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Just like dealers in Vegas, police officers on video camera?

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AardvarkGoodSwimmer
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19 Dec 2014, 12:21 pm

Vegas takes the approach of keeping honest people honest. The camera is not meant as an aspersion against someone. It's just the way they do things.

I heard this guy giving a video talk how casinos are way ahead of other businesses as far as cash control. The guy said his mother is the most moral, ethical person in the entire world. But if Mom's dealing blackjack, she's going to be on camera and that's just all there is to it. And it was really funny how he said it.

It should be very similar with police officers. The question is, How do we bring it about?



Dantac
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20 Dec 2014, 6:18 pm

The tech for it exists problem is that it is very expensive and there is no political willpower to make it mandatory (in law and policy).



Humanaut
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20 Dec 2014, 6:26 pm

Body cameras are relatively cheap, and it seems like they are becoming more and more common.



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28 Dec 2014, 9:42 am

Indeed, and an initial study supports my intuitive guess that they would keep police officers more honest: http://www.dailynewsnow.com/articles/14 ... -force.htm

It makes sense - just knowing you're being recorded makes you think twice about a questionable action that you might otherwise justify with "ah, who's going to know anyway?"

If supported by broader studies, I'd certainly like to see these body cameras become mandatory. They're not a silver bullet, of course, because the really malicious cops could still find a way to turn them off, but if they do this regularly that might at least flag them for closer investigation.


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maglevsky
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29 Dec 2014, 4:19 pm

I like it.
How about this: make it mandatory for cops to wear 3 body cams and keep them on at all times while on duty. As soon as 1 camera develops a problem - return to base to get a replacement. Failure to provide the footage if/when an allegation of improper behaviour is made against a cop should result in an instant, hefty fine, no exceptions - i.e. even if such allegations later turn out to be baseless, false or even downright malicious - i.e. explicitly allowing Joe Public to harrass cops into complying with this requirement by making claim upon claim until the fines eat up the cop's entire salary.
Cops also should have some kind of unique ID (name or number) on their uniforms, front and back, in big letters.
All of this should make it easy to bring complaints against misbehaving cops, and at the same time make it easy for them to disprove any untrue allegations against themselves.

Any flaws in that proposal? (apart from the fact that it's unlikely to get enacted anywhere anytime soon I guess)


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Protogenoi
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29 Dec 2014, 7:55 pm

maglevsky wrote:
I like it.
How about this: make it mandatory for cops to wear 3 body cams and keep them on at all times while on duty. As soon as 1 camera develops a problem - return to base to get a replacement. Failure to provide the footage if/when an allegation of improper behaviour is made against a cop should result in an instant, hefty fine, no exceptions - i.e. even if such allegations later turn out to be baseless, false or even downright malicious - i.e. explicitly allowing Joe Public to harrass cops into complying with this requirement by making claim upon claim until the fines eat up the cop's entire salary.
Cops also should have some kind of unique ID (name or number) on their uniforms, front and back, in big letters.
All of this should make it easy to bring complaints against misbehaving cops, and at the same time make it easy for them to disprove any untrue allegations against themselves.

Any flaws in that proposal? (apart from the fact that it's unlikely to get enacted anywhere anytime soon I guess)



Well, i think it was in Los Angelos where the cops have/had these cameras and they found that the footage went missing or that the camera was turned off prior to several noteworthy incidences.

The laws aren't in place yet to no ones benefit.


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29 Dec 2014, 8:23 pm

It would also give honest cops (which I assume to be the overwhelming majority) evidence to show they acted appropriately when an incident happens.



mpe
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29 Dec 2014, 8:46 pm

maglevsky wrote:
I like it.
How about this: make it mandatory for cops to wear 3 body cams and keep them on at all times while on duty. As soon as 1 camera develops a problem - return to base to get a replacement. Failure to provide the footage if/when an allegation of improper behaviour is made against a cop should result in an instant, hefty fine, no exceptions - i.e. even if such allegations later turn out to be baseless, false or even downright malicious - i.e. explicitly allowing Joe Public to harrass cops into complying with this requirement by making claim upon claim until the fines eat up the cop's entire salary.

Such a fine would need to be paid by the individual police officer.
Also payment of such a fine should not intefere with investigation of the complaint or the arrest and trial of the police officer should the complaint be one which would result in that were it made against a civilian.
Quote:
Cops also should have some kind of unique ID (name or number) on their uniforms, front and back, in big letters.
All of this should make it easy to bring complaints against misbehaving cops, and at the same time make it easy for them to disprove any untrue allegations against themselves.

With it being possible to apply laws against "impersonating a police officer" against "cops" who wore (police like) uniforms without such identification.



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29 Dec 2014, 8:53 pm

It's a good idea.

It cuts down on any ambiguity.

#obamacameras



AardvarkGoodSwimmer
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04 Mar 2015, 1:49 pm

maglevsky wrote:
I like it.
How about this: make it mandatory for cops to wear 3 body cams and keep them on at all times while on duty. As soon as 1 camera develops a problem - return to base to get a replacement. Failure to provide the footage if/when an allegation of improper behaviour is made against a cop should result in an instant, hefty fine, no exceptions - i.e. even if such allegations later turn out to be baseless, false or even downright malicious - i.e. explicitly allowing Joe Public to harrass cops into complying with this requirement by making claim upon claim until the fines eat up the cop's entire salary.
Cops also should have some kind of unique ID (name or number) on their uniforms, front and back, in big letters.
All of this should make it easy to bring complaints against misbehaving cops, and at the same time make it easy for them to disprove any untrue allegations against themselves.

Any flaws in that proposal? (apart from the fact that it's unlikely to get enacted anywhere anytime soon I guess)
This is actually a very well-thought out proposal, and I thank you.

The only thing I would add is that any static system, even the best static system in the world, can be beat. A system kind of needs to allow itself to become a dynamic system and keep evolving and keep adopting to circumstances. I don't know how, but cops on the financial take can find a way to beat the system. Cops who are mean, who have a temper, who are rage-aholics, who probably shouldn't be cops in the first place, maybe won't beat this system.



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04 Mar 2015, 1:59 pm

AardvarkGoodSwimmer wrote:

It should be very similar with police officers. The question is, How do we bring it about?


Yes it should be, and no idea how to bring it about...except by the public demanding it and refusing to stop till it happens, but I think we all know what happened to the Occupy movement, it just kind of died....now there are remnents of it left in various states including mine that are just crap and do more to spread us vs. them thinking than actually attempting to address or solve any issues or that's what its seeming like to me.


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