Americas twin political cancers
Kraichgauer
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16 Aug 2017, 10:04 pm
techstepgenr8tion wrote:
rick sanchez wrote:
Relatively cushy life for whom?
It seems a common occurrence for posts to include these broad statements of a condition and then draw a misleading conclusion from it.
Anytime there is great inequality, there are people who will find an excuse for violence. The inequality can in any aspect: power, freedom, lifestyle.
It seems a common occurrence for posts to include these broad statements of a condition and then draw a misleading conclusion from it.
Anytime there is great inequality, there are people who will find an excuse for violence. The inequality can in any aspect: power, freedom, lifestyle.
Welfare recipients of today are living better than the Rockefellers by absolute standards. That's what I mean. You'd probably have zero interest in looking but there's a country to the south of us, called Venezuela, that's practically burning down as a country. Relatively speaking, in the scheme of world affairs, we have no clue what hardship is. Those who do, mostly the rural poor, probably don't match the victimhood hierarchy exactly.
Welfare recipients live better than the Rockefellers of old? I think you exaggerate the kind of money they pull in.
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-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer
16 Aug 2017, 10:12 pm
Kraichgauer wrote:
techstepgenr8tion wrote:
rick sanchez wrote:
Relatively cushy life for whom?
It seems a common occurrence for posts to include these broad statements of a condition and then draw a misleading conclusion from it.
Anytime there is great inequality, there are people who will find an excuse for violence. The inequality can in any aspect: power, freedom, lifestyle.
It seems a common occurrence for posts to include these broad statements of a condition and then draw a misleading conclusion from it.
Anytime there is great inequality, there are people who will find an excuse for violence. The inequality can in any aspect: power, freedom, lifestyle.
Welfare recipients of today are living better than the Rockefellers by absolute standards. That's what I mean. You'd probably have zero interest in looking but there's a country to the south of us, called Venezuela, that's practically burning down as a country. Relatively speaking, in the scheme of world affairs, we have no clue what hardship is. Those who do, mostly the rural poor, probably don't match the victimhood hierarchy exactly.
Welfare recipients live better than the Rockefellers of old? I think you exaggerate the kind of money they pull in.
WOW! I missed that statement. That is some stupid s**t!
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16 Aug 2017, 11:46 pm
techstepgenr8tion wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
I don't recall George Washington sitting with King George III singing "Kumbaya my lord" before America was granted independence from Great Britain. .
There was plenty of blood spilled and Washington was referred to as a terrorist by the British crown
There was plenty of blood spilled and Washington was referred to as a terrorist by the British crown
Is there a situation equivocal to the relatively cushy lives we have now, with national independence well established and a largely functional exchange of ideas, where violence was still required?
subjective in terms of whom is enjoying the "cushy life" but I take your point. Of course it helped Washington's cause that he was able to enlist the help of the French to distract the British forces from crushing his little uprising
Kraichgauer
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16 Aug 2017, 11:56 pm
cyberdad wrote:
techstepgenr8tion wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
I don't recall George Washington sitting with King George III singing "Kumbaya my lord" before America was granted independence from Great Britain. .
There was plenty of blood spilled and Washington was referred to as a terrorist by the British crown
There was plenty of blood spilled and Washington was referred to as a terrorist by the British crown
Is there a situation equivocal to the relatively cushy lives we have now, with national independence well established and a largely functional exchange of ideas, where violence was still required?
subjective in terms of whom is enjoying the "cushy life" but I take your point. Of course it helped Washington's cause that he was able to enlist the help of the French to distract the British forces from crushing his little uprising
The American Revolution would have failed entirely without France's help.
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-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer
17 Aug 2017, 1:26 am
Kraichgauer wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
techstepgenr8tion wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
I don't recall George Washington sitting with King George III singing "Kumbaya my lord" before America was granted independence from Great Britain. .
There was plenty of blood spilled and Washington was referred to as a terrorist by the British crown
There was plenty of blood spilled and Washington was referred to as a terrorist by the British crown
Is there a situation equivocal to the relatively cushy lives we have now, with national independence well established and a largely functional exchange of ideas, where violence was still required?
subjective in terms of whom is enjoying the "cushy life" but I take your point. Of course it helped Washington's cause that he was able to enlist the help of the French to distract the British forces from crushing his little uprising
The American Revolution would have failed entirely without France's help.
Indeed! I think David Duke is hoping for some similar support from his right wing brothers in Europe to overthrow democratic government and replace with authoritarian pro-white dictatorship. Right wing groups in Europe have moved from the "Hitleresque" nationalist type of fascism to closing ranks and joining forces against a perceieved common enemy. Even Hitler's brownshirts were considered a laughing stock by the highly educated German middle class in the 1920s. Things change very quickly in a short space of time.
Kraichgauer
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17 Aug 2017, 2:20 am
cyberdad wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
techstepgenr8tion wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
I don't recall George Washington sitting with King George III singing "Kumbaya my lord" before America was granted independence from Great Britain. .
There was plenty of blood spilled and Washington was referred to as a terrorist by the British crown
There was plenty of blood spilled and Washington was referred to as a terrorist by the British crown
Is there a situation equivocal to the relatively cushy lives we have now, with national independence well established and a largely functional exchange of ideas, where violence was still required?
subjective in terms of whom is enjoying the "cushy life" but I take your point. Of course it helped Washington's cause that he was able to enlist the help of the French to distract the British forces from crushing his little uprising
The American Revolution would have failed entirely without France's help.
Indeed! I think David Duke is hoping for some similar support from his right wing brothers in Europe to overthrow democratic government and replace with authoritarian pro-white dictatorship. Right wing groups in Europe have moved from the "Hitleresque" nationalist type of fascism to closing ranks and joining forces against a perceieved common enemy. Even Hitler's brownshirts were considered a laughing stock by the highly educated German middle class in the 1920s. Things change very quickly in a short space of time.
That's why the cultured, upper middle class SS pretty much replaced the Brown Shirts in the Night of the Long Knives. Hitler wanted respectability, and pretty much won it by replacing one group of terror enforcers with another.
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-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer
techstepgenr8tion
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17 Aug 2017, 8:57 am
Kraichgauer wrote:
That's why the cultured, upper middle class SS pretty much replaced the Brown Shirts in the Night of the Long Knives. Hitler wanted respectability, and pretty much won it by replacing one group of terror enforcers with another.
There's a situational and culural see-sawing that seems to need to happen before such a group as a respectable upper-middle class equivalent of a neo nazi becomes available. The respectable classes generally move slowly, have a lot to lose, and they have to have their faith deeply shaken in the future and any possibility that things will stay the same or that they can be successful with what they've been successful at. That's both a good thing if we can fix the mistakes early, and a terrible thing if we don't.
I remember hearing the stories of people from places like Bosnia of how people who were quiet and generally meek law-abiding citizens did end up as the crime bosses when society completely collapsed. People like that I think have some sort of evolutionary hold out provision, ie. they're like nature hedging its bets for catastrophe, and those people tend to be ruthlessly proficient and can bring the full weight of high IQ to what they're doing.
That's part of why I do fear the breakdown of order. Most people are very slow to move to thuggish behavior and enterprise just that if consensus reality becomes a Hobbesian nightmare or it becomes clear that we have turned some kind of bend toward a fascist or communist state - those people will have that part of themselves, their dna, etc. come online and from there any hope of getting the stupidity and mistakes back in the bottle is next to impossible because the culture of despotism will properly be carrying the inertia and holding the more fundamental structure than civil republican-democratic society.
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Kraichgauer
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17 Aug 2017, 12:59 pm
techstepgenr8tion wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
That's why the cultured, upper middle class SS pretty much replaced the Brown Shirts in the Night of the Long Knives. Hitler wanted respectability, and pretty much won it by replacing one group of terror enforcers with another.
There's a situational and culural see-sawing that seems to need to happen before such a group as a respectable upper-middle class equivalent of a neo nazi becomes available. The respectable classes generally move slowly, have a lot to lose, and they have to have their faith deeply shaken in the future and any possibility that things will stay the same or that they can be successful with what they've been successful at. That's both a good thing if we can fix the mistakes early, and a terrible thing if we don't.
I remember hearing the stories of people from places like Bosnia of how people who were quiet and generally meek law-abiding citizens did end up as the crime bosses when society completely collapsed. People like that I think have some sort of evolutionary hold out provision, ie. they're like nature hedging its bets for catastrophe, and those people tend to be ruthlessly proficient and can bring the full weight of high IQ to what they're doing.
That's part of why I do fear the breakdown of order. Most people are very slow to move to thuggish behavior and enterprise just that if consensus reality becomes a Hobbesian nightmare or it becomes clear that we have turned some kind of bend toward a fascist or communist state - those people will have that part of themselves, their dna, etc. come online and from there any hope of getting the stupidity and mistakes back in the bottle is next to impossible because the culture of despotism will properly be carrying the inertia and holding the more fundamental structure than civil republican-democratic society.
Yes, today's Alt Right, such as Richard Spencer, look like hipsters instead of the traditional cracker cross burners.
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-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer
18 Aug 2017, 1:59 am
Kraichgauer wrote:
techstepgenr8tion wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
That's why the cultured, upper middle class SS pretty much replaced the Brown Shirts in the Night of the Long Knives. Hitler wanted respectability, and pretty much won it by replacing one group of terror enforcers with another.
There's a situational and culural see-sawing that seems to need to happen before such a group as a respectable upper-middle class equivalent of a neo nazi becomes available. The respectable classes generally move slowly, have a lot to lose, and they have to have their faith deeply shaken in the future and any possibility that things will stay the same or that they can be successful with what they've been successful at. That's both a good thing if we can fix the mistakes early, and a terrible thing if we don't.
I remember hearing the stories of people from places like Bosnia of how people who were quiet and generally meek law-abiding citizens did end up as the crime bosses when society completely collapsed. People like that I think have some sort of evolutionary hold out provision, ie. they're like nature hedging its bets for catastrophe, and those people tend to be ruthlessly proficient and can bring the full weight of high IQ to what they're doing.
That's part of why I do fear the breakdown of order. Most people are very slow to move to thuggish behavior and enterprise just that if consensus reality becomes a Hobbesian nightmare or it becomes clear that we have turned some kind of bend toward a fascist or communist state - those people will have that part of themselves, their dna, etc. come online and from there any hope of getting the stupidity and mistakes back in the bottle is next to impossible because the culture of despotism will properly be carrying the inertia and holding the more fundamental structure than civil republican-democratic society.
Yes, today's Alt Right, such as Richard Spencer, look like hipsters instead of the traditional cracker cross burners.
My guess is middle class Trump voters are keeping a low profile for now. In case they get tarred with the same racist brush.
Kraichgauer
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18 Aug 2017, 2:03 am
cyberdad wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
techstepgenr8tion wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
That's why the cultured, upper middle class SS pretty much replaced the Brown Shirts in the Night of the Long Knives. Hitler wanted respectability, and pretty much won it by replacing one group of terror enforcers with another.
There's a situational and culural see-sawing that seems to need to happen before such a group as a respectable upper-middle class equivalent of a neo nazi becomes available. The respectable classes generally move slowly, have a lot to lose, and they have to have their faith deeply shaken in the future and any possibility that things will stay the same or that they can be successful with what they've been successful at. That's both a good thing if we can fix the mistakes early, and a terrible thing if we don't.
I remember hearing the stories of people from places like Bosnia of how people who were quiet and generally meek law-abiding citizens did end up as the crime bosses when society completely collapsed. People like that I think have some sort of evolutionary hold out provision, ie. they're like nature hedging its bets for catastrophe, and those people tend to be ruthlessly proficient and can bring the full weight of high IQ to what they're doing.
That's part of why I do fear the breakdown of order. Most people are very slow to move to thuggish behavior and enterprise just that if consensus reality becomes a Hobbesian nightmare or it becomes clear that we have turned some kind of bend toward a fascist or communist state - those people will have that part of themselves, their dna, etc. come online and from there any hope of getting the stupidity and mistakes back in the bottle is next to impossible because the culture of despotism will properly be carrying the inertia and holding the more fundamental structure than civil republican-democratic society.
Yes, today's Alt Right, such as Richard Spencer, look like hipsters instead of the traditional cracker cross burners.
My guess is middle class Trump voters are keeping a low profile for now. In case they get tarred with the same racist brush.
That's a real possibility.
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-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer
ASPartOfMe
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18 Aug 2017, 11:24 am
cyberdad wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
techstepgenr8tion wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
That's why the cultured, upper middle class SS pretty much replaced the Brown Shirts in the Night of the Long Knives. Hitler wanted respectability, and pretty much won it by replacing one group of terror enforcers with another.
There's a situational and culural see-sawing that seems to need to happen before such a group as a respectable upper-middle class equivalent of a neo nazi becomes available. The respectable classes generally move slowly, have a lot to lose, and they have to have their faith deeply shaken in the future and any possibility that things will stay the same or that they can be successful with what they've been successful at. That's both a good thing if we can fix the mistakes early, and a terrible thing if we don't.
I remember hearing the stories of people from places like Bosnia of how people who were quiet and generally meek law-abiding citizens did end up as the crime bosses when society completely collapsed. People like that I think have some sort of evolutionary hold out provision, ie. they're like nature hedging its bets for catastrophe, and those people tend to be ruthlessly proficient and can bring the full weight of high IQ to what they're doing.
That's part of why I do fear the breakdown of order. Most people are very slow to move to thuggish behavior and enterprise just that if consensus reality becomes a Hobbesian nightmare or it becomes clear that we have turned some kind of bend toward a fascist or communist state - those people will have that part of themselves, their dna, etc. come online and from there any hope of getting the stupidity and mistakes back in the bottle is next to impossible because the culture of despotism will properly be carrying the inertia and holding the more fundamental structure than civil republican-democratic society.
Yes, today's Alt Right, such as Richard Spencer, look like hipsters instead of the traditional cracker cross burners.
My guess is middle class Trump voters are keeping a low profile for now. In case they get tarred with the same racist brush.
I have seen no evidence Trump voters are having second thoughts and are hiding. On the news last night they went to an area that voted for Trump and interviewed Trump voters about Charlottsville and they agreed with Trump's both sides argument. My Facebook friends that voted for Trump have not pulled back.
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DSM 5: Autism Spectrum Disorder, DSM IV: Aspergers Moderate Severity
“My autism is not a superpower. It also isn’t some kind of god-forsaken, endless fountain of suffering inflicted on my family. It’s just part of who I am as a person”. - Sara Luterman
18 Aug 2017, 2:02 pm
ASPartOfMe wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
techstepgenr8tion wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
That's why the cultured, upper middle class SS pretty much replaced the Brown Shirts in the Night of the Long Knives. Hitler wanted respectability, and pretty much won it by replacing one group of terror enforcers with another.
There's a situational and culural see-sawing that seems to need to happen before such a group as a respectable upper-middle class equivalent of a neo nazi becomes available. The respectable classes generally move slowly, have a lot to lose, and they have to have their faith deeply shaken in the future and any possibility that things will stay the same or that they can be successful with what they've been successful at. That's both a good thing if we can fix the mistakes early, and a terrible thing if we don't.
I remember hearing the stories of people from places like Bosnia of how people who were quiet and generally meek law-abiding citizens did end up as the crime bosses when society completely collapsed. People like that I think have some sort of evolutionary hold out provision, ie. they're like nature hedging its bets for catastrophe, and those people tend to be ruthlessly proficient and can bring the full weight of high IQ to what they're doing.
That's part of why I do fear the breakdown of order. Most people are very slow to move to thuggish behavior and enterprise just that if consensus reality becomes a Hobbesian nightmare or it becomes clear that we have turned some kind of bend toward a fascist or communist state - those people will have that part of themselves, their dna, etc. come online and from there any hope of getting the stupidity and mistakes back in the bottle is next to impossible because the culture of despotism will properly be carrying the inertia and holding the more fundamental structure than civil republican-democratic society.
Yes, today's Alt Right, such as Richard Spencer, look like hipsters instead of the traditional cracker cross burners.
My guess is middle class Trump voters are keeping a low profile for now. In case they get tarred with the same racist brush.
I have seen no evidence Trump voters are having second thoughts and are hiding. On the news last night they went to an area that voted for Trump and interviewed Trump voters about Charlottsville and they agreed with Trump's both sides argument. My Facebook friends that voted for Trump have not pulled back.
I almost always disagree with Trump and very often laugh at him, but both the left and right in my opinion have a violence problem.
Kraichgauer
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Location: Spokane area, Washington state.
18 Aug 2017, 4:43 pm
ASPartOfMe wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
techstepgenr8tion wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
That's why the cultured, upper middle class SS pretty much replaced the Brown Shirts in the Night of the Long Knives. Hitler wanted respectability, and pretty much won it by replacing one group of terror enforcers with another.
There's a situational and culural see-sawing that seems to need to happen before such a group as a respectable upper-middle class equivalent of a neo nazi becomes available. The respectable classes generally move slowly, have a lot to lose, and they have to have their faith deeply shaken in the future and any possibility that things will stay the same or that they can be successful with what they've been successful at. That's both a good thing if we can fix the mistakes early, and a terrible thing if we don't.
I remember hearing the stories of people from places like Bosnia of how people who were quiet and generally meek law-abiding citizens did end up as the crime bosses when society completely collapsed. People like that I think have some sort of evolutionary hold out provision, ie. they're like nature hedging its bets for catastrophe, and those people tend to be ruthlessly proficient and can bring the full weight of high IQ to what they're doing.
That's part of why I do fear the breakdown of order. Most people are very slow to move to thuggish behavior and enterprise just that if consensus reality becomes a Hobbesian nightmare or it becomes clear that we have turned some kind of bend toward a fascist or communist state - those people will have that part of themselves, their dna, etc. come online and from there any hope of getting the stupidity and mistakes back in the bottle is next to impossible because the culture of despotism will properly be carrying the inertia and holding the more fundamental structure than civil republican-democratic society.
Yes, today's Alt Right, such as Richard Spencer, look like hipsters instead of the traditional cracker cross burners.
My guess is middle class Trump voters are keeping a low profile for now. In case they get tarred with the same racist brush.
I have seen no evidence Trump voters are having second thoughts and are hiding. On the news last night they went to an area that voted for Trump and interviewed Trump voters about Charlottsville and they agreed with Trump's both sides argument. My Facebook friends that voted for Trump have not pulled back.
That's why so many Republican representatives who despise Trump since his defence of the Alt Right are afraid to speak out against him. They know their constituents who had voted them in have such a cultish and fanatical devotion to Trump that they couldn't win the election for dog catcher if they did.
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-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer
18 Aug 2017, 5:52 pm
The President made a perfectly adequate statement regarding nazi/kkk/white supremacy which the left rejected.
Donald Trump wrote:
Racism is evil -- and those who cause violence in its name are criminals and thugs, including KKK, neo-Nazis, white supremacists, and other hate groups are repugnant to everything we hold dear as Americans,"
I think it's hard for many to take much seriously from a party that were calling him the worst president in history and demanding he be impeached before he even took office.
ASPartOfMe
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18 Aug 2017, 8:01 pm
Kraichgauer wrote:
ASPartOfMe wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
techstepgenr8tion wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
That's why the cultured, upper middle class SS pretty much replaced the Brown Shirts in the Night of the Long Knives. Hitler wanted respectability, and pretty much won it by replacing one group of terror enforcers with another.
There's a situational and culural see-sawing that seems to need to happen before such a group as a respectable upper-middle class equivalent of a neo nazi becomes available. The respectable classes generally move slowly, have a lot to lose, and they have to have their faith deeply shaken in the future and any possibility that things will stay the same or that they can be successful with what they've been successful at. That's both a good thing if we can fix the mistakes early, and a terrible thing if we don't.
I remember hearing the stories of people from places like Bosnia of how people who were quiet and generally meek law-abiding citizens did end up as the crime bosses when society completely collapsed. People like that I think have some sort of evolutionary hold out provision, ie. they're like nature hedging its bets for catastrophe, and those people tend to be ruthlessly proficient and can bring the full weight of high IQ to what they're doing.
That's part of why I do fear the breakdown of order. Most people are very slow to move to thuggish behavior and enterprise just that if consensus reality becomes a Hobbesian nightmare or it becomes clear that we have turned some kind of bend toward a fascist or communist state - those people will have that part of themselves, their dna, etc. come online and from there any hope of getting the stupidity and mistakes back in the bottle is next to impossible because the culture of despotism will properly be carrying the inertia and holding the more fundamental structure than civil republican-democratic society.
Yes, today's Alt Right, such as Richard Spencer, look like hipsters instead of the traditional cracker cross burners.
My guess is middle class Trump voters are keeping a low profile for now. In case they get tarred with the same racist brush.
I have seen no evidence Trump voters are having second thoughts and are hiding. On the news last night they went to an area that voted for Trump and interviewed Trump voters about Charlottsville and they agreed with Trump's both sides argument. My Facebook friends that voted for Trump have not pulled back.
That's why so many Republican representatives who despise Trump since his defence of the Alt Right are afraid to speak out against him. They know their constituents who had voted them in have such a cultish and fanatical devotion to Trump that they couldn't win the election for dog catcher if they did.
That and they think somehow he can help them with their agenda.
_________________
Professionally Identified and joined WP August 26, 2013
DSM 5: Autism Spectrum Disorder, DSM IV: Aspergers Moderate Severity
“My autism is not a superpower. It also isn’t some kind of god-forsaken, endless fountain of suffering inflicted on my family. It’s just part of who I am as a person”. - Sara Luterman
