I am Fat and Worthless

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You didn't ask for help. You posted a statement that doesn't imply anything other than what it says, and if one replies to this how he/she sees it (taking things literally--it's something I do, and something I'll always do for I have this thing called autistic disorder that "makes" me do such), then that's not the fault of those who read your words, and then replies to them as they are written. We all have an opinion over statements for most of us can read them; not everyone can read emotion, or particularly cares for such (again, "ASD" forum).

Second part: at the time, yes.

Again, if one cannot see that I took your message literally, and it's blatantly obvious that I did; people seem to refuse this when I point it out?

That's a really good way of describing it! That's how I found therapy.

Aridarr, giving up isn't going to be a bad thing, you will give DIMN the satifation of your anger. That's why I'm pretending that he doesn't exist, so I don't lose it even more then I have.
I would try to let this go (or start PMing as Dracula suggested), and spend your energy on helping Grae, as she doesn't need anymore turmoil. (I know when I'm suicidal, anything is the last draw for me)

Even if she didn't ask for help, that isn't all that important. You should try to pick your battles, as you look hostile if you fight too often.

It's quite important if one expects a certain reply [and then becomes upset and resorts to personal attacks when they don't receive it]. There's no battle here [on my side], nor am I openly hostile; I'm "different", but that's a given considering where we are.

I am trying to learn to remain calm in the face of what I see in the mirror when I look, for a start and rationalise that hitting myself and breaking things will not change what I am seeing... but it is hard, given what I see makes me despise myself and view myself as a freak.

I ask other people about what I see, to see if it is normal.
If someone tells me that a part of my body looking like such and such happens to everyone, then it helps me get it into perspective, or I simply assume it is like that because I am deformed/ugly/fat etc, and although I do not take into account others' appearance much, my own seems to be paramount to my sense of worth and value.. I do not feel I have anything else I can be good at, if that makes sense.

I cannot achieve elsewhere, but I can achieve by controlling my body and trying to perfect that.

I think this is part of what has bought this on...my sense of being unable to do anything useful and good with my time when I do have it, so now I spend all my time on these obsessions so I do not have the opportunity to try and fail at anything else.

Well, it does sound like it. I'm now not trying to pick on you. Though I can't say that for before, and I am sorry for being so nasty. You just hurt me because I've been suicidal, and I understand what Grae's going through.
I think continuing this fight (even if you feel wronged) is really dumb, as it will only get worse.

Graelwyn,

I read all the posts and feel I have something to add.

Lets see, Aspergers, OCD, Anorexia, Bi-Polar, suicidal, low self-esteem, distorted body image -- you have a lot on your plate. You don't seek counceling or on meds.

Seems to me you need help - a good therapist and medication can help you get perspective.

And when you see this therapist you choose please discuss the rage issues. I see someone who is angry above all else. You are doing what I call imploding. Often the angry people who explode get a lot of attention. But when the anger is turned within ones self it is an implostion. Like a star that collapses in mass and yet weighs the same. (much like anorexia)

You are one of the most angry people I have seen in a long time and if I am right, then you can feel this in your soul. The implosion and the wieght of it. Aside from being angry at yourself for not 'being normal' I get the feeling that there is something else you are not saying and you need to talk to someone about this.

Acceptance, Forgiveness, and options are powerful tools you may wish to explore.

Addressing your original post - I am 60, 5'5" and 220 pounds --- believe I would trade in a heart beat. 33 is a great age to be, full of growth and maturity while still young enough to enjoy childlike adventures. The clothes, the shoes (girl it is all about the shoes) you will miss in 30 years. And when I was 27 I came close to blowing up my house and family with dyamite. but i didn't. and I was agoraphobic but I got past that too. On bad days I still struggle with failure, taking up space, depression and feeling worthless - life is a struggle. But I have also gained strenghth to face it as best I can.

There is a life out there for you - go do the work - go find it - enjoy.

Add panic disorder and social anxiety to that list and yes.

I do have a mass of anger. I last was this angry when I was a teen. tho I seem worse now actually.
I do not know the source. Either the sexual abuse I suffered as a child, which still seems to have me considering myself a slut, or recent issues in a relationship ( where an elaborate story was woven over a period of months on the net, convincing me someone was coming to stay with me for xmas etc)...admittedly, the latter situation did seem to act as a trigger.

And the anger at myself gets worse if I show any anger to someone else or wrong them.
A self hatred grows in me if I lash out at anyone else.

I try to ignore my issues as far as possible and blind myself to them... when they hit a respite, I pretend they do not exist.
I had a lot of therapy when younger...a teen and during my anorexic years, when I was very seriously anorexic. It changed nothing and I did not really discuss the abuse in detail or the feelings it has left me with. The hatred of myself seems to go so deep, and I seem to have little sense of who I am a lot of the time... I do not feel/see myself as being even a valid, living human being of any value.

I exist. Nothing more. The times I have felt of value have been when I helped other people. That is the only time.

I intend asking my doctor whether Sertraline will help me. I feel now that the OCD and the body image issues are much more damaging to me than the bipolar as they are triggering my moods.

I hate the idea of being a slave to medication. It makes me feel VERY weak. I feel I should be able to think my way out of this, using the spiritual knowledge I aquired in the past. Just the thought I might have to go into hospital or go on meds helped me stop the behaviours in the past, but it always comes back in one form or another.

My ex once joked I would be a psychiatrist's wet dream with the issues I have.

I also have issues with thinking people are looking down on my intelligence because of my issues, especially with those in the medical profession.

I want help, but I fear there being no help and that this is sort of my fate in life.

The only way you can get help from therapy is if you free yourself from the abuse. It WAS NOT your fault that you were sexually abused, and you have to figure that out for yourself.

Believe me, even though being on meds is hard, it is so freeing when you find the right dosage.

Graelwyn

I’m not a psychologist but I’ll share my opinion for what it’s worth.

It seems like you keep trying to come up with reasons to explain or justify hating yourself. Have you ever considered the possibility that deep down there isn’t really any reason for it? That your brain is just trying to come up with reasons for why you feel a certain way?

I tend to think the portion of our brain responsible for emotions is just like any other body organ. It can get injured by stress or psychological trauma just like any other part of our body can get damaged from physical trauma. An unhealthy brain naturally generates negative emotions and then comes up with thoughts to try and explain these negative emotions.

These negative thoughts aren’t problematic when they are about things that we have the ability and rationale to change. The problem is with counterproductive thoughts that don’t motivate us to change our circumstance in a realistic or positive way. Normally emotions heal over time but counterproductive thoughts become like salt on a wound and never allow our emotions to heal.

I’m not trying to imply that if you can realize these things you can easily “snap” out of it. I know it’s a lot harder than that and I don’t mean to trivialize your problems in any way.

I just find that it helps me sometimes to try and take a step back from the picture. To try and “scientifically” analyze what’s going on with my thoughts and emotions. This at least allows me to distance myself from my emotions and gives temporary relief when I need it.

marshall - I like your perspective. Graelwyn is such a good and caring person; sometimes we're all so hard ourselves. I wrote early in this thread perhaps she could pretend she's 'Sally' (yes, just made up that name), so she could not be so self-critical. I know that's hard...I struggle too. And, true, the mind plays tricks!

Graelwyn, I do hope you're at least getting enough electrolytes. Please try to eat - we don't want you to become weak and sick without nourishment. You're always pretty, take care of yourself

Hi Graelwyn,

Good to see you back, and being yourself again. Problems are those hidden things, the unexplored life is not worth living, well, your's is the most defined I have ever known.

I would sum it all up as Spring Cleaning, digging through everything so it can be put away.

Knowing yourself so well is why you are so useful here, you look beyond the surface, and answer questions people have never dared ask.

The short version is all those shrinks went into the business thinking they might figure out how to fix thier own heads, and only learned it was worse than they thought.

You know the truth, we are all a collection of issues, most best ignored.

If I think about it too much, I forget how to walk.

Come back and teach these loose balls of yarn how to tuck in the loose threads.

They do not need to know the truth about themselves, just some words to get them through another day, so they can discover some other problem.

You are great at it because you know, the Spiritual side can mask the view that reality sucks.

While you have been mucking about in self indulgence, another 10,000 have shown up with the same beginner problems.

No one else has your magical flair for this work.

I definitely identify with that. I don't have body image problem but I have a self defeating perfectionism in other ways.


I don't think this is necessarily a good thing or a least not at the stage you are at. It might work for somebody who has just has the odd doubt. You are in a tight cycle. If anything asking people is part of the cycle, it keeps you fixating on the same thing. You are not going to accept their views because like you say you are more influenced but how you think you appear. Also it might not be a sufficiently small enough chunk to deal with.

For the behavioural aspect of CBT (that is only concerned with how you behave not your thoughts) a start might be to note down what you do in your day like how many times you look in the mirror in the day and when, etc. So an achievable step might be to look one or two less times in the mirror during your day. I’m not saying this is what you’d do but somebody may someone may do it. It might not be an achievable step for you yet.

The cognitive aspect can use techniques to try and use rational arguments to discredit your thoughts and this help reinforce behavioural changes, although this is slightly misleading. This is not the only way; there are distraction techniques as well. One of the common misconceptions is that mental disorders are that they are entirely irrational. In fact they are not. Mental trauma needs an outlet, which is not irrational. People may act in odd way when they are under mental stress but that is to be expected, it is only ‘odd’ in a relative sense. What is important is your and other people’s safety and quality of life. Rational thought is not enough in itself, if anything you can be quite rationally negative. What is rational can be quite varied and debatable. Also it is conducive to the level that you are rationalising. You can make a rational argument about a particular phenomena based on your current level of knowledge, what resources you have, what evidence is available to you, etc. That means that somebody else might come to a different conclusion that you. What is fair to say is when you have this sort of problem you are fixated. In fact in some cases it might be a better solution to delude yourself, if you get too fixated on the ‘real’ idea of what people might think.

There was a study that linked slightly pie in the sky people with happiness and success and those with common anxieties as conversely more realistic at least in the short term. However these ‘realists’ are so fixated on their fears that they end up self fulfilling doom. The pie in the sky people end up achieving what they set out to do, even if they may not physically achieve it they are satisfied that they have achieved something. So in reality they are no less realistic in their aspirations that the anxious are about their fears.

A sense of achievement/self worth is not, in isolation, an irrational or rational thing. It is something you have to create for yourself. I call this delusion, others call it faith. I don’t think all delusions are necessarily bad or good. It is just that most people only notice what are considered abnormal delusions. But really everybody has them. Empathy is an example of a delusion. It has a practical application in some cases but it still needs the person to suspend disbelief that they can’t actually experience the world like somebody else.



Actually this a is pretty accurate description of how CBT and modern psychologist are starting to approach things. Not the fruedian BS. There are no reasons, just catalysts. Catalysts are not necessarily relevant once they have occurred, in fact in the majority of cases they are not. Also there is a huge consensus now that says that trying to peruse the 'source' or 'root' of problem can not only be a waste of time it can actually be more damaging in some cases.

I have cognitive problem. I think my anxiety may be substantially related to this. But in having this, my mind is unable to recall my early childhood or even much of last week, however with CBT it is not necessary to go back and in my case there was not option to go back anyway. Not that it would really tell me anything anyway, being a neurological condition most likely caused before birth. What matters is now. I have already pretty much abandoned most of my past. What I know is just a story. It might as well be someone else. I only care about the last 3 years when I have made significant achievements. The weird thing is I can use my cognitive problems to discard some anxieties even though it seems that that is where they are coming from. So what have now is instead of lots of concurrent flowing negative thoughts, such as with my social anxiety, it is more lots of random thoughts from my overactive and very disordered mind. Really random and disconnected, not necessarily negative in themselves but they are intrusive in terms of occupying my time and concentration. I ‘feel’ anxious, that is probably the one emotion that is consistent what with emotional blunting. I need to be able to figure out a way I can get rid of them and clear my mind. I’m hoping to be able to crack this. I have tried the most medically advanced interventions available for executive dysfunction, they have mostly not worked or made me worse. There is no cure or treatment for ED at the moment. I know I’m always going to have ED (that is a hard thing for me to admit), however I’m hoping to be able to try and reduce the effects of the anxiety that surround it.

Grael,
do you see how many people here care about you ??
Let the good in ....

Don't give up! Never give up!

have you thought about turning off your computer and getting actual help? it might do you some good, it seems silly to me to make these topics all the time only to torture yourself over and over again. maybe you need to be in some kindof residential recovery center or something for an extended period of time. i dunno, but if i was that messed up in the head i would seek outside help