Having philosophical crisis

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Seeker883
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24 May 2016, 4:05 pm

Recently, because of severe panic attacks and recently diagnosed OCD, my doctor instructed me to transfer from Cipralex to Zoloft. Over the last few weeks I've had a pretty rough time, with both physical and mental withdrawal symptoms from the Cipralex. Physically I've been having numbness and electric shock sensations, which I can deal with, but on the mental side I've been suffering from extreme agitation, bouts of anger, and almost continuous anxiety. Normally I tend to have a fairly optimistic view of the world, but over the last couple of weeks I've had several points when I wished the entire world would be destroyed, and that everyone in the world would die in the most brutal ways I could imagine...it's pretty disturbing and I've been worried for the last little while about my mental health...anyway, a few days ago, I realized it's likely just the Cipralex withdrawal and/or the transition to the Zoloft which is causing this extreme anger and agitation for me, but that's opened up a sort of philosophical crisis for me.

Basically, if my outlook on life and my own fundamental thoughts can be altered so strongly by basic chemistry, then how can I, or anyone for that matter, really claim to be a "being"? Really everything with a brain on the planet is ruled by neurochemistry, ordinary cellular and chemical processes in the brain. There's no miraculous source of what we call the "self". Basically I've found myself doubting the existence of the mind, essence, being, or self. All I am, and all everyone really is, is just the sum of a bunch of biological processes. It doesn't even make sense to refer to our "selves" as "I" - saying "we" would make more sense, since what we call the "self" is really just the sum of our brain cells interacting chemically and electrically.

So I now feel that there is no self, and the only purpose to life from an objective standpoint is to reproduce. I'm not even sure if I ever want to have kids, and if I don't, then by the standards of nature I have literally failed at life. There is no other reason to exist. Any of our other actions are ultimately pointless as they just are forgotten eventually and fade into the past. Needless to say, this line of thought has left me in a state of melancholy. I already find myself thinking "Why should I do this? In the end, what's the point?" I feel like my whole existence is pointless and there's no reason to ever do anything beyond personal gain. Making a difference in someone else's life doesn't matter, since eventually they will die. Sending a mesage doesn't matter, because eventually the message will be forgotten.

I'm in a dark place philosophically, and I don't see any way out...I'd like to be able to improve my outlook and my state of mind but I don't know how to....



BenderRodriguez
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24 May 2016, 5:12 pm

First of all, I think you should discuss your medication with someone and sort that out. Such things can be dangerous.

Then, let me put it this way: does everybody know Beethoven's name because he had a bunch of children? Does it matter if his music came from his "self" or God, or a chemical reaction in his brain? Is it less real?

Physical pain is nothing else but a chemical reaction in your brain too, is it hurting any less if you're aware of that?

I'm not an optimist and hold no illusions about human nature and the world, but it puzzles me why once they find out that their thoughts and emotions are just "chemical reactions in the brain" people jump to the illogical conclusion that this makes them "less real" and worthless.


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cavernio
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24 May 2016, 5:41 pm

Yes life is pointless. So yes just do what makes you happiest.


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Tollorin
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24 May 2016, 11:53 pm

Seeker883 wrote:
So I now feel that there is no self, and the only purpose to life from an objective standpoint is to reproduce. I'm not even sure if I ever want to have kids, and if I don't, then by the standards of nature I have literally failed at life. There is no other reason to exist. Any of our other actions are ultimately pointless as they just are forgotten eventually and fade into the past. Needless to say, this line of thought has left me in a state of melancholy. I already find myself thinking "Why should I do this? In the end, what's the point?" I feel like my whole existence is pointless and there's no reason to ever do anything beyond personal gain. Making a difference in someone else's life doesn't matter, since eventually they will die. Sending a mesage doesn't matter, because eventually the message will be forgotten.

I'm in a dark place philosophically, and I don't see any way out...I'd like to be able to improve my outlook and my state of mind but I don't know how to....

The purpose of life is the one you give to it.



aspieinaz
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25 May 2016, 3:34 am

Sorry to hear you are having a hard time with the drug switch and I hope that soon passes. I realize that other people have a different state of brain chemicals and wiring than I have, and I have come to accept that I will never be like "normal people." I have also lived long enough (age 63) to see that what I have done with my life (teacher for 34 years) has made a difference for the better in people's lives, and has been passed to their kids, who will pass it on to their kids. I see life as kind of a relay race. I have tried to pass the torch of what I think to be good and right to the next generation. I wasn't able to have kids, so I never reproduced. But I passed the torch. It is certain that I have less years of life on this earth ahead of me than are behind me because I am never going to live to be 126. But I hope this world will be a little better place after I am gone because I passed the torch. Sorry if that analogy isn't helpful for you. It is what works for me.


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sonicallysensitive
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25 May 2016, 8:06 am

Seeker883 wrote:
Basically, if my outlook on life and my own fundamental thoughts can be altered so strongly by basic chemistry, then how can I, or anyone for that matter, really claim to be a "being"? Really everything with a brain on the planet is ruled by neurochemistry, ordinary cellular and chemical processes in the brain. There's no miraculous source of what we call the "self". Basically I've found myself doubting the existence of the mind, essence, being, or self. All I am, and all everyone really is, is just the sum of a bunch of biological processes. It doesn't even make sense to refer to our "selves" as "I" - saying "we" would make more sense, since what we call the "self" is really just the sum of our brain cells interacting chemically and electrically.


You can claim to be a being as: despite the thoughts changing, they are still within your own head/mind.

Therefore, they are still 'your' thoughts.

To see chemistry as somehow 'ruling' your thoughts is no different from saying you are in a prison because of gravity/because of having legs etc.

Physical constraints/processes are partly what define us as independent entities. Without them, you could claim to be anyone, or anyone else's thoughts.

Most things can be described in one specific term i.e. a flower could be described artistically, psychologically, mathematically etc. This doesn't mean a flower is 'only' maths, but rather, can be described as such when viewed in such a manner.

Do we consist of biological processes? Yes. But is it all we consist of?

Someone could describe you in biological terms. Someone could describe you in artistic terms etc.



yourkiddingme3
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25 May 2016, 9:14 am

Your philosophical crisis is classic. I visit there every couple of months myself, even when my chemistry seems quite balanced. But I was a philosophy major. :) What makes these particular questions so overwhelming right now (as opposed to the life questions you might usually find overwhelming) is unbalanced chemistry. That fact, repeated to yourself, should take the edge off, so long as, unlike me, these philosophical questions are not one of your usual obsessions.

There are many discussion groups outside WP that hotly debate what is the self, what is identify, and, of course, whether everything is determined or free will exists. I am a passionate supporter of self-definition and free will, despite all the current scientific evidence against it. After all, science has been wrong before. Repeatedly. Partial and expanding knowledge, but still partial, is the nature of the beast. Unless you believe diseases are caused by miasmas rather than microscopic beasties, you should not worry about drawing conclusions about the self from Newtonian or quantum physics.

And I haven't even scratched the surface of ontologies other than science's "naive reality." Check out Buddhist and Hindu ontology, believed by more humans than our western naive reality. Actually, a really good book to help you control your current anxiety might be "The Dalai Lama's Cat." It has kitty bites of Buddhism you can practice purely to see if they improve your equilibrium, regardless of whether the ontological theories behind the practice seem nonsense to you.

Finally, the first philosophy joke I ever heard went like this:

To achieve distribution requirements, a jock signed up for an Introduction to Philosophy seminar. At the first class, the professor discussed precisely your issue, what is the self? After class, the jock, who had been sure he knew his place in the universe, couldn't get the professor's questions out of his head.

More and more confused and distraught, the jock walked the campus until the wee hours of the morning, when he pounded on the door of the professor's apartment.

Bleary-eyed in his pajamas, the professor opened the door.

"Who am I!" screamed the jock.

The professor blinked. "Who wants to know?"



DataB4
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26 May 2016, 5:07 pm

Seeker883 wrote:
I now feel that there is no self, and the only purpose to life from an objective standpoint is to reproduce. I'm not even sure if I ever want to have kids, and if I don't, then by the standards of nature I have literally failed at life. There is no other reason to exist. Any of our other actions are ultimately pointless as they just are forgotten eventually and fade into the past. Needless to say, this line of thought has left me in a state of melancholy. I already find myself thinking "Why should I do this? In the end, what's the point?" I feel like my whole existence is pointless and there's no reason to ever do anything beyond personal gain. Making a difference in someone else's life doesn't matter, since eventually they will die. Sending a mesage doesn't matter, because eventually the message will be forgotten.

I'm in a dark place philosophically, and I don't see any way out...I'd like to be able to improve my outlook and my state of mind but I don't know how to....

There are ways to turn these thoughts around and still reflect the same basic truths.
What we do with our relatively short lives matters a lot, because we want to whatever we can before we die.

Our emotions affect our thoughts and vise versa. Chemicals from the medications are part of the story.

We're a jumbled up mix of the rational and the irrational, and we can start to bring some order to the mess, every time we change a negative thought around.

It often helps me to write down or speak about things I'm grateful for, and things that make me happier, and ways I help people. Want to list a couple of them here?

I hope you can find some peace within yourself soon.



DataB4
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05 Jun 2016, 8:04 am

Hi. Hoping you are doing better now, and if not, the forum is here for you. :)