Food sold live

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I can get fresh chicken any time around here. It's better than grocery store chicken, but they don't cut it up for you so I only get that kind for roasting, not frying. I don't know how to cut it up right. I buy it all the time. If I were to let a chicken go, it would just get got by dogs somewhere.

If fresh fish bugs you this might make you a vegetarian.

Watch Farm to Fridge on YouTube. http://youtu.be/tzrRmB40l00 It makes no difference if it bought dead or alive it will be dead by the time most people eat it.

Last edited by johnny77 on 28 Jul 2012, 7:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I am suggesting keeping them as pets as opposed to releasing them.

But if you keep them as pets then they are safe from dogs. So buying them and keeping them as pets is the best option.

Why would I want chickens as pets? I wouldn't think chickens make good pets, and you also have to fence off an area for them, etc. Lots of neighbors have chickens here and it's a lot of work. I also have two large dogs that could easily get into anything I built for them in the back yard. Our back yard perimeter fence had to be electrified to keep them in because they escape easily. (Wolf hybrids) They would just be a meal for the dogs instead of a meal for us if I tried that, and I doubt they would die as quick if the dogs got them as when somebody wrings their neck to sell them.

The purpose of keeping them as pets is to save them from being eaten by someone else who would buy them if you didnt. So it has nothing to do with your enjoyment but a lot more to do with saving someone from death.

Not happening. Number one it would be hypocritical of me to save some chicken from death and go to the grocery store and buy another one. Number two, I'm not having any pet that I don't get some enjoyment out of. If I want to go to a lot of trouble and expense to save someone from death, it's going to actually be someone and I'll do an Angelina Jolie and adopt a bunch of starving kids. Worth more to me to save a kid than to save food.

I live in the country. Animals are killed all the time for food aroud here. I live across from a place that raises sheep, pigs, cows, and goats. For food. About every 7th or 8th house around here has chickens, for eggs and for meat. Nobody sells live fish here, we live too close to a river and people do their own fishing if they don't want to buy it from the grocery store. Hunting is extremely popular here, and people just give venison away during deer season.

I do understand that you don't like the idea of having something killed so that you can eat it. It's personal that way. It died for you, not just so that some nameless person can eat it after it's sold. I really don't think that buying them to release them or keep them as pets will prevent any other ones from being eaten, it will just save that one particular fish, chicken, pig, etc. Now if that's worth it to you and important, I'd certainly say do it. But it's an expense that you'll have that doesn't really change anything. However, if that's what you want to do, I say go for it and be true to your causes like that. I do wonder though why not go to an animal shelter and get a rescue dog or cat that's a day away from getting put down instead of a trout or lobster. Although everybody has their own preferences.

It wont be. If you go to store and buy chicken, that chicken is dead anyway. So even if you were to become vegetarian you wont save it. But if you talk about live chicken then you do have a real opportunity to save it so if you miss that opportunity it becomes your fault its dead.

Now if you were to live in a very small village then yes it would be wrong to buy dead chicken. After all, each person would be noticed by the ones that sell and thus they would be encouraged to kill more chicken. On the other hand, in a big city, your eating habbits wont affect anyones decision of how many chickens to kill so you might as well eat as much chicken as you want.

BUT if you talk about live chicken then thigns are very different. In this case you DO have an impact on the specific chicken you are buying so you are morally responsible for not killing it.



But you see, if someone starves to death it is not as bad as if they were deliberately killed.

This brings me to another point. If you dont have means to take care of chicken, still keeping it as pet and letting it starve would be a better option than killing it. That is also why I am opposed to them putting animals down in humane societies.



No, the issue is not that it died FOR me, the issue is that it died BECAUSE OF me. Regardless of whether I will eat it, or I will sell it to someone else, or I am doing my job in humane society, etc. in all those cases I make my own decision to kill an animal and THAT is the kind of decision I cant stand making.



And I never said it would save others; I am saying that the life of each individual chicken is worth saving. Much like when you save a human being, you dont care about the death statistics, you care about the unique individual you are saving. Likewise I feel bad for that unique chicken who is about to be killed.

Well I do understand you and I do admire your commitment to your cause. I do disagree though for myself, and consider food animals to be food that just happens to still be alive. Those are my thoughts on it and your's are obviously different and I think it's perfectly ok for us to disagree on this.

I see it, when I get a chicken, that it's going to be dying anyway soon so why should I not be the one who gets to eat it. I also do disagree strongly that letting it starve to death is better. I think that's very cruel although I understand that it's probably more about your own decision to not make a decision than it is the animals feelings.

Just because humans called them food doesnt make them food. It makes them victims of human injustice.



It WOULD HAVE been dying IF you didnt buy her. But you bought her, so you saved her from death. And then you betrayed her by killing her yourself.



If you believe that from point of view of animals feelings death is a better option, how come you are not applying it to humans? Granted, some places practice euthanasia (which I strongly disagree with) but even then they ask patients consent. An animal never gave a consent to be killed. Furthermore, judging from the fact that there are suicidal humans but there are NO suicidal animals,we can infer that animals dont want to be killed.

Besides, when I said starvation I was only bringing up extreme case. EVEN IF it came down to starving them, it would be better option then killing them. BUT it doesnt have to come to that. It is very easy to keep throwing some left over food to keep chickens alive and requires no extra work on your part.

^^ The reason is because I see a big difference in animals and humans.

Also, as I said before, I can't just put chickens in my yard. I have big dogs. It would require a lot of extra work. Plus, feeding chickens leftover human food is not good for them. They have a different digestive system than we do.

Animals can not defend themselves so this particular difference is what makes me feel bad for them.



Even if leftover human food is not healthy for them it wont kill them. So it is rather hypocritical to say that it is better to kill them than to subject them to unhealthy lifestyle.

If by "unhealthy lifestyle" you mean living with malnutrition and GI pain, which would happen if you fed a chicken leftover human food, then it's far less hypocritical to say that the are better off with their necks wrung quickly than to suffer for much longer period of time before they die anyway. I don't know if you have ever seen how chickens are killed when you buy them from a small farm, but it's very quick and the chicken doesn't know whats up at all. They are in the chicken yard, you walk back there with the farmer and point out which one you want. He goes in and picks it up, takes it outside, and with a very, very fast twist of the wrist, breaks it's neck and it's dead before it even knows it's neck is grabbed. The last thing it knows is that it's picked up and held in the farmers arms.

I doubt it's done that quickly or painlessly in factories, so wouldn't it actually be the kinder thing, if you are going to eat meat, to eat the chicken that's killed quickly after a life in the yard than one from a factory?

I don't think that extending somethings life just for the sake of keeping it alive, when it's not going to have a decent life, is wrong.

I wasn't going to butt in but the chicken you buy at the store suffers a lot more than having its head cut off or neck wrung. I posted Farm to Fridge to show you that not seeing it isn't any better. Don't save a chicken that will likely die a slow painful death due to the fact that most chickens sold for meat grow 4 times faster than there egg laying cousins causing heart and other internal organ problems. I raise chickens for eggs and to have one living off scraps will cause the stomachs to rot dieing very painfully. Ive saved some from that death from miss informed "owners" she produced for 3 years once made healthy again. As to the argument that "I can save this one and because I'm not in some small town it wont effect other chickens because the farmer don't see me taking this one, Wrong logic if you buy that one it is kept in tally to know how many to order the next time and possibly more because Ive sold more this month than last causing two chickens to die for the one bought. Another thing that your probably not aware of is that chickens are cannibalistic If one is sick It will be killed by the others and not quickly ether.
I buy my chicken live from traditional local farms that let them free range during the day and coup'd up at night and have a decent life unlike the chicken that come from the the store.

Watch and then decide for your self! http://youtu.be/tzrRmB40l00 Eat meat an animal will die, eat commercial produce at least 20 will die per field just smaller ones.

As to animals committing suicide its a yes no answer.

This only makes me feel even more inclined to try to help them.

Back in 2007 -- 2009 I was dating Jennifer. She had polycistic ovaries and as a result she was extremely overweight and had difficulty walking. Also in Spring 2008 she was bleeding so much during her cycle that she had to stay at home even though she was supposed to be working in her lab as a graduate student. She was taken to the hospital twice and doctors later told her that she could have died although they didnt tell her at the time. As a result of her not being in the lab she got in trouble in school and was suicidal in Summer 2008, although she never actually followed through. But I still remember being on the phone with her while she was crying. I was also helping her a lot during the Spring 2008 when she was so sick.

The point I am trying to make is that these chickens who are sick due to their excessive weight remind me of Jennifer. So I want to help them stay alive in the same way I was helping Jennifer to stay alive. Yes it will be painful for them; but amidst all their pain they would feel nurtured and cared for just like Jennifer was. These 3 months when Jennifer was sick was the best months in our relationship because she liked how much I cared for her (later in fall 2008 onward when she was no longer sick I started taking things for granted and thats why relationship ultimately failed).

The other parallel between chickens and Jennifer is that both were given up on. Jennifer's father was unwanted child, while Jennifer's mother was "less favorite" one in comparison to her sister. Both parents had their own emotional issues and were neglecting Jennifer as a result. That is part of a reason Jennifer was suicidal and depressed. In chickens case, they were also mistreated by their owner who viewed them as food and thats why he gave them hormons that make them 4 times larger and sick as a result. So just like I was trying to heal Jennifer from the harm she experienced at her parents home, I would also want to heal chickens from the harm inflicted on them by their owner who made them grow 4 times larger.

All I'm trying to say is saving the one would cause more to be harmed. If you want to help them don't eat them at all and let others know what they go thru before they get put under the wrapper in the store. I wont stop eating meat completely but at lest I wont cause the animal to suffer unduly before it reaches my plate. Ive watched a study that was to determine how "humane" the methods of putting the animals down was. Much to my surprise decapitation for small animals cut throat for larger cause the lowest amount of activity in the area of the brain that senses pain. The worse were in this order were electrocution, suffocation, blunt trauma, them brain lancing. As to healing them once they have reached market weight your to late at that point. Also they are flock type birds and they tend to get depressed when keep alone.