Emergence of a Deadly Coronavirus
Why are hotel owners (I mean big, gigantic, luxury hotels) authorizing the city to requisition their rooms to be used for hospital beds and for beds for First Responders?
Why has a whole big convention center been taken over, and hospital beds been put in it?
This is not some propaganda campaign. This is for real.
I'm not saying that the panic isn't real, or that there aren't people catching coronavirus and developing Covid19/acute respiratory disease, but that the figures are a mess, and that panic is making things worse/contributing actively to an increase in the number of deaths which are otherwise mostly still well within normal ranges for acute respiratory illnesses at this time of year.
I used to think that even if the case numbers were just a measure of how many tests were being done in a country, ( a measure of "testing activity" ), that at least the deaths would be a solid indicator of something real, but it's become clear that many countries are just banging in any deaths which occur in people who have tested positive for the virus.
And that's another thing, the tests themselves, were apparently never fully tested, only intended for clinical/initial laboratory use not for diagnostic purposes, and with wildly fluctuating accuracy rates.
And in the UK and Germany entire floors of hospitals and acres of field hospital tents and testing facilities in car parks etc are standing empty, the staff still waiting for the huge numbers that were predicted, the "wave", which hasn't materialised.
@ Darmok and pyrrhicwren: Absolutely. Exactly. It's becoming increasingly taboo , almost forbidden, to say anything which contradicts the approved/dominant pandemic narrative of the big pharma-big money-corp powers, via their media, who've leapt on this to help them out of the huge burst-bubble hole that they've once again got themselves into, because it's getting them astronomical bailouts ( $4 trillion plus in the USA, so far ) .

You have a really good handle on this.

China is responsible for the magnitude of this pandemic. They are negligent. Pure and simple.
Perhaps for the beginning of it. But once governments and their citizens knew what to do about it, who’s fault is it if they don’t do it?

Some countries have had incredibly good responses and kept their infection and death rates low. Others not so much. How is what each country and it’s people do about C-19 China’s fault?

China knew this virus was festering, infecting and killing its people for months before saying a single word to the rest of the world only until it became overwhelming in Wuhan.
China has grossly under-reported the numbers of infections and deaths. I understand that there are pro-China sympathizers in the world who choose to believe otherwise or choose to spread the propaganda, but first delaying alerting the world and then when they did make the world aware, they basically said it was no big deal by telling the WHO that human to human transmission wasn't happening.
It set the world back. Perhaps this wouldn't even be a pandemic (ie globally uncontrolled) if they'd have told the truth right away rather than lying as they continue to do this day about the virus.
I'm a U.S. citizen. In no way am I shaking my fist in the air at the Bad Orange Man and chanting with snarl and spittle that Bad Orange Man has done a terrible job with this and the world's problems because of the virus should be blamed on him.
Case in point. It's utterly shameful and pathetic that the governor of Louisiana, the leader of that state, is abdicating his leadership responsibility and having the gall to blame Trump for not closing down Mardi Gras. Lame.
It is an interesting pattern though: All eyes pointing to Trump expecting him to micromanage the entire country down to the local levels. This isn't a dictatorship, it's a Democratic Republic of states each with their own governors who are charged with making decisions for their own citizenry such as...closing....down...Mardi...Gras.
European Countries Are Throwing Out ‘Rubbish’ Chinese-Made Masks and Coronavirus Tests
The Dutch government is discarding over a million masks that don't fit properly or have defective filters.
The Netherlands has become the latest European country to dump what it says is substandard Chinese-made equipment in the fight against coronavirus, recalling more than half a million face masks from hospitals after they failed quality tests.
The Dutch government announced a recall of 600,000 FFP2 masks from hospitals on Saturday after tests showed the masks didn’t fit properly or had defective filter membranes to stop the transmission of the virus.
https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/7kza ... irus-tests
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goldfish21
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China is responsible for the magnitude of this pandemic. They are negligent. Pure and simple.
Perhaps for the beginning of it. But once governments and their citizens knew what to do about it, who’s fault is it if they don’t do it?

Some countries have had incredibly good responses and kept their infection and death rates low. Others not so much. How is what each country and it’s people do about C-19 China’s fault?

China knew this virus was festering, infecting and killing its people for months before saying a single word to the rest of the world only until it became overwhelming in Wuhan.
China has grossly under-reported the numbers of infections and deaths. I understand that there are pro-China sympathizers in the world who choose to believe otherwise or choose to spread the propaganda, but first delaying alerting the world and then when they did make the world aware, they basically said it was no big deal by telling the WHO that human to human transmission wasn't happening.
It set the world back. Perhaps this wouldn't even be a pandemic (ie globally uncontrolled) if they'd have told the truth right away rather than lying as they continue to do this day about the virus.
I'm a U.S. citizen. In no way am I shaking my fist in the air at the Bad Orange Man and chanting with snarl and spittle that Bad Orange Man has done a terrible job with this and the world's problems because of the virus should be blamed on him.
Case in point. It's utterly shameful and pathetic that the governor of Louisiana, the leader of that state, is abdicating his leadership responsibility and having the gall to blame Trump for not closing down Mardi Gras. Lame.
It is an interesting pattern though: All eyes pointing to Trump expecting him to micromanage the entire country down to the local levels. This isn't a dictatorship, it's a Democratic Republic of states each with their own governors who are charged with making decisions for their own citizenry such as...closing....down...Mardi...Gras.
How is any of this China’s fault?

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No


China is responsible for the magnitude of this pandemic. They are negligent. Pure and simple.
Perhaps for the beginning of it. But once governments and their citizens knew what to do about it, who’s fault is it if they don’t do it?

Some countries have had incredibly good responses and kept their infection and death rates low. Others not so much. How is what each country and it’s people do about C-19 China’s fault?

China knew this virus was festering, infecting and killing its people for months before saying a single word to the rest of the world only until it became overwhelming in Wuhan.
China has grossly under-reported the numbers of infections and deaths. I understand that there are pro-China sympathizers in the world who choose to believe otherwise or choose to spread the propaganda, but first delaying alerting the world and then when they did make the world aware, they basically said it was no big deal by telling the WHO that human to human transmission wasn't happening.
It set the world back. Perhaps this wouldn't even be a pandemic (ie globally uncontrolled) if they'd have told the truth right away rather than lying as they continue to do this day about the virus.
I'm a U.S. citizen. In no way am I shaking my fist in the air at the Bad Orange Man and chanting with snarl and spittle that Bad Orange Man has done a terrible job with this and the world's problems because of the virus should be blamed on him.
Case in point. It's utterly shameful and pathetic that the governor of Louisiana, the leader of that state, is abdicating his leadership responsibility and having the gall to blame Trump for not closing down Mardi Gras. Lame.
It is an interesting pattern though: All eyes pointing to Trump expecting him to micromanage the entire country down to the local levels. This isn't a dictatorship, it's a Democratic Republic of states each with their own governors who are charged with making decisions for their own citizenry such as...closing....down...Mardi...Gras.
How is any of this China’s fault?

Am I understanding you correctly that you believe Trump is to blame for the 1,000,000+ cases of the virus on the planet being at that number now? This is a pandemic. It's affected virtually every country in the world and it's probable that many countries wouldn't have it if China had been forthright at the outset. For some reason you seem to be fixated on Trump and the U.S. in relation to this pandemic as if it's a problem emanating from the U.S. and more specifically that it's Bad Orange Man's fault?
Last time I checked Trump never worked at a level 4 bio-lab

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goldfish21
Veteran

Joined: 17 Feb 2013
Age: 42
Gender: Male
Posts: 22,612
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada

China is responsible for the magnitude of this pandemic. They are negligent. Pure and simple.
Perhaps for the beginning of it. But once governments and their citizens knew what to do about it, who’s fault is it if they don’t do it?

Some countries have had incredibly good responses and kept their infection and death rates low. Others not so much. How is what each country and it’s people do about C-19 China’s fault?

China knew this virus was festering, infecting and killing its people for months before saying a single word to the rest of the world only until it became overwhelming in Wuhan.
China has grossly under-reported the numbers of infections and deaths. I understand that there are pro-China sympathizers in the world who choose to believe otherwise or choose to spread the propaganda, but first delaying alerting the world and then when they did make the world aware, they basically said it was no big deal by telling the WHO that human to human transmission wasn't happening.
It set the world back. Perhaps this wouldn't even be a pandemic (ie globally uncontrolled) if they'd have told the truth right away rather than lying as they continue to do this day about the virus.
I'm a U.S. citizen. In no way am I shaking my fist in the air at the Bad Orange Man and chanting with snarl and spittle that Bad Orange Man has done a terrible job with this and the world's problems because of the virus should be blamed on him.
Case in point. It's utterly shameful and pathetic that the governor of Louisiana, the leader of that state, is abdicating his leadership responsibility and having the gall to blame Trump for not closing down Mardi Gras. Lame.
It is an interesting pattern though: All eyes pointing to Trump expecting him to micromanage the entire country down to the local levels. This isn't a dictatorship, it's a Democratic Republic of states each with their own governors who are charged with making decisions for their own citizenry such as...closing....down...Mardi...Gras.
How is any of this China’s fault?

Am I understanding you correctly that you believe Trump is to blame for the 1,000,000+ cases of the virus on the planet being at that number now? This is a pandemic. It's affected virtually every country in the world and it's probable that many countries wouldn't have it if China had been forthright at the outset. For some reason you seem to be fixated on Trump and the U.S. in relation to this pandemic as if it's a problem emanating from the U.S. and more specifically that it's Bad Orange Man's fault?
No. trump has F all to do with other countries’ governments’ responses.
trump is responsible for the lies that came out of his mouth to his citizens and the harm that has caused. The delayed reaction to mitigating this pandemic in the USA as well as many Americans’ belief, to this day, that C-19 is a politically motivated hoax perpetuated by the democrats to ruin trump’s economy & re-election campaign. He lied, repeatedly, and because of that the infection & death toll in America are far higher than they needed to be. Period.
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No

isn't it quite possible that we are facing a pandemic so contagious, that all methods to curtail it eventually fail?
If so, do we have a sufficient supply of morphine, fentanyl and tramadol to provide adequate end of life care for all the patients who are currently expected to require in home palliative care?
isn't it quite possible that we are facing a pandemic so contagious, that all methods to curtail it eventually fail?
If so, do we have a sufficient supply of morphine, fentanyl and tramadol to provide adequate end of life care for all the patients who are currently expected to require in home palliative care?
Seems to be a conflict of interest here. In Europe the hospitals are dealing with allocating scarce medical resources to younger patients and so the whole issue of palliative care for those older patients left to fend for themselves has not hit the media yet. Much of the moves to close border and self-isolate across entire populations was to protect this specific at-risk group.
So global funding needs to address vaccines, anti-virals and end of life palliative care.
Last edited by cyberdad on 02 Apr 2020, 6:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The bat origins theory of the virus has yet to be verified. The picture that was the origin of the theory showed a chinese woman that eats for a travelling food show, in addition, she wasn't even in China, at least according to fact checker sites.
That said we can blame China for attempting to silence information about the coronavirus and which resulted in it becoming much more widespread than it should've been.
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Last time I checked Trump never worked at a level 4 bio-lab

In Australia we call these labs PC4 or Biosafetly level 4 so I assume that's what you mean. What's special about these altered proteins?