People here on WP are making me feel horrible about myself
envirozentinel
Forum Moderator

Joined: 16 Sep 2012
Gender: Male
Posts: 17,118
Location: Keshron, Super-Zakhyria
You really don't have to listen to people who see even Teletubbies as gay or Noddy as racist because of the golliwogs. In fact, the weirdos who remove them from the stories are actually the racist ones if they see golliwogs as being "black" and want to exclude them for some strange idea of political correctness.
I believe most Aspies have a good imagination and see things as they really are.
My family (mom etc) think all witches and wizards are evil, but that's because they see them in the wrong context, unable to appreciate the fantasy world of Gandalf, Harry Potter or even a local programme that became a classic here "Liewe Heksie". (Dear little Witch). So my stepfather made the allegation that the author of Liewe Heksie was lesbian.
As a children's fantasy writer myself (my mom thinks I should rather write stuff modelled after the Famous Five) I appreciate the context of different universes where the rules for our particular dimension don't apply.
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my blog:
https://sentinel63.wordpress.com/
I note someone felt you'd brought this on yourself and gave a breakdown of a possible interpretation. I read it and thought, whilst possible it's nothing like my interpretation of the thread. I found you to be emotional about a situation which is heartbreaking and you reacted poorly to words that didn't feel right to me. I can't put my finger on it but I've come across it before. I don't know who's right in their writing style and who's wrong but I'm with you in saying it doesn't sit right with me. I'd have felt very upset when adifferentname waded in. You know yourself it was wrong to personal name call and apologised. We all make mistakes, especially when feeling provoked. There's where it all went a bit horrific to read. The tone and words felt harsh and relentless by that stage to me. Was there not mention that others would be laughing at you. It descended into very uncomfortable reading, two against one. As I said before I don't know who's right or wrong but I know what group of people I fall into here - save me a seat. I think the best you can do is tackle this as you have thus far and drop out of threads the minute you feel upset - it's not worth it. Next time it happens ask yourself "Walk round block or soul destroying session...hmm?
I am really new here, and I went over to PPR to browse around. It seemed to be full of people who were out to pick fights, often over trivial points, and not to listen to each other. Didn't seem to be a great place for a discussion.
Every time I post anywhere online, I am in terror of reading the replies, as I am afraid someone will snap my head off. Even though it's just pixels on a screen. Although it's a superior form of communication in some ways, so much context is stripped out when we're just typing to each other.
OTOH when there are no replies I sometimes feel it means that nobody cares. At least you got a reaction!
Basically, she's blunt and strong spoken, but doesn't usually break the rules, and hurting feelings isn't a bannable offense here, especially when it's done simply by arguing a position. Really, having read the thread, I'm with CC, you came off as condescending and insulting, implying that people who had opinions different than yours were stupid, lazy, sociopaths, etc, where as OOM is direct and abrasive but doesn't actually insult anyone. Perhaps you're not used to having your opinions strongly disputed? I've certainly seen that happen often over the years, particularly young people who haven't really engaged beyond their peer groups before and are surprised and dismayed to discover that what they'd regarded as self evident and obvious truths are viewed with a skeptical eye by others, and that those others might occasionally have a point.
If you do decide to give PPR another try (or News or L&D or AS Politics), I strongly suggest going in with what I call a charitable mind, i.e. one curious about why someone might think something and assuming that those beliefs are held in good faith, rather than assuming people with opposite beliefs are mustache twirling villains poking people with sticks because it amuses them. You'll likely get a better response that way.
_________________
Your boos mean nothing, I've seen what makes you cheer.
- Rick Sanchez
I used to have similar thoughts, but then I actually started communicating with the mods, and things started making a lot more sense. they're still short staffed and over-worked at the moment, so I'd cut them a bit of slack about things going unwhacked; it's particularly hard to sanction an over the line comment when you're not getting to it until hours or days after it was made. Try PMing a mod directly and engaging with them, I've found that developing a relationship of mutual trust is helpful for everyone; they get an extra pair of eyes (eyes that have been around a while and can spot trouble early in this case), and I get better responses to when I do have a problem since my judgment has been demonstrated.
_________________
Your boos mean nothing, I've seen what makes you cheer.
- Rick Sanchez
I myself are kinda on OOM s*** List. She actually took rather well my statement that Celebrating the Confederacy
is like celebrating the 1942 Philadelphia Phillies who were 42-109. But she went ballistic on me when I called Paula Deen a stupid bigot. I guess as a fellow cook Paula must've struck a nerve with OOM. I've seen her very kind with other WP members though, particularly when it comes to talking food and recepies. Maybe you can talk to Alex and the mods about getting an ignore button if you find certain posters that threatening.
So, yeah. I'm going to keep posting on WP, though probably not as much as I was before. I feel the same way as BirdinFlight does, in terms of thinking that this board would be a safe haven from the meanness of the real world, and then realizing it's anything but that. I hate that there are so many genuinely cruel Aspies in the world. I mean, all of the nice Aspies (especially all of you who took the time to reply to this post and offer me kindness and compassion) kind of make up for the cruel ones, but it still hurts to know that there are Aspies who know just how difficult it is to have this disorder, yet who still think it's okay to make others feel like s**t.
Oh, and I'm sorry to hear that others have been hurt by OOM. It makes me wonder why she hasn't been banned yet. Why is she allowed to hurt people as much as she wants, without having to face any sort of repercussions for that?
from what i read, you were just as hard on OOM as she was on you.
I just also wanted to add that I've seen this before, this assumption that because we're all aspies we're somehow all going to think alike or somehow understand each other better, and between my years on here and running an AS meetup in Seattle, I can say with some certainty that that's not how it works. If anything, we're worse at understanding each other than NTs are at understanding us, as the tendency towards black and white thinking in particular colors a lot of discussions and makes disagreements even more contentious than they may normally be, and we're just as annoyed at the sometimes idiosyncratic or inexplicable behaviors and fixations as anyone else. I'm just as bored by the guy at my meetup talking my ear off about bus schedules as anyone who doesn't share that interest would be, just as he would if I were explaining the difference between gas and recoil operation in great detail, and the fact that we might "understand" a little better doesn't make us any less uninterested. I kinda feel like a dream killer sometimes because I've had a lot of IRL experience with other aspies and often have to burst bubbles, but after 7+ years and hundreds if not thousands of aspies, it's hard to deny.
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Your boos mean nothing, I've seen what makes you cheer.
- Rick Sanchez
BirdInFlight
Veteran

Joined: 8 Jun 2013
Age: 63
Gender: Female
Posts: 4,501
Location: If not here, then where?
Just my own personal take, and speaking for myself as just one person, I don't think I ever assumed that just because we're all aspies here we will all think alike or understand each other better, or even tolerate better each other's idiosyncrasies that drive NTs crazy too. I'm the first to bear in mind that very useful saying: "If you've met one aspie, you've met one aspie."
But what I expected of WP is just that maybe people here, having been giving a rough time by NTs in the real world, in many cases, might try to at least be kinder or hold back the venom around here. I can't say I have always managed to do that either, but usually only in proportionate response to someone sticking the knife in me first, if you'll excuse the mixed metaphor. But my point is, I kinda thought this was a place where the knives were left outside, and it's a disappointment that it's totally not.
Though there is a difference in how the metaphorical knives are used by different people. So while everyone has a knife, they are hidden and people use them differently.
Some people have not once touched their knife. At this point you're not sure they even have a knife because they have never used it.
Others may use it only in self defence.
But unfortunately there are some people who, if you do anything to bother them, get out their knife and point it at you. If you get scared and use your knife they'll put their knife away and act innocent.
And then we have the very rare instance where someone goes around stabbing everyone for no reason but for their enjoyment until they get arrested (banned).
But despite the last two existing, most people here do mean well. Outside PPR and autism politics anyway at least. They may talk in a way that makes you think they'll get out their knife and stab you any second but in reality they never have used it and they're just coming off as harsh.
Inside the PPR subforum knives seem to play a different role. If someone stabs someone, they won't respect the person they stabbed if they don't stab them back. They'll think they're seen as weak. Think of it as... a gladiator, I guess. They fight to the death, i.e. when an argument is won.
It's just a huge contrast is what I'm getting at.
Sorry if you can't follow, the knives metaphor here is for fighting online if that makes sense.
I don't know if I say that to more aspies or to more NTs, honestly, as both groups seem very susceptible to making broad assumption about autistics, especially isolated autistics just realizing that there are others "like them" out there and picturing a community that finally understands and enjoys them. Like I said, I hate to burst bubbles, but reality can be a rude shock to someone with that mindset.
Eh, I think we're more like NTs than many would like to admit; Mr Spock we most certainly are not.
_________________
Your boos mean nothing, I've seen what makes you cheer.
- Rick Sanchez
envirozentinel
Forum Moderator

Joined: 16 Sep 2012
Gender: Male
Posts: 17,118
Location: Keshron, Super-Zakhyria
We're all different. For instance, unlike Dox I have no interest in guns. We all have our particular interests and we also want people to see our viewpoint, because it can indeed be lonely if you can't find anyone to share your interests and ideas with.
However, as folk on the spectrum we have something in common at least.
I urge folk to send me or one of the other mods a PM on any issue that needs to be resolved because it's impossible to view every thread on every forum,as we all have things to do outside WP. However, we do what we can.
Freedom of expression is very important. Evelyn Beatrice Hall (biographer of Voltaire) expressed it well when she stated "I disagree with what you say, but will defend to the death your right to say it."
However, when people abuse that freedom and hurt others in the process, then it is a problem. So there is a fine line. Most of us are quite thin skinned and take things personally. I tend to have a brief meltdown / throwing session then calm down very quickly.
I for one want everyone to feel welcome here and not feel they are just a username with a number issued by the military...
_________________
Why is a trailer behind a car but ahead of a movie?
my blog:
https://sentinel63.wordpress.com/
Basically, she's blunt and strong spoken, but doesn't usually break the rules, and hurting feelings isn't a bannable offense here, especially when it's done simply by arguing a position. Really, having read the thread, I'm with CC, you came off as condescending and insulting, implying that people who had opinions different than yours were stupid, lazy, sociopaths, etc, where as OOM is direct and abrasive but doesn't actually insult anyone. Perhaps you're not used to having your opinions strongly disputed? I've certainly seen that happen often over the years, particularly young people who haven't really engaged beyond their peer groups before and are surprised and dismayed to discover that what they'd regarded as self evident and obvious truths are viewed with a skeptical eye by others, and that those others might occasionally have a point.
If you do decide to give PPR another try (or News or L&D or AS Politics), I strongly suggest going in with what I call a charitable mind, i.e. one curious about why someone might think something and assuming that those beliefs are held in good faith, rather than assuming people with opposite beliefs are mustache twirling villains poking people with sticks because it amuses them. You'll likely get a better response that way.
Really? You don't think that OOM insulted me at all?
Here's a list of everything she said to me that I found insulting. Please let me know how any of this can possibly be considered to be anything other than an insult.
--She called me "an immature bandwagon jumping nonthinking rhetoric spewer"
--She said that I should "go on ahead with [my] knee jerk assumptions, people who can't think for themselves usually go with that. Emphasis on the jerk part inferred." (This both implies that I can't think for myself, and that I'm a jerk.)
--She said that she "assumed [she was] talking to someone with common sense."
--She said that I was "vaguely entertaining to some people on here." (This implies that I'm nothing more than a cheap source of entertainment, rather than an actual human being with feelings.)
So explain to me how none of that was meant to be insulting at all.
Also, hurting feelings should be a bannable (or at least warnable) offense. These forums should be a place where us Aspies can get away from the hurtfulness of the real world. The fact that you seem to think otherwise disturbs me a bit. Why do you seem to think there's nothing wrong with hurting another Aspie's feelings?
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"Nobody realizes that some people expend tremendous energy merely to be normal." - Albert Camus
is like celebrating the 1942 Philadelphia Phillies who were 42-109. But she went ballistic on me when I called Paula Deen a stupid bigot. I guess as a fellow cook Paula must've struck a nerve with OOM. I've seen her very kind with other WP members though, particularly when it comes to talking food and recepies. Maybe you can talk to Alex and the mods about getting an ignore button if you find certain posters that threatening.
You know, I really wish there were ignore buttons on here. Don't know if I'd be brave enough to talk to Alex and the Mods about that, though.
_________________
"Nobody realizes that some people expend tremendous energy merely to be normal." - Albert Camus
So, yeah. I'm going to keep posting on WP, though probably not as much as I was before. I feel the same way as BirdinFlight does, in terms of thinking that this board would be a safe haven from the meanness of the real world, and then realizing it's anything but that. I hate that there are so many genuinely cruel Aspies in the world. I mean, all of the nice Aspies (especially all of you who took the time to reply to this post and offer me kindness and compassion) kind of make up for the cruel ones, but it still hurts to know that there are Aspies who know just how difficult it is to have this disorder, yet who still think it's okay to make others feel like s**t.
Oh, and I'm sorry to hear that others have been hurt by OOM. It makes me wonder why she hasn't been banned yet. Why is she allowed to hurt people as much as she wants, without having to face any sort of repercussions for that?
from what i read, you were just as hard on OOM as she was on you.
Yes, but I apologized sincerely to her. She has yet to apologize to me.
_________________
"Nobody realizes that some people expend tremendous energy merely to be normal." - Albert Camus
So just because it's hard for us to get along, that somehow means that we shouldn't even try to be kind to each other?
_________________
"Nobody realizes that some people expend tremendous energy merely to be normal." - Albert Camus
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