Will the US be like a rerun of the fall of the Roman Empire?

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A non-warfaring empire would be a contradiction in terms

War is something that describes the human condition. Not the political construct. One nation can be granted inhabited land through a trade agreement and legitimately declare itself an "empire". War is not necessary.

Can't say I would be too terribly upset if it did collapse like the roman empire did the system we have really does not mean a whole lot to me, and I'm just being honest.

The Roman State did not collapse as in crash boom. It petered out.

ruveyn

Very astute.

If the U.S. is to survive (and prosper) it must restore much of its home productive capacity and it has to pay down the long term debt. The debt has got to be shrunk and eventually eliminated. The only debt that can be permit is relative short term debt that is required for start up or expansion capital in productive business. Such debt can be retired in short order by the production that borrowed capital can engender. Government debt other than very short term debt has got to be done away with.

ruveyn

Give some historical examples, please.

ruveyn

Empires fall from within. The main cause is when The State, the means of power, develops other goals than the Nation, the economic benefit of the People.

America is past there, the needs of the industries producing materials for war, were used to do some flag waving, followed by a series of unfunded wars, which were used by the bankers to fund the purchase and export of most other industry.

Now the People are stuck with paying the interest on a $15 Trillion dollar debt that was run up for the benefit of Private Interests.

That is ten times the income of the government, they have been overspending income by a Trillion a year, and in a little over a decade have created an unsupportable debt burden.

This has replaced the National Debt, the paid for retirement of the War Babies, which is now coming due. 10,000 a day retiring now.

There is no way to pay the domestic obligations of government, and even maintain debt service on the National Debt. There is no way for the Government to continue other than running up the debt.

It started a while back, The Superpower that did not pay for, Health, Education, Welfare of the People, and now the retirement system.

These are the Primary Functions of Government.

That they had to for energy security is a lie, the Trillions spent to overthrow Iraq which only produces a million barrels a day, $100 Million, a Billion in ten days, a Trillion in 10,000 days. A Trillion is 30 years production, we spent several. The oil still sells at world market price, just as it did under Saddam, before Sanctions. $13 a barrel.

Terrorists is another lie, Reagan and Ollie North admitted to funding Osama, supporting terror against the Russians in Afganistan.

Currently it is public knowledge that the terrorists invading Syria are trained, supported, armed, from US bases in Turkey.

If you think this was for Freedom, liberating people, nation building, take your next vacation in Bagdad. You will find out how free you are when trying to board a plane in the US.

An American Spring would result in Libya, Restoring the economy costs more than we have, retiring debt calls for triple taxes.

Providing the People with the basic services of government, Health, Education, Retirement, will cost more.

Abolishing government, making me Dictator, taxing net worth, it would still take decades.

I blame one Minority, Congress. Their retirement should be to be kept naked in cages in the National Zoo, and have to perform for peanuts.

Strict term limitation would also work. We have to do away with the class of professional politicians for life. A pre-requisite for hold office should be five years experience as an independent business man or a worker at the real job where performance counts

ruveyn

Hmm well then on second thoughts maybe the collapse of the roman empire is a little soft for what i hope happens to this system.

I'm looking back on the fall of previous empires, and we do have much in common as a trend in the US. But let us remember that several factors are causing a much more rapid decline now, such as IT and the modernity paradigm. Power and control have been made accessible to Non-Western nations with a technology that requires a priesthood of programmers, all of them for hire. The barbarians are indeed at the gate, waiting for one of us to blink....

I think it a little late for that, it would not answer our Greek level of debt.

It is rearranging the deck chairs at this point, with a projected doubling of debt over the next decade.

Arithmetic, History, Geography tests would have helped. Now there is no choice but government by printing press. Whatever we produce can be produced cheaper, so unless we impose import quotas, tarrifs, we can not even hold our domestic market.

Applied Technology, the usual way to more profitable production, has now reached the point of "No Humans Need Apply." Unemployment is a future constant, which reduces consumers, and in Marketing, Amazon undersells Walmart. The Profit motive is being removed.

This leaves no room for a Grassroots Recovery. Any profitable product developed will be copied, and mass money will produce it offshore and sell it at the least possible profit.

The problem is Liquid Capital, a vast excess of funds seeking short term profit.

All other forms of ownership are taxed, land, cattle, forests, factories, but money rides free. Only the earnings of Liquid Capital are taxed, and that after deductions.

This is the reason that Ten Year T Bills pay 1.99%, $100,000 will earn $1.990 a year. Inflation is higher, so the best investment is a loss.

Excess Capital is what funded the Stock Market rise, the Housing Bubble, Student Loan Debt, Credit Cards, all seeking higher returns from doing nothing but having capital.

The only answer is a tax based on Net Worth. A flat 5% tax on everything above $250,000 would reduce Capital, which like thinning out a herd of deer, leaves the survivors stronger. Taxing Income, is like having the same deer overpopulation, and taking some food away from all of them.

The structure of our government has not changed, where our economic system has.

So we get the old answer, Hill Bandits in Viet Nam, a Peaceful partition of Korea, A Saudi Construction company in Afganistan, our man in Bagdad, some reason to Cry Havoc and release the dogs or War! War means not having to say you'er sorry for screwing up the economy.

What we need, which even Reagan saw, is full employment, and higher taxes. Running the printing press to fund consumers, will produce demand.

Reagan was senile, and he saw it!

Of, By and For The People is still a good idea.

the roman empire gradualy declined over a 2 hundred year period.the formal fall of rome to the ostrogoths in 476ce was just a formality.if the usa falls it will be all at once caused by an inability to pay its debt.i just dont see the americas land being chiped away by other countries through wars.

That wont happen. The government will print enough money to pay off the debt., It wont be worth sh*t but it will pay off the debt.

ruveyn

exactly,which would devalue are curancy and would make us even more vunerable to a hostile economic takeover

The U.S. has suffered a hostile takeover (by the government) since the administration of FDR.

The most hostile is Congress regulating every aspect of commerce.

ruveyn