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Why am I being told I'm NT?

Edit:

Removed the rest.

Do you have AS or not? You say you are undiagnosed but you have it. Go and get an official dx to quell people.

Two doctors reckon yes.

Going to the quality psych next week..

Though it is guaranteed that it is a PDD.

I've been to many psychs and doctors and all of them agreed it was a developmental disorder that can not be cured, only dealt with.

So if they don't diagnose it as Aspergers it will definately be PDDNOS.

So let us say I'm 90% sure, but will have the official diagnosis soon.

I don't know!

I presume you're being told you're NT because your beliefs don't agree with the beliefs of those accusing you.

They think, "if you really had AS, then you wouldn't think like that. You'd think like me!" It's a preposterous idea. There's already so many differing opinions on this forum about so many possible topics, that it's impossible for any two people here, or anywhere for that matter, to have the 100% exact same opinions. And even if only 5% of the opinions match, doesn't make you any less of a person.

Not all NTs are the same, and not all AS people are the same either. A lot of people on this forum like to emphasize the differences between NTs and ASs, but with all due respect to everybody, that focus on differences needs to be balanced with some conversation about how NTs and ASs are alike, otherwise we really are not making a fair or realistic evaluation of having AS in this world.

Scintillate, although this is a forum for AS people, please remember that in the end you don't really need to "prove" your Aspieness to anybody else. I am not even so sure that it's necessary to "prove" it to yourself. But I've read many of your other posts, and so I know that you already know very well, that what's important is to be happy with what you yourself are. It's your own life you need to deal with, after all. And consider that those AS people who judge against you so unreasonably, who try to act "logically" without even considering all pieces of the evidence (or even with a twisted sense of logic), how are they acting any different from the NTs they so despise? So don't let stupid stuff like this keep you down. Rock on!

thankyou..

I can give you my response, I warn you in advance, it's an emotional response that doesn't make sense, but people's thinking is driven more by emotion than most of us recognize. I haven't seen any indication that you've ever been out to offend or belittle anybody else, so I think this is especially unfortunate.

My case may be unusually severe. I've spent my whole life watching other people breeze through social interactions while I find it utterly impossible no matter where I go, who I'm around, or what I say or do. Some people are better at it than others, but nobody is worse than me. This gets painful, with a pain that doesn't go away or diminish with years, and that kind of pain affects my thinking, making me less able to understand my world accurately.

This doesn't matter, since there's nobody in the world who cares what I think about any subject anyway.

So I personally find it painful to hear about your friends and girlfriends, even though I am absolutely sure this was a million miles from anything you intended.

I'm less and less sure what asperger's is, although I know I have a very severe case of it, and it seems that other people with the condition manage to figure out how to function in human society much better than I have. This doesn't make them phony. Some people can draw, I've never been able to.

This is especially unfortunate, because I realize you've got problems you're trying to deal with in your own life, and I'd be a fool to say my problems are worse than yours. Also, I can't very well say that you shouldn't feel free to talk straight out about the things that are going on in your own life. What would be the purpose of posting if you had to carefully filter everything you said out of fear that it might offend somebody over things you had nothing to do with?

All I've seen you doing is trying to work out how to make your own life better and help other people to do the same, but I sometimes get offended. Like I said, it makes no sense.

You're right, but if we can calmly state what specifically offends each other, we can easily learn.

I understand because reading certain others traumas upsets me, but personally I like to face such issues in this manner because its all a learning experience.



"Some people can draw, I've never been able to. "

A perfect illustration of your point, I can't draw myself, but I feel I have my own style of guitar that is totally original.

I'm going to try respect others a lot more in future, though sometimes in sharing honestly I forget that others in a lonely situation might find it hard to see someone with a partner.

If it makes anyone lonely feel better, I don't have any friends, and its a constant battle to prove to her that I actually feel, its a constant battle to prove I'm real, but I'm LUCKY to even have someone close I know that.

Thanks for your honesty.

Scintillate, I was the one who called you on it. The reason is simple, as I stated before. You've claimed to have had not 1 or 2 hard found relationships, but rather 7 relationships and 2 kids. No I am not stereotyping, the main defining characteristic of autism is lack of social skills (according to the NT way of socialising). These social skills are needed in order to attract a mate (unless your female).
So, to say this is stereotyping is like saying that, if a man called another man a liar for claiming to be blind when the man in question is watching the clouds and calling the shapes, then the man accusing him would be stereotyping by saying that blind people can't see?
And a diagnosis doesn't mean anything. Counselors throw labels around bilegerantly now. Much like they did with AD(H)D and bipolar. And, about 90% of the people who claimed to have it, many of whom even had an official diagnosis, didn't really have it at all. The counselors and pharmecuetical companies throw labels around to make money.
Yes, AS men can find love, but it takes many years of studying NT social rituals. It's not something you can do overnight. And even then, finding the 1st woman within the span of your lifetime are hard enough odds to beat, let alone going out and finding 6 more.
I am happy that you are taking interest in autistic culture and what not, and perhaps you even share a few characteristics with aspies. Maybe you've got some other sort of mental condition. But your not aspie. Perhaps your ADD or something?

Someone (who also couldn't have been aspie) said something eluding to the fact that they thought the reason many aspie men couldn't find a mate was in our looks.... And, I look pretty damn attractive (albiet alittle skinny). Here is a link to my pic:

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fu ... d=15767190

I never said I've had kids.


ADD has been ruled out.

So a diagnosis doesn't mean anything, but you deciding that having many relationships does?

I didn't do it overnight, I've studied it for many years.

"alluding" is the word. Maybe you have ADD? You couldn't remember who they were either?

Don't you see, finding relationships might not be a problem? It might be maintaining them? Someone might be a successful con artist without actually realising they are upto a certain point?

I personally thought everyone was lieing, so used to have no difficulty creating an image to attract women.

"No I am not stereotyping, the main defining characteristic of autism is lack of social skills (according to the NT way of socialising). These social skills are needed in order to attract a mate (unless your female). "

Fraid not, social skills are not required to find a mate, they are required to relate in the way most people do, the first night I met my current partner (and any other) I shared my only love with her, music, this inspired her so greatly that she decided to pursue it further, so we had sex.

It took a year of fighting for her to understand me, constantly breaking up and coming back together.

I'm not a fool, I'm not a liar, I'm not deluding myself.

You've shown about 4 points of ignorance in your post, which makes me feel you are quite possibly ADD yourself.

"It's not something you can do overnight. And even then, finding the 1st woman within the span of your lifetime are hard enough odds to beat, let alone going out and finding 6 more.
"

Did I say it was easy? Women approached me, therefore I went out with them.. Its that simple.

I'm sorry, but every single woman that was attracted to me, had serious problems, because each one realised I was different, but didn't know why.

"So, to say this is stereotyping is like saying that, if a man called another man a liar for claiming to be blind when the man in question is watching the clouds and calling the shapes, then the man accusing him would be stereotyping by saying that blind people can't see?
"

I've had relationships, you know none of the details, you know none of the hows and whys.

I can guarantee you that other aspies have found more than 1 relationship, in fact I bet you that some aspies found it relatively easy to do the attracting part, because logically its very simple.

Maybe I just realised when I was a kid that something was wrong with me? Maybe as a result I ended up with this "no rules" image that attracted certain self-destructive types?

The point is that the frequency of relationships is in no way a measure to judge social skills.

I know for a fact I don't even understand what happens in a group of people, I'm always left out, I know I managed to create an image I'd based on what I thought was normal, I just happened to be particularly good at it.

Autism is a different way of thinking, it doesn't mean you're destined to be alone, it doesn't mean you have no chance of attracting others.

Whoa, I find this very shocking that someone can be de-ASed on an internet board. You have to take people at face value. If scint. has had a lot of relationships, maybe it's because he can't maintain one (lack of social skills). There are things about my life that make me look NT: I am married and I have children. I manage to stay relatively predictable and non-melted-down for their sake. However I do agree with snake that if I were a guy, I doubt I'd be married or have children. I'd probably be single and living with my parents, or on gov't assistance of some kind.

And don't forget that people appear very different in writing than thyey are IRL. What attracts people to one another is mysterious. I think people with AS can attract people. If they can't there are other factors, like chronic unemployment, poor hygiene, a negative attitude towards life, seeming unfriendly, the list could go on forever.

Some men with AS are very funny and charming (look at werbert, who is dx'ed and has a killer sense of humor). But not everyone with AS is the same, each person has a unique personality beneath syndrome. Some are grim and mean, some are very loving and intuitive, etc..

Maybe scint. exudes some kind of caring sense IRL and that is why messed up women are attracted to him. I don't know.

So you're effectively saying, that every single woman on this planet, is looking for a socialite male?

You're saying the ONLY way to attract a partner is to be socially adequate?

You don't realise with enough brains you can actually teach yourself how to act the way those around you do?

I am totally socially ret*d, no offence meant by the word, but I know it as a fact, yet I decided when I was 15, that I wasn't going to let that get in the way of my quest to find a partner.

I just happened to get lucky back then, a certain girl loved the way she terrified me, she loved the way I could only handle being alone with her, she loved the way I either talked too much about certain topics or too little.

I have no problem with focus by the way..

There are many ways that social inadequacy can reflect in a persons development, you seriously think that inability to get past stage one defines aspergers?

I don't have friends, I don't make friends, in fact only recently did I work out the difference between friends and aquaintances.

I pick a person, I pursue them with all my might, I show them my passion for music and for the mysterys in life, and it worked for me.

By the way, your obsession with rebellion is causing some irrationality amongst your thoughts.

You don't think diagnosis is accurate, yet at the same time you believe in a condition known as aspergers, and you believe you have it because you can't get a mate?

I'm quite sure that aspect doesn't even exist in the definition.

Why don't you stop telling people they're not aspie and have a good look at yourself?

So far I've met around 5 people from WP that I happened to connect with in ways I never have anywhere else, I could tell with each of them we were on the same wavelength, something I've NEVER had with human beings anywhere.

All that comes out in your posts is some isolationist plea to be singled out..

Yep, I feel for you, I truly do, you can't find a partner, that doesn't mean those that spend effort in younger years working it out are not what they say they are.

I was obsessed with people from the age of 12-16, I worked out how to portray an image of "I don't care" because I didn't understand what was going on, it happened to guarantee me zero friends, but at the same time it drew the interest of certain women.

You really think you can determine aspergers this way?

EDIT:

Where I live AS is barely known.

In fact the reason I've accepted the label is because I fit every single diagnostic criteria.

Which is the reason for the label in the first place!

I never saw this:

"additional: you must be celibate or nearly celibate in order to have this condition, you must never achieve sexual relationships or partnerships"

Assumption is the mind killer.

pull your head out?

To everybody:

In the end, AS is a label. Once you're diagnosed with it, the mere occurrence of diagnosis does not change who you are. You're still the same person afterwards that you were before. So whether a psychiatrist in the end diagnoses you, does not change you or the life experiences you've had up to that point. Even the fingerpointing to say "you're not an Aspie" should not dismiss your own life and your feelings towards your life as illegitimate.

To snake321:

You really aren't in a position to judge anybody on this forum as "not having AS." What people say and describe online are just snapshots of their whole lives. We don't really know all the details of the situations that the other person comes across, and in addition, we aren't examining the other person for any extended amount of time. Imagine a psychiatrist trying to diagnose a person with AS without ever meeting the person, or even talking to the person by voice. Moreover, just because somebody has AS, does not mean that the person cannot learn social behaviors. It does not mean that AS symptoms will stay the same throughout life, either. For that reason, AS is known as a developmental disorder. To top it all off, there are so many things in this world that will color one's behavior, including self-esteem, education and work experience, culture, age, that it's quite difficult, if not impossible, to say that the outcome of people with AS will always be the same. Yeah, AS is something that one is born with, but that does not mean that any of us with AS has to be a slave to it. There are a lot of good things about AS, along with the bad things, so we can do our best by magnifying the good things, and controlling the bad things... but such actions are best done by everybody, NT and AS, right?

To Scintillate:

Try not to let snake321's comments bother you. It's not uncommon for people with AS to get on their soapbox and judge others, and decry the judgments made of them by other people. It sounds bad, but I know that I've been guilty of doing this tons of times, and always hated seeing this same trait in other people (fighting with my AS friend comes to mind). However, one significant attribute of people with AS is their difficulty with introspection, and you can tell which AS people still need work with this skill: those people who think they're almost never wrong. You seem to be a fairly introspective person, since you admit that you've made mistakes. So don't worry about other people who might be suggesting that you don't really understand yourself. Maybe you don't understand yourself, but after all, oneself is the most difficult person to understand, no?

Thankyou for the post, gave me quite a few thoughts..Honestly your post cut right to the point of the matter, both sides of the equation.

I'm sorry if I offended you snake.

You're right stinkypuppy, I've had serious problems with understanding myself.. In fact for many years I told myself everyone else was the problem and I was simply too smart for them to get me (hah how ridiculous! )

However I've learnt that sharing opinions, and reflecting with others facing similar problems, can lead to the insights I can't manage to find alone.

Its obvious to me now that if I FACE my problems, I can use my over-analytical nature to work myself out.

I don't know exactly who I am defined in a box, and if I did I wouldn't be in motion.

Oneself is definately the most difficult to understand, you're right...

I'm of the strong belief that the more viewpoints I can understand, the better I can work out my own.