[IMPORTANT] Hamas launches foot assault against settlements.

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Dead children are dead children, no matter who you believe. If you are asking me personally, I don't trust either.

Both groups have lied. I don’t understand why people are insisting that we choose a side. This isn’t football. Victims are victims no matter what side of the fence they call home. Hamas and the IDF have killed many people. They both suck.

It’s absurd to get so caught up in who’s wrong about what that we lose our humanity.

Its also likely If Israel have a ceasfire HAMAS will regroup and fire rockets over their borders.

@cyberdad

How would you feel if you and your family were citizens of Gaza?

Parents who lose children there are just as devastated as Israeli parents.

...who's fault it is those kids are dead depends on which side you believe.

They are dead either way. Victims on both sides deserve the same amount of compassion.

Congratulations for completely ignoring my post and answer to his question, I guess.

You wrote something that I care a lot about.

I ask if possible not to use the dead for purposes like those of the last posts.

Human life is Sacred.

The life of a child is a thousand times more.

Does anyone who wrote some comments have any idea what they are writing?


If it happened to their families, would they comment like this?

They happen to children, defenseless people.

Civilians.


Helpless.

You don't realize it at all.
<>
I close with apologies
for part of my penultimate post here.

Sentences appear in Off Topic, I cannot edit them.

If that happens, it's not a ceasefire.

So it was a comment about appointing blame, I see. I don't see how that was relevant to a comment about the amount of child fatalities.

On multiple occasions, CD has replied to TP's anti-war / pro-people stance with pro IDF comments, he appears to not be able to have compassion for dead children unless they are wearing his teams colour - weird behaviour

I have said that if Israel had an option that did not involve civilian casualties they should take it, I don't want civilians to die any more than you do. But here's the thing, Israel are in an untenable position, Whatever they do they lost the high ground, And bombing Gaza isn't going to get them the hostages back, But what choice do they have if they are being fired on?

Of course they have a choice. They can decide too many Palestinian civilians are being killed and just stop and withdraw as is being demanded of them. That will embolden Hamas, Hezbollah, and Iran to launch more attacks and destroy the moral of the IDF and most of the Israeli public. These attacks might not occur right away because one would expect they won’t be so asleep for a period of time.

At one time they traded over a thousand prisoners to Hamas for one soldier. It was entirely predictable that Hamas would take massive amount of hostages at some point in the future.

Because of the military advantage that Israel has there is a valid argument to be made that if Israel took a purely defensive posture from now on, overall less civilians will be killed. Thing is the Israeli government is responsible for Israelis not the world. When dealing with the these types of groups a purely defensive policy in the long run is an act of self immolation.

Not that what they are doing now won’t have the same end result. The policy they have chosen is a horrific one for themselves never mind innocent Palestinians. There is no other way to put this. Most defenders of their current policy are either disingenuous or self deluded in this regard.

An Israeli victory over Hamas is far from guaranteed despite their advantages. Hamas is fighting on and below their own turf. Their tunnel system is said to be bigger then Manhattans. That neutralizes a lot of Israel’s advantages. This will come down to will power. Israeli soldiers are fighting for a government a lot of them blame for putting the country in this situation. Post defeat Israel's military would be ground down. Why would not Iran/Hezbollah take advantage and go all out? And we have not even gotten to the effect on diaspora Jews. Just look at how much 10/7 changed the equation.

But Israel destroying Hamas is plausible. They are being deliberate as a tactic to neutralize Hamas’s advantages. So Hamas is gone, now what?. Israel does not want Gaza, they have said they have no intention of staying there. Nobody else wants to deal with the Palestinians either. The blockade everybody criticizes Israel for in actuality has always been a joint Egyptian-Israeli blockade. The Abraham Accords was in part designed to throw the Palestinians under the bus.

The only country that has the resources to rebuild a razed Gaza is the U.S. That said we suck at nation building, we are divided and becoming more isolationist and in no way will take in seething Palestinian survivors.

IMHO the best case scenario from the Israeli perspective is they won’t like it but they are going to have to reoccupy Gaza. Despite claims that this was different at most it will be like all other Israel-Hamas wars. A Palestinian insurgency will be reconstituted one way or another. Since this is a best case scenario this process takes longer than in the past.

Last edited by ASPartOfMe on 07 Nov 2023, 4:27 am, edited 2 times in total.

Yes this is what I have been saying


Then obviously the cost will be > any benefit in terms of what HAMAS want in exchange for 240 hostages


It shouldn't just by the IDF involved. There are foreign nationals who have nothing to do with the conflict being held prisoner. Why aren't other nations sending troops.

One of the young women filmed getting murdered by HAMAS was a girl with cerebral palsy. The Palestinian men torturing her before shooting had zero compassion for her.

^^^
I had no idea about the girl you mentioned last in your post, but it doesn't surprise me. Hamas are terrorists and war criminals, and need to be treated as such.

.
Should and realpolitik are two different things.

Actually the Americans have sent in special forces to help rescue hostages.

First of all most of the hostages will be dead. I am far from convinced that the Israeli claims we will do anything to save the hostages are anything more then PR. Negotiating with Hamas is an exercise in stupidity. All they will do throw out a few hostages at a time, and some gruesome videos. Delay, delay, delay. Hamas recovers a bit during these delays. The constant stop-start will take the edge off of the IDF. A longer war means a lot of key people to run business and families are being deployed for a longer period of time. Before 10/7 that was a price Israel was willing to pay. I think now the hostages are considered more painful than normal collateral damage.

House to house fighting in a densely populated ruins and tunnel fighting is not conducive to rescuing hostages. Israel reportedly has a weapon that expands and blocks tunnels. While this saves IDF lives and kills terrorists it also kills the hostages.

At some point the hostages will become a burden to Hamas and will be killed.

A lot of people pay lip service to the Palestinians but who is going put their troops on the line for a conflict nobody has been able to solve for a century? I suppose a country would accept money but at the first sign of trouble these mercenaries will be out of there. Overall the attitude will be you Israel caused this, you did not listen the world wide outpouring, reap what you sowed.

https://www.dw.com/en/israel-hamas-war- ... e-67312332