Feeling Desperate

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This will be a little glib because I'm watching a concert I care about while responding, but yes, here's an example of a list item:

1. The difficulty I have finding help or any sort of path to it is very real.

So these difficulties are partly social skills deficit, I'm guessing; and partly executive function deficits. Like, formulating and executing a plan.

Hi AJisHere,

Well, maybe relieving some of the stress actually CAN help solve some of your problems, in that your mind and body will be better prepared as follows:

1) You'll have more mental and physical energy to spend working on what matters to you. That can help give you strength to stay motivated. (Helps boost executive function.)

2) You'll have more energy to spend enjoying life. (Helps get rid of autistic comorbid symptoms of anxiety and depression.) And paradoxically, you'll have more energy to spend relaxing in a more productive way. (And by productive I don't mean that you're doing work, I mean that the relaxing is doing you good instead of being the kind of relaxing where you try to relax but still feel drained afterwards ... if you know what I mean. If not, please pardon my ramble.)

3) You'll be better able to deal with the people you come in contact with. (Helps boost your ability to handle social situations.) People can often see stress, or even signs of stress, as weakness or a lack of self confidence (traits interpreted as undesirable by NTs) ... so if people see you as less stressed, they see you as a more confident, relaxed person (you look more NT. Perhaps you are less likely to stim and more likely to smile, and guess what, this easier-going way of being comes more naturally to you because you feel better). And the best part is, it's not "acting like" someone you're not ... you're simply being a truly better version of yourself.

Hope some of this makes sense.

avoiding stress isn't a priority for me at all times, but it's definitely a priority overall anyway. i see it as one of the main pillars of any possible decent life i could ever choose to maintain or pursue. and it has been a big priority since i had a "mental breakdown" five years ago (although it hasn't been a consistent priority, i have to admit. only more recently). maybe that's the thing. sometimes it takes drastic events for some things to sink in, and you can't just choose to have one of those events happen to you. they're extremely unpleasant and disturbing. it's only sensible to avoid them at all costs. but then sometimes they can give you direction. a vivid reminder of things to avoid that you should have been avoiding all along. and a vidid reminder of the value of things you never realized you could lose. one of the paradoxes of life...

until about six years ago, avoiding stress wasn't a priority to me at all. sometimes i would get no sleep for three days in a row, because i needed to get something done. i had no respect for my own mortal limitations. i had a life to achieve, and nothing was going to stop me. except reality

that life just wasn't for me. i thought i wanted a family, children and stuff, and tons of money to support it all. back then, even questioning it was unthinkable to me. nowadays when i think of it, it all just seems completely insane. completely insane. i do not want children ever. i have absolutely no doubt about it. i do not want a big house. i do not want a car. and i'm not going to work any more than necessary either. my goal is to be as minimalistic as possible. i take pride in developing self-sufficiency skills and depending on as little money and resources as possible. it's a big part of my identity (and my values) now, and it's a good thing. it promotes a more sustainable life for myself

until the breakdown, i was frustrated that i was unable to relax (which is something i still have difficulty with, though not as much), but the fact is, i simply didn't recognize the value of relaxing and avoiding stress. i thought that if i worked hard enough, an acceptably satisfying life would just happen as a result someday, and then i'd have the opportunity to relax, and it would come naturally. i kept pushing myself more and more, believing it would eventually allow me to stop pushing myself altogether. but that doesn't work, ever

in retrospect, i can see that it was only a matter of time before i had a breakdown. all things considered, i'm glad that it happened sooner rather than later. imagine if i had actually managed to get married and have children before the inevitable breakdown . now i'm not "waiting for my life" anymore. even if my life right now may seem like even less than what it used to be, i'm infinitely more content with it as it is. i've learned to value simple things, and i feel in control (even if i don't know what to do with this control. now this is the issue i've been exploring for a while. but it's an issue i don't mind exploring forever, unlike the urgency of "starting my life")

i never completely stopped pushing myself, and i don't intend to (which is ironic, because i used to have that intention). sometimes i do push myself, and it's not subtle (a couple of months ago, i was crossing an island alone by bike, and then spending the next night in an international airport thousands of miles away ). but now i value my boring routine. and part of the reason why i choose to do those things sometimes is exactly because it helps me value my boring routine even more. no psychotherapy in the world could ever "teach me this lesson". only real-world shock therapy could (thankfully without any resulting offspring). so there's that. it's something to think about, if you haven't yet. to think about, or, even better, meditate on



(my hero and role model )

anagram, that was a valuable testimonial, I'm hoping it resonates with AJisHere.

AJ, some decades ago when I was working in a college counseling center, I did cognitive therapy with a young woman who planned to go to med school, but the only specialty she would consider was trauma surgeon (ER surgery). She was certain if she couldn't do that, there was no point. Years later, the tables were turned and she was treating me, for extreme back pain. She was a Physician Assistant, which is a paraprofessional position with a lot of responsibility and very good pay. That career route is suggested to a lot of young folks who want to become doctors; the debt load is considerably lower, the hours steady, it's a good job by any standard. She claimed she was happy with her career outcome.

Do you see a lesson here for your own values and beliefs? Could softening them actually work to your advantage?

Excellent advice, thank you! I'll keep this in mind once I get a new therapist.



This is exactly right, and is the conclusion we both came to.



I agree... this is probably the single biggest issue that I face.

@the_phoenix: Very true on all points. I'll start looking for some effective ways to relax. I've been considering taking up painting again, and also meditation. I think those could be pretty effective.



Some have softened considerably over recent years. I had to bend so I didn't break. The issue I've had is realizing that a lot of things I'd wanted to do are just not options to me at all. Whole fields largely cut off because no matter how much I'd like to be involved in them I can't find any jobs within them where autism isn't an insurmountable disadvantage. I'm trying to find fallback plans now, because I didn't have them before.

It does not feel hopeless, I'm just having to readjust and explore alternatives. I hope to get some good career counseling but have been unable to so far.

Ultimately, my need to help others is a core part of who I am and I need to be doing things that I feel allow me to do that. I'm actually quite flexible on how I go about this but finding a path to it has been a struggle. Whatever I choose to do, it will be easier without being burdened by my autism and so treating it more intensely is very important to me.

You want practical advice? It's like receiving a gift, isn't it? I welcome actual practical advice, whereas other people don't want to be reminded what's wrong with them. Hence the patronizing talk you mentioned.

I'm not sure if you've heard of it, but the type of councillor you want who doesn't say stupid things like, "You must be angry. How do you feel?" is the kind who offers you advice and makes you feel good about it. Actual, practical advice like how you really appear to other people. The type? Humanistic or person-centered.

Body Language books help a ton. Wearing sunglasses helps a ton, people seem to like me a lot more with them on.

If you can get a good enough councillor, ask them to teach you body language. One even took me to an airport to study how different people interacted, and how you could tell what type of relations they were to each other. He would also teach me in a cafeteria with all the students interacting.

Last thing is I would learn...I have no idea from where - how to speak and interpret things non-literally. It's the main thing that gets me in trouble.

I would avoid support groups. I take it like me you don't really want to be dragged down. Or you might.

@Smudge: It really is like a gift. It's like a breath of fresh air after all the meaningless platitudes.

Afraid my social difficulties are less straightforward; I pass as NT extremely well, but deeper connections are almost impossible and reading other people is still extremely challenging. There doesn't seem to be much for someone in this position. The general attitude seems to be that someone like me is "good enough" at social situations but I do not agree.

And yes, I don't plan on going to support groups anytime soon. Bunch of useless whining.

OK, well, for instance, I find it pretty easy to tell IRL when a man likes me. I can see other people flirting or getting bored with each other. Can you pick up on any of that?

Is it the act you put on that prevents you forming deeper meant relationships? What's your specific problem(s)?

believe it or not, i think i learned a lot of that stuff by watching tv shows like 'friends'

although i'm not sure if the "taking things literally" thing was ever a problem to me. more like "what could be the purpose of human interaction in real-life"

AJ, what kind of work do you do now?

It might be worthwhile studying how Tom Cruise evolves in the movie Edge of Tomorrow.

I see where you're coming from, though I think of TV as an over-exaggerated and idealised version of life. People don't really behave that way.

I would say though when watching politicians you can see the timings are odd in their for-show body language.

I can't pick up on it when it's happening to me, but I can when it's happening with others if I am paying attention. These are the sort of problems I have; I seem totally normal, but I can't pick up on the things that a non-autistic person would.



I have no doubt that my "mask" is part of the problem. It makes it very easy for me to have pretty shallow relationships. Acquaintances are easy... but I can't make friends. I've certainly never initiated any romantic relationship I've been in (though romance is a much lower priority for me). Beyond that, I am deeply upset with what I already mentioned... that I cannot "get on the same wavelength" as others in order to interact as smoothly and effectively as NTs do (even the ones who are awful at social interaction can do this). It's a very convincing act I put on and fools everyone, but it's still an act and that severely limits what I am able to achieve. A lot of what I want out of life requires that I be able to interact with others in a way that feels fluid and natural. Being unable to do that? It closes many doors for me.

I'm sorry if this all sounds vague. It's hard for me to wrap my head around all of it and I'll need to try again when I've slept and not right after a long day.

This is why I am willing to explore pharmaceutical or other medical solutions in addition to therapy. I really was not kidding in my original post when I said I'd be willing to undergo high-risk procedures if there was evidence they could allow more normal social functioning instead of just the superficial appearance of it. I would consider nearly any risk worth the potential payoff.



I'm a grocery store clerk. I mostly do customer service stuff and stock shelves. Not the greatest job in the world but it (barely) pays the rent. There's a strong possibility of being promoted soon and getting better pay and more desirable hours, but I can't do this for years and years.

Honestly, it's hard for me to stomach any job that has me working for a for-profit organization.

I gather you have been there for a while? Holding a job and holding it continuously for a period of time are very beneficial factors for being hired somewhere else.

I'm tired and trying to wake up so I have no other contributions at the moment, but I'll return to this thread.

It's been about a year now and I do plan to stick it out for a while and the reason you mention is part of why I want to do that. My job is definitely a positive thing right now and I make a point of doing it well even if I don't want to make a career out of it.

That in itself is quite a positive! You do your job well and know it; you have a mid-range goal of remaining at that job a while longer to improve your resume.

So what could we help you with? Is it a sense of constant tension? Do you need friendships? Are sensory issues a problem for you?

By the way, if your insurance doesn't cover the UW Adult Autism Clinic, ask who they have in plan that specializes in treating adult autism. Guess what, I bet they have no one. At that point, you have a basis for a referral out of network! Good luck. I've become quite determined, persistent, and devious at getting what I need out of insurance companies.