a sacrifice for people not just an inconvenience. It is more then an inconvenience for the small businessman who goes permanently out of business and whose industry is now a relic of the past.
That said those that are using free speech as an excuse to bully mask wearers, to tell nurses who see multiple people suffocate to death a day only to be told they are intentionally overhyping the problem deserve to die the most painful COVID death. Because of them we in America can not assume the enough people will vaccinate to create herd immunity. Because of them I might get COVID, because of them I may not have another medical problem not attended to because the health system is overwhelmed as is happening in California right now. Because of them I might have to mask wear and other inconveniences or worse permanently. The more others do not follow the guidelines, the more the rest of us not only have to follow the guidelines but self deny more then the rules say.
Both paragraph one and paragraph two as opposite as they seem can both be true.
Food water clothing medicine shelter etc - these are needs. People can do without social gatherings for a year or two. If they’re having mental health problems they can go do something covid safe about it. I had a drink with a friend Christmas Eve.. outdoors, 6’+ apart. It’s not impossible to still see people during covid. I’ve only met one of the 3 local babies born during covid so far and haven’t held any - that part sucks and is super different for me. Couldn’t hug people at funerals etc. BUT, all of that is life during a pandemic - and the key thing is that we’ll all get to Live and can do social things later, as you acknowledge.
Yeeeeeah, it really sucks how Americans are behaving & how many might not get vaccinated. On the bright side: I heard on a David Pakman video that the % of Americans who’ve said they will get a covid vaccine continues to climb. Herd immunity may be achieved via vaccination yet. The more people that get sick or die + the more people learn about the vaccines/the more people who actually get vaccinated and have no side effects = the more willing people are to get vaccinated. Hopefully the vaccine confidence numbers continue to climb rapidly and herd immunity via vaccination is achieved about the same timeframe as is expected in Canada, around September 2021. By this time next year we should be done with mask mandates and social distancing etc.
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for supporting trump. Because doing so is deplorable.28 Dec 2020, 3:20 am
ASPartOfMe
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28 Dec 2020, 4:59 am
ASPartOfMe
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28 Dec 2020, 5:14 am
28 Dec 2020, 5:34 am
uncommondenominator wrote:
Tempus Fugit wrote:
League_Girl wrote:
The media is not telling anyone to wear masks. They are just reporting what the medical experts are ordering and the state gov deciding to make that order because of the medical experts. They want to end corona and keep it down. Not have a bunch of people get sick and die.
People are not wearing masks because the media is saying so, they are wearing them due to what information that was put out there by doctors.
Now if so many people were not against it, the state would not have had to step in and make this order and having to do shut downs to force social distancing. If it was only some people not taking it so seriously, I dont think we would be in this mess.
The bacode on forehead thing was a weak anology. And a fallacy.
People are not wearing masks because the media is saying so, they are wearing them due to what information that was put out there by doctors.
Now if so many people were not against it, the state would not have had to step in and make this order and having to do shut downs to force social distancing. If it was only some people not taking it so seriously, I dont think we would be in this mess.
The bacode on forehead thing was a weak anology. And a fallacy.
I didn't say the media. I said the government.
As for the media, when Dr. Fauci lied about face-masks being ineffective to keep the general public from depleting the current face-mask supply, most people heard/read what Fauci said through the media. So by extension the medea was spreading a lie.
Also if you're going to declare that my analogy was weak and a fallacy, you should explain why.
So when "the government" says there's "voter fraud", we have to take it seriously, but if "the government" say there's a "pandemic", it's all made up. Seems like you're picking and choosing your rules when it suits you.
I never said the pandemic was made up or even suggested it. You set up a strawman to knock down.
Quote:
"When fauci lied"...? That's more than a bit of a misrepresentation. If you're going to claim someone was lying, you should explain how.
It's widely known that Fauci said masks were ineffective to discourage the general public from hording the limited supply of masks available at the time.
Quote:
As for your analogy, there's a massive difference between a small slightly inconvenient face covering for a valid public health reason (regardless of your personal opinion of that reason), and a permanent symbol etched into one's face "just because we said so". Like, what, the government is just ordering people to do things to see if they will do it, like some kind of totalitarian Simon-Says? And everyone is too stupid to notice? Except you of course...
C'mon now...
C'mon now...
Many throughout history have done what they were told without question.
Quote:
On a side note, if you're going to accuse me of making strawman arguments, you should explain why, and not just say they are. Don't invoke a rule you don't follow yourself
I did say what the strawmen were. You added America, MAGAs, liberals, Orwell's 1984 and more to a single sentence I wrote. You then proceeded to knock down what I did not say, as if I said it. That is called setting up a strawman
Quote:
Yeah, it's crazy how quickly and easily people sometimes agree on things, like the earth being round, or electricity being the movement of electrons (electr icity / electr on - what a wild coincidence!), or other real world things.
Many throughout history have done what they were told without question.
Quote:
Sure, believing in a pandemic - a thing that has happened before, many times, including recent history - is somehow absurd. But believing in a mass conspiracy between "the media" (but only the media that says things you don't like - media that agrees with you is a-ok 
) and "the government" (but only when the government says things you don't like - but when the government says things you do like, they're a-ok ) and "lying doctors" (as in doctors that say things you don't like - but doctors that validate you are a-ok ) all working in unison to make people wear masks just to make people jump through hoops so that they can eventually hokey pokey simon-says everyone into brainwashed soldier bots (who knew it was that easy?) in order to subjugate the nation, is perfectly reasonable to believe?
C'mon now...
) and "the government" (but only when the government says things you don't like - but when the government says things you do like, they're a-ok ) and "lying doctors" (as in doctors that say things you don't like - but doctors that validate you are a-ok ) all working in unison to make people wear masks just to make people jump through hoops so that they can eventually hokey pokey simon-says everyone into brainwashed soldier bots (who knew it was that easy?) in order to subjugate the nation, is perfectly reasonable to believe?C'mon now...
Once again you have written things that I never said as if I said them. You're adding paragraphs of stuff I never said as if I said it, to knock it down. That is what is known as creating a strawman argument.
Quote:
Health emergencies on national or global levels are fairly common, in the bigger scheme. They seem much more plausible than the "Liberal A-Blue-Minati covertly securing their Blue World Order".
You're even putting what I never said in quotation marks.
All I said, admittedly in an exaggerated way, was that there are many who do what they're told without question. This is something that had happened thoughout history. It doesn't only apply to a particular political party or a particular country. It can happen anytime, anywhere, to any people. Which means people should think things out, ask questions, do a little research, put things to the test.
As a side note, I seriously doubt that if Dr. Fauci (or any other epidemiologist) was asked if it was alright to question or examine or think over what he said, that he would say that was a bad idea.
goldfish21
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28 Dec 2020, 12:09 pm
ASPartOfMe wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
Food water clothing medicine shelter etc - these are needs. People can do without social gatherings for a year or two. If they’re having mental health problems they can go do something covid safe about it. I had a drink with a friend Christmas Eve.. outdoors, 6’+ apart. It’s not impossible to still see people during covid. I’ve only met one of the 3 local babies born during covid so far and haven’t held any - that part sucks and is super different for me. Couldn’t hug people at funerals etc. BUT, all of that is life during a pandemic - and the key thing is that we’ll all get to Live and can do social things later, as you acknowledge.
You need to follow the experts on this one
How Touch Deprivation Impacts Our Mental Health
Quote:
From the moment of birth, our brain tries to develop attachments through cuddling, gazing, feeding, playing etc.
Out of the five important sense organs, skin spreading all throughout the body is the first sense organ to develop in the mother’s womb.
Lack of touch at the times of infancy has shown adverse effects on the behaviour such as hostile aggression, shyness, difficulties eating food, stubbornness, and excessive crying.
It’s as important as the oxygen we breathe in, the food we eat – we are social beings,’ says Dr McGlone, Professor of Neuroscience and head of the Somatosensory & Affective Neuroscience Group at Liverpool John Moores University.
Dr Jon Reeves, a clinical psychologist from Washington says that: ‘Touch is our first language and one of our core needs. The touch of a safe, trusted loved one can alleviate anxiety and promote a sense of well-being without doing anything else.’
As Dr Tiffany Field, the director of the Touch Research Institute at the University of Miami’s Miller School of Medicine has said that lonely people can succumb to touch deprivation and need to be embraced. Touch deprivation is defined as a lack of tactile stimulation of our largest sensory organ, the skin, particularly in early infancy Further Dr Tiffany also argued that touch deprivation aggravates depression and debilitates the immune system whereas positive touch helps in the reduction of the stress hormones like cortisol, that can impair the immune system.
The C-tactile afferent, a recently discovered touch-sensitive nerve, when stimulated, releases oxytocin and endorphins
Various studies have seen that touch enables containment and safety. The presence of the therapist in the same room and the touch on the shoulder or arm is said to be comforting and stabilising for the client.
Further, earlier research found that touch shows a sense of deeper trust and a stronger connection between the client and the therapist. It also indicates a sense of comfort and improves communication.
Research also supports that taking someone’s hand at the times of anxiety and stress soothes the person, it increases a sense of empowerment as well as intimacy. Additionally, touch facilitates the communication of incapable verbal messages.
Professor McGlone argues that reduction in physical contact could lead to mental health issues. ‘And the brain, if it doesn’t get a reward system it has evolved to need, will quite often find inappropriate replications which could be drugs or alcohol or food. They are driven to fill that reward void.’
Out of the five important sense organs, skin spreading all throughout the body is the first sense organ to develop in the mother’s womb.
Lack of touch at the times of infancy has shown adverse effects on the behaviour such as hostile aggression, shyness, difficulties eating food, stubbornness, and excessive crying.
It’s as important as the oxygen we breathe in, the food we eat – we are social beings,’ says Dr McGlone, Professor of Neuroscience and head of the Somatosensory & Affective Neuroscience Group at Liverpool John Moores University.
Dr Jon Reeves, a clinical psychologist from Washington says that: ‘Touch is our first language and one of our core needs. The touch of a safe, trusted loved one can alleviate anxiety and promote a sense of well-being without doing anything else.’
As Dr Tiffany Field, the director of the Touch Research Institute at the University of Miami’s Miller School of Medicine has said that lonely people can succumb to touch deprivation and need to be embraced. Touch deprivation is defined as a lack of tactile stimulation of our largest sensory organ, the skin, particularly in early infancy Further Dr Tiffany also argued that touch deprivation aggravates depression and debilitates the immune system whereas positive touch helps in the reduction of the stress hormones like cortisol, that can impair the immune system.
The C-tactile afferent, a recently discovered touch-sensitive nerve, when stimulated, releases oxytocin and endorphins
Various studies have seen that touch enables containment and safety. The presence of the therapist in the same room and the touch on the shoulder or arm is said to be comforting and stabilising for the client.
Further, earlier research found that touch shows a sense of deeper trust and a stronger connection between the client and the therapist. It also indicates a sense of comfort and improves communication.
Research also supports that taking someone’s hand at the times of anxiety and stress soothes the person, it increases a sense of empowerment as well as intimacy. Additionally, touch facilitates the communication of incapable verbal messages.
Professor McGlone argues that reduction in physical contact could lead to mental health issues. ‘And the brain, if it doesn’t get a reward system it has evolved to need, will quite often find inappropriate replications which could be drugs or alcohol or food. They are driven to fill that reward void.’
Bolding=mine
goldfish21 wrote:
Yeeeeeah, it really sucks how Americans are behaving & how many might not get vaccinated. On the bright side: I heard on a David Pakman video that the % of Americans who’ve said they will get a covid vaccine continues to climb. Herd immunity may be achieved via vaccination yet. The more people that get sick or die + the more people learn about the vaccines/the more people who actually get vaccinated and have no side effects = the more willing people are to get vaccinated. Hopefully the vaccine confidence numbers continue to climb rapidly and herd immunity via vaccination is achieved about the same timeframe as is expected in Canada, around September 2021. By this time next year we should be done with mask mandates and social distancing etc.
Right now the trends look good but what happens when(not if) a few people die or have serious problems after getting vaccinated whether or not the problem was caused by the vaccine?
Infants will be with their parents/siblings and won’t lack touch while developing. I haven’t been able to hold any of the new babies, but their immediate families still do.
If people insist on being touched, they typically live with other humans. Here in BC, because Vancouver has so many one person households, there’s an exemption that allows them to have one or two people in their bubble that are allowed to visit them in their homes. These people could put masks on and hold hands or cuddle or f**k or whatever they insist on doing during a viral pandemic.
Me? Nope! Only a few fist bumps and One handshake a week before Christmas when I handed my deceased friend’s father an envelope of cash from me & the beach to look after gifts & food for his grand daughter and great grand daughter. (And then I used alcohol gel on my hands before I drove away even though I Know the old guy is pretty covid safe.)
If a few people get sick/die then stats will be compared to normal rates of illness & death and likely be determined to be statistically insignificant and not attributed to the vaccine - same same as was done in the trials before they were approved for use. People do still get sick and die of other things at fairly predictable regular rates.
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for supporting trump. Because doing so is deplorable.
28 Dec 2020, 12:19 pm
goldfish21
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28 Dec 2020, 12:21 pm
Tempus Fugit wrote:
Many throughout history have done what they were told without question.
Many throughout history have done what they were told without question.
Many throughout history have done what they were told without question.
People are being asked to perform very basic mitigation measures to prevent the spread of a highly infectious lethal virus during a pandemic, not murder Jews.
WITAF?
And you wonder why your flame-bait is getting you flamed.
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for supporting trump. Because doing so is deplorable.goldfish21
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28 Dec 2020, 12:24 pm
Misslizard wrote:
I do feel sympathy for the NT community and their need for touch.They need to be patient and they can have an orgy of touchy feely stuff after the pandemic is over.Better than being touched by an undertaker.
Myself I don’t get it, who would want to touch someone in a pandemic?I didn’t like it before and now it’s just gross .
They could adopt a shelter pet and cuddle safely with it.
Myself I don’t get it, who would want to touch someone in a pandemic?I didn’t like it before and now it’s just gross .
They could adopt a shelter pet and cuddle safely with it.
Yes to almost all of this!
I do like & appreciate touch, whether holding babies, hugging a good friend, massage, sex etc. And while it’s not ideal, I can forgo all of the above until after the pandemic. And then maybe have an orgy.
(No, I’ve never actually done that. Not for lack of opportunity, just not really my thing.)
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