How to Get Family to Stop Normalizing Me?

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thewrite1
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29 Nov 2015, 11:36 am

Recently, I've been having issues where family members try to force me to wear makeup (despite complaints about discomfort and the fact that makeup f*****g SMEARS EVERYWHERE, which may or may not trigger my OCD) and have expressed a desire for me to quit video games (because I need 'adult' interests--what are adult interests?) and I am not comfortable with that at all. It feels like they want me to throw away my personality and interests to conform to a boring norm where you just work all the time. How do I get them to back down?


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Fnord
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29 Nov 2015, 12:05 pm

Are you old enough to move out and get a place of your own?


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thewrite1
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29 Nov 2015, 12:16 pm

Old enough, in theory, yes. Financially capable of doing so? No, especially not with my 30K in loans thanks to college (I graduate this December).


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Fnord
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29 Nov 2015, 12:54 pm

Do you have a job lined up yet? Once you start pulling down an income, they might have more respect for you.


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thewrite1
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29 Nov 2015, 1:33 pm

Still searching. I applied to one job, but got rejected, and most jobs require '1+ years of experience', which I don't have because I've been in university and don't have a driver's license or car.


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Fnord
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29 Nov 2015, 4:45 pm

You applied to only one job? Did you expect a hundred job offers from just one application?

You should have a hundred applications out there by now! Play it as a spammer or telemarketer would: saturate your area with applications to increase the odds that just one place will hire you.

THAT is how it's done!


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NoGyroApproach
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29 Nov 2015, 5:48 pm

Hi
I will be blunt but truthful. Reading this thread so far, I am guessing that BECAUSE you will be graduating in December (next month) and HAVE a big loan to payoff and DO NOT have a job lined up, your parents are trying to get you to put video games aside and make getting a job #1. They probably want you to wear some make-up to enhance your chance of getting a job. YES it is time for you to GROW UP and move out. This is what they are moving your towards. I mean this as nicely as possible. Best of luck.


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wilburforce
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29 Nov 2015, 6:08 pm

NoGyroApproach wrote:
Hi
I will be blunt but truthful. Reading this thread so far, I am guessing that BECAUSE you will be graduating in December (next month) and HAVE a big loan to payoff and DO NOT have a job lined up, your parents are trying to get you to put video games aside and make getting a job #1. They probably want you to wear some make-up to enhance your chance of getting a job. YES it is time for you to GROW UP and move out. This is what they are moving your towards. I mean this as nicely as possible. Best of luck.


What does wearing makeup have to do with getting a job? If someone will only consider hiring you if you wear makeup, they are not worth working for. That's some BS.



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29 Nov 2015, 8:56 pm

Depends on the job, really, and the social standards. Make-up has been a sign of well-groomedness, of taking care of one's appearance. Even when make-up is obviously hastily applied as a way to mask your eyebags from the night before, it's more about the act of putting on any make up, of making that concession to society. It's, figuratively, like writing 'I'm clean and healthy' on your forehead with a sharpie.
Not putting on make-up is, regardless of what you look like, a shorthand sign for 'I'm not taking care of myself'.
It's a communication-tool, a sign, the result itself is of no true importance.
I learned these things from having had different girlfriends in different countries/cultures, the make-up habits of some I did not find attractive. So we talked about them. One would wear red lipstick 'as a weapon'.

If you feel uncomfortable with a lot of make-up, rest asdured there's some simple tricks that work well enough. A peeling of Bicarbonate of soda &water cleans your skin, but makes it very dry. A few drops of water and olive oil or rose oil or so moisten it again and don't smell like horrible face cream. (Oh god, the stench these products have!! !)
One expensive organic bottle lasts forever.

Then, do your eyes. You don't necessarily have to wear lipstick, but people will notice if your eyelashes arent mascara-ed. Unless you have very dark eyelashes anyway.

That's all you actually need to look healthy and made-up, without having to put on all this sticky and smelly stuff. (Again, I had girlfriends explain to me why they would or wouldn't apply certain things, even if the texture and smell freaked me out.)


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thewrite1
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29 Nov 2015, 10:17 pm

Fnord wrote:
You applied to only one job? Did you expect a hundred job offers from just one application?

You should have a hundred applications out there by now! Play it as a spammer or telemarketer would: saturate your area with applications to increase the odds that just one place will hire you.

THAT is how it's done!


I only applied to one, but this was after a few weeks of searching multiple sources--university's career job listings, linked in, company/organization websites, etc. But either they had no entry level positions open or the entry level positions required years of experience, which I lack. As for spamming, I've been told this is a bad move, which is why I haven't done it.


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29 Nov 2015, 11:23 pm

Does your field *require* serious makeup or can you get away with as slight amount as possible? And the follow up, is it a field you chose or your parents (via pressure)?


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izzeme
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30 Nov 2015, 8:11 am

thewrite1 wrote:
Fnord wrote:
You applied to only one job? Did you expect a hundred job offers from just one application?

You should have a hundred applications out there by now! Play it as a spammer or telemarketer would: saturate your area with applications to increase the odds that just one place will hire you.

THAT is how it's done!


I only applied to one, but this was after a few weeks of searching multiple sources--university's career job listings, linked in, company/organization websites, etc. But either they had no entry level positions open or the entry level positions required years of experience, which I lack. As for spamming, I've been told this is a bad move, which is why I haven't done it.


*Everything* asks for years of experience, which noone has.
Ignore that requirement, tell the recruiter that you can still do the job regardless.

Honestly, recruiters know that they won't find the 'fresh-out-of-college' starter complete with several years of experience: they want to know if you got the (figurative) balls to apply anyway.

The makeup thing is irrelevant as long as you aren't regularly seen by clients (example: a register worker has makeup issues, someone in the finance department does not).



thewrite1
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30 Nov 2015, 11:41 am

Edenthiel wrote:
Does your field *require* serious makeup or can you get away with as slight amount as possible? And the follow up, is it a field you chose or your parents (via pressure)?


It's the public health field, so I'm not too sure. I chose this field on my own after leaving a field my family preferred (they took it a lot better than I thought they would, tbh).



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30 Nov 2015, 12:37 pm

thewrite1 wrote:
Edenthiel wrote:
Does your field *require* serious makeup or can you get away with as slight amount as possible? And the follow up, is it a field you chose or your parents (via pressure)?


It's the public health field, so I'm not too sure. I chose this field on my own after leaving a field my family preferred (they took it a lot better than I thought they would, tbh).


Not sure why you'd need make up in the public health field...don't see why you couldn't just practice good facial hygiene. And some people may not like this but I think its plain old sexism to hold females to wearing make up...I would not want a job at a place that practices enforcement of gender roles. But I imagine when I get to working its going to be more mundane labor of some sort or maybe data entry I can't imagine the employers care about make up for that.

Also I think most people think smeared up or make that has been applied wrong looks trashy...which is probably seen as worse then simply not having any on.


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30 Nov 2015, 2:09 pm

A few semi-random thoughts:

Good for you, for choosing your own field! I was expected to go into law & went as far as acing the LSAT before I found whatever was needed inside to say, "No. This isn't me & I'm not doing it". And by that point, I was done with college & ended up drifting back toward I.T.. That you have already taken that step of independence is wonderful & you should be proud of yourself for it!

The average American gamer is 31 years old and 48% are female; it is seen as a legitimate form of recreation. Entrepreneur Limor Fried boasts that she is on level 765 of Candy Crush and has never paid for a level. She was named 'Entrepreneur of the Year' by Entrepreneur in 2012 and was the first female engineer featured on the cover of Wired. In 2014, Inc. 5000 ranked her company Adafruit number 11 in the top 20 USA manufacturing companies and number one in New York City. Gaming is also a substantial industry, btw.

It is possible to use minimal makeup and maybe not trigger anything. Stick to powder for your foundation, gloss for your lips (wears off quickly, just don't reapply if you aren't around them) & minimal, light shadow so you don't have to balance it out with liner or mascara (which can feel like clay or glue, right?). *If* you feel it will help and isn't giving in too much, that may be enough of a compromise & enough of a show to them that you are making an effort that they'll leave that aspect alone. It comes down to whether it's worth the fight *at the moment* to go totally makeup free in an environment & culture that is often sexist.


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Edenthiel
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30 Nov 2015, 2:31 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
thewrite1 wrote:
Edenthiel wrote:
Does your field *require* serious makeup or can you get away with as slight amount as possible? And the follow up, is it a field you chose or your parents (via pressure)?


It's the public health field, so I'm not too sure. I chose this field on my own after leaving a field my family preferred (they took it a lot better than I thought they would, tbh).


Not sure why you'd need make up in the public health field...don't see why you couldn't just practice good facial hygiene. And some people may not like this but I think its plain old sexism to hold females to wearing make up...I would not want a job at a place that practices enforcement of gender roles. But I imagine when I get to working its going to be more mundane labor of some sort or maybe data entry I can't imagine the employers care about make up for that.

Also I think most people think smeared up or make that has been applied wrong looks trashy...which is probably seen as worse then simply not having any on.


All so very true, especially the observations about sexism. Sadly, we do live in a sexist society and depending on the specific job title & company sometimes it is still necessary to wear it...for the interview. ;-)

Once they hire someone (& assuming a good fit & a good worker bee), it's far more solidly covered by the law that they cannot expect it of an employee. And as you said, ideally no one would want to work somewhere where supervisors would expect it. But HR people tend to have a big influence on who moves through the process and I've noticed they tend to be fashion conscious & social as a very grossly general rule. At a larger employer they can be a gatekeeper to get past & I've found not always indicative of the actual corporate culture.


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