Victim stands up to a bully and gets suspended

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Yeah body slamming was excessive, but I don't feel pity for the dude at all. At least he now knows that acting like a little prick has serious consequences and if he wants to avoid em, then it's best to get his act together. But I think people are being overzealous, so let's not lose our sense of proportionate justice. Body slamming someone on the concrete is out of line and he should've knocked him out instead. Just cuz "Violence solves nothing" is BS, it doesn't mean there's no such thing as retaliation going too far.

@ Orwell: You're dead wrong. There is such thing as self defense no longer being self defense. The use of force has to be proportionate. You can knock someone out if that person swings at you, but you can't stomp him out or hit him after that. Self defense is no longer self defense after you hurt someone who is no longer a threat. So yes you do have legal obligation to show regard for the safety of the assailant by using a proportionate amount of force. I don't mean proportionate as in "Shot for shot", but proportionate as in "The type of force being used". Body slamming someone on the concrete is borderline aggravated assault.

However, I don't think the victim should've gotten suspended. I'm tired of the stupid ass "It doesn't matter who started it, violence is wrong" crap and I wish schools would actually have a concept of self defense like they used to. I just think the victim should've gotten off the hook but with a warning for excessive use of force.

Let's clarify here - the bigger kid DID hold back. He could have slammed that skinny little kid much much harder. He telegraphed that slam 3/4 of the way down - he carried him for most of the distance. The smaller kid's ankle was broken when it hit the wooden beam off to the side. THAT looks to have been entirely accidental.

Anybody that has been involved, at all, in professional wrestling, would be able to clearly see the restraint the bigger kid used. He could have dealt some real serious damage. He made his point and walked away. Which, is the entire point of self defense.

Watching the video over the little kid tagged him twice in the face and 2-3 times in the gut. And all anyone is talking about is not solving violence with violence...

I'm with you on this one. Not to mention his friend coming and trying to pick a fight afterward. Little coward got his just reward. Frankly if I were the kid who got suspended, I would be okay with suspension, I throw down some little coward and get some time off for it? Hell yes. He probably sat around playing Call of Duty for the duration of the suspension while that little s**t was nursing a [deserved] broken ankle, and most of all, a broken ego

Ok Devils advocate time.

The big kid took the time to find a way to pick the little kid up and slam him in a cement area. The little kid was throwing punches which was wrong and we don't know the whole story as to why. A punch often does not cause as much harm as a slam on a cement floor also this time near edges that create even more odds of serious injury. Bottom line is if the big kid was in any great danger he would have pushed or hit back then ran away not taken the time to enter into the range of being hit again, picked up the person and then slammed him on the floor which was not a wrestling ring. Both should have been punished and each educated as to how to deal with their own behaviors in these situations. Fault lays with the little kid it seems but there are more reasonable ways to self-defend in order to get away.

It seems those that have been bullied are not good jurors.

If you corner someone where they can't easily walk away and repeatedly punch them... don't be surprised when you they fight back, and don't play the victim if you lose a fight that you picked. I have exactly zero sympathy for anyone who is injured by someone they attack.


After the little bastard was on the ground and out of commission, the victim walked away. It's obvious from the video that he quite easily could have killed or permanently maimed the punk if he had been so inclined. He was attacked; he incapacitated his attacker and then left to avoid a conflict with another student who wanted in on the fight.

My comment about regard for the safety of your assailant applies when they're attacking you, to clarify. Once they are already on the ground, it becomes another story, but while someone is punching you your immediate response does not have to be tempered in any way.

I think your philosophy is dangerous and may stem from being bullied (psycho-pathological cycle) as a child.

I don't think anyone disagrees here.


Perhaps there are. But when you are cornered and threatened, there isn't always a reasonable expectation that you will find the "best" way to defuse the situation. The victim's priority has to be defending him- or herself, and the safety of an aggressor is at best a secondary concern.

Note also that the bully had a gang of his friends with him. Less extreme force could have provoked them mobbing him, and even though he was bigger he may not have been able to defend himself against several attackers, but a display this extreme sent a clear warning to other potential assailants in the immediate vicinity.

None were actively engaged. The punishment was fair and with video evidence. Had I been in the situation like I have been I'd let the people punch me then stair at them. then growl (which leads to an oh s**t) and close hang with trip to enforce then a bread basked stomach flying jay. As an adult I've also been attacked and well I didn't have the ability to defend myself.

Yes, that seems like a good point. It's almost like the Kung Fu myth, with is very wide in our society, I mean the TV show where the guy is shown walking at the beginning. So, the nice guy bides his time as the bullies do more and more, the nice guy just bides his time until he suddenly devastates the mean, stupid guys. Very emotionally gratifying!

However, there may be a better way. You may want to do a more medium thing earlier. In my post Tight, defensive boxing to a draw. One week. http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt134616.html , I advocate just that. Generally, it will only work with those your same size. And please do not take a bunch of blows to the head as most of that stuff about post-concussion syndrome is true (and just like football helmets don't really protect, presumable boxing headgear does not really protect either).

He lifted him up at head level and slammed him to the ground. I'm aware that he used restraint, but a body slam is way too susceptible to serious injury. It's wiser to use a technique so that if you do lose control, he won't end up cracking his skull. This isn't WWE, this is a real fight against a resisting opponent so you aren't always gonna have perfect control of the opponent. He should've used a double leg or single leg takedown which would've been just as effective.

It's not that blurry. Body slamming is still excessive force in response to punches and that's clear whether you are sitting behind a computer giving your two cents on this incident or caught up in a fight. And yes I know about all the mental and perceptual distortions that adrenaline causes, so I'm not just making a blanket statement. Tachypsychia and the other various effects of adrenaline do not render you unable to recognize that body slamming is excessive force in response to punches.

He could've knocked the guy out and then bailed. If he had absolutely no escape route I would've definitely stood behind his actions 100%. Matter of fact, I would have no problem with him throwing hooks to his kidneys at that part where he grabs a hold of him. If that sounds extreme, well so is ganging up on someone. Even getting jumped by 2-3 people is serious s**t.

Oh ok I see what you mean now, but your immediate response still has to be appropriate. You can't punch someone in the throat cuz you took a hit to the face and the gut unless you are getting attacked by multiple opponents.

@ ci: I'd personally start swinging right after someone even touches me. Once they go from verbal to physical, the line has been crossed.

Last edited by AceOfSpades on 15 Mar 2011, 4:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Yep of course. But I wanted to show the person he could hit and it wouldn't effect. The person never once talked to me again nor did I see the person again.

Id also like to add the person that attacked me I never saw before and I was just twisting in circles in the gym. He thought it was weird and called me names and started punching. Since there was no reason for it the person had to be safely impaired. Once the person was gasping for air from the wind blow I walked to the principles office and turned myself in becuase that was / is the rules. As a result I got a 2 week vacation from PE which was a sensory overload place and I was very happy. The school psychologist came to the meeting supporting me and I thanked the principle which he was shocked and I meant nothing by it just PE was kind of a mental disruption.

I actually wonder if that 12-year old was himself bullied into hitting the big 16-year old.

Be a man and fight the big guy. Could be. Most of what I did was play wrestle and I could safely body slam and suspend in the air someone that was 220lbs when I was like 120. I was obsessed with wrestling near always. Always on the grass and when I could do safely. People make choices whether or not they are socially pushed into something. I'd understand if it was fight that person or get beat up or or killed.

When you're being hit (especially if you already have sensory issues of some kind) it can be hard to keep your bearings enough to know exactly what you're swinging at, so I wouldn't nitpick about where you punch an assailant. The reflexive response is to hit back, and you may not have perfect aim.

Also note the victim here started off completely peaceful even when the bully was throwing punches: he was initially just trying to block the punches or restrain the bully's arms.


So... this kid actually showed more restraint than you would have, since he did not fight back immediately.

Yes and no. A power move takes more time so this is understandable. However this is not fake wrestling on T.V.