Is cynicism bad?

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Today I moved desks at work. This other guy wanted to swap with me and I thought it would be nice sitting next to new people. Not that these new people are strangers to me. I already know all of them but I just felt like I needed a change of company.

The desks are in pods of six. Before I sat with some bland guys, one guy who's hyperactive and next to a guy with depression. Not that I blame him for having depression. In some ways I related to this. In some ways with had similar views.

So I moved into a different pod of desks. They're generally happy and good natured there. One guy in particular seems to be very happy. As I said I knew them all before. This is a guy who's never said an unkind word about anyone. He's always happy and cheerful and energetic and after sitting next to him it started to get a bit sickening. For example, we got into a conversation about who's the richest. He said he's the richest because he's rich with love for his wife. Gaaaag!

I started to think sitting next to the depressed guy wasn't so bad. He used to say things like happy couples deserve to be hung just because he's not in one. This guy I'm next to now doesn't ever seem to have any negative emotions for any reason. Is that a bad thing?

Either he's bundling up he's negative emotions into a tight hot ball and then denying their existence, which is very unhealthy or he doesn't actually experience anything like anger or sadness or self-doubt, which is odd.

Honestly I think I'd go insane without saying something extremely cynical every few minutes. e.g. I could say money is more important than love. I know it's not true but it feels damned good to say it. People would now I was joking, wouldn't they?

Maybe not. I remember the time I like funerals more than weddings it made the girl I'm sitting across from gasp in shock? Didn't she know I was joking?

It's not only a joke. It's a cathartic release. I revel in negativity about the world and myself in particular. Sure we may live in a wonderful world filled with love and beauty but if I acknowledge that I feel it sets everyone above me and pushes me down. I work with some very smart, very talented, very hard working people. But if I acknowledge the truth that most of them are smarter, more talented and more hard working then me, I'd feel awful.

I like to paint a grim picture but I don't insult any of them. To call them stupid or talentless or lazy would be totally absurd so instead I give them comically exaggerated praise. This sets the bar for them so high they can't clear it. They seem to succeed in everything but my exagerated praise sets an impossible standard for them and they are sure to fail in matching it.

Am I mad? Petty? Irrational? Probably.

It starts with comparing myself to everyone and I always come up short. Then I have a hard time dealing with it. It's hard being less intelligent and less accomplished than most other people. It's hard when you're the only one in the office without a degree and half the guys there are younger than you. It's hard when you're in debt and the 23 year olds are buying their first homes. It's hard when you haven't had a relationship lasting more than a few months. I used to wake up every morning and after a few seconds of groggy delirium I'd remember who I am and think "Oh no! I'm me! If only I was someone else!"

I set an exagerated standard for them yet I fear they may actually reach it. They achieve all manner of things so this caricature of their flawless virtue doesn't seem too far from the mark.

I know our culture says to be positive yet it seems unhealthy to me. Remember this is the same culture that says always try harder, even if you're already trying ridiculously hard. This is the culture that encourages people to work overtime. This is the culture that makes it look like being a fawning sycophant is a virtue. This is the culture that expects you to do unpleasant things and then pretend you enjoyed it. The culture that expects you to act like you come in to work purely for the love of the job. The culture that fails people in job interviews if they say they want the job for the paycheque. Newsflash! That's the real reason everyone has a job. I don't mind working but pretending I enjoy it like it's my hobby seems like a silly idea.

So should I listen to our culture when it says cynicism is bad? The same culture that seems to think in absolutes and catchphrases. The same culture that says "work harder" rather than "work harder IF you're not working hard enough". I believe in attaining balance in all things but our culture is more like "Everything or nothing". Sometimes I wonder if they're right. If working overtime is a virtue and I'm just being lazy.

My cousin in-law said I was like a supervillain. I took it as a compliment and did nothing to dispel her opinion of me. I'd rather succeed at being bad than fail at being good.

It's funny to think that I've had girlfriends but I never loved any of them. The last one was like a good friend who I also had sex with. I think that's no where near what love is. I'm sure there are other girls in my future but I don't think I'll love any of them. I'm sure even if I was married for 50 years I wouldn't be in love. At best it would be a friendship with benefits formalized by a marriage contract. But love is so much more than that, isn't it?

Is it wrong for me to obsess over how much I resent people I perceive as being more resentful than me? Is it wrong for me to be mad at graduates and young couples? Surely it would be wrong for me to expect the world to come down to my standards of mediocrity. I just find it so hard to accept I'm mediocre yet I can't deny the truth.

I want to be equal yet it's wrong to achieve equality by bringing everyone down to the level of the lowest common denominator. When I get mad at people who are smarter than me there's a short story I read called Harrison Bergeron

I don't really want them to fail, I just wish I could be good like them. But I can't because I've already ruined my life. It's too late. I can go on living but I've already wasted to many years to attain a decent standard of goodness. A life that's good in one part but bad in the beginning would always be tainted. Would you eat any part of an apple that's rotten on one side?

Cynicism sucks....big time! It causes a decay of the soul. And makes you stink all around.

I don't like perpetually "happy" people either.

But I dislike hearing negative people (who feel thata happy couple should somehow be made unhappy) even more.

All in all, I like it when people are able to discuss things dispassionately.

Those are cynical statements.

Whether or not cynicism is bad, it is still a form of communication that most people can not seem to avoid using. And for some people, it seems to be a much healthier way to "blow off steam" than letting it build up until they explode with rage.

Think about it: how many times have mass shooters been described as nice, quiet people who kept to themselves? I would worry more about the perpetually optimistic people who always express happiness and joy, and who never seem to have a bad moment.

Last edited by Fnord on 15 Jun 2016, 6:12 am, edited 1 time in total.

I have read you whole post but the best I can say is, yes, I would eat the good parts of a bad apple. Even if you need to use a knife to cut away the bad, discard that, enjoy the rest.

I shall respond to your comments in reverse order.

I guess you're right. I should be able to enjoy the remainder of my life even if there have been big parts of it before now that went really wrong. Hopefully I won't let my earlier experiences taint the rest of my life.Fnord, that's a very cynical thing to say! (hint: that's a compliment)Yeah, dispassionate thinking is indeed the greatest virtue.

I am cynical. It's no secret. I'm rather proud of it, in fact. In a crowd of people where everyone else is marveling at the emperor's sartorial elegance, I am the lone voice pointing out that the emperor is naked ... and then getting "board warnings" for my honesty.

Some level of cynicism is normal -- and inevitable if you've truly got your eyes open. It's when it consumes you that it becomes a problem.

I just think there needs to be more balance. I don't mind optimism. I just don't like coercive optimism that's based on lies. I can't stand being told to "have faith", or be fed BS that doesn't actually help anything because it isn't true. I just find un-truths annoying and that makes me more cynical than most people. Most people believe in some form of BS. I sometimes wish I could, but my brain doesn't function that way. I can't make myself believe things that aren't true. I get the feeling most popular beliefs about the world are untrue, period.

Like sh%t happens. I don't seek a supernatural explanation for bad events. A lot of life is random.

I think it good to be cynical sometimes to protect yourself. It's also not good to bottle things up when someone is mistreating you.

Cynicism can be justified in certain cases. You don't want it getting too out of hand though.

Ah, listen to yourself here...
You've ruined your life?
Wasted too many years to attain a decent standard of goodness?

What you're actually doing is putting the rotten apple in your pocket and carrying it around with you for the rest of your days to fester and ooze all over the place.

Throw the apple away if you don't like it and get a new one.
You don't have to form an entire identity around your past mistakes.

Some people use "positivity" to avoid making an emotional connection with others. As long as they police the conversation and stop the mention of any negative feelings, they don't have to do anything for anyone other than themselves. That's very different from a genuinely positive person, who will recognize other people's negative feelings without getting pulled into a bitchfest.

Jealousy, on the other hand, is poison. It can make you view a genuinely positive person in the worst possible light. Why don't you think about what you want from life rather than what people around you want?

There will always be people who are worse off than you and people who are better off. Comparing yourself with others is a pointless exercise. It makes you feel like s**t without actually making you achieve anything.

Are you laughing at your cynicism? If it gives you release, then it's good, at least, around people of like mind.

I don't entirely understand cynicism. Sometimes I take it literally, like that girl who heard your comment and thought you were serious. Other times, I understand and laugh. I have a friend who despises weddings, and if he ever made the comment you made, I would laugh because I know he's just exaggerating how much he hates the weddings. I find it easier to laugh at cynicism and other types of jokes from people I know, because I have an easier time understanding what might be the reason behind what they said.

If I'm reading your post right, it seems to me that you're talking about your cynical reaction to this overly positive guy, am I correct? This guy would be irritating to most people, in my opinion. Not BECAUSE he has such a nice life or is such a "nice" person, but just because he's smug about himself and seems to enjoy rubbing his positivity in someone else's face. THAT'S the part that is obnoxious, not the fact that he's this or that.

And when someone is that smug toward other people who -- in THEIR minds -- are "less" somehow (less happy, less "nice," in their often biased opinion, less wealthy, less able to cope, less positive, less everything), then it's actually quite a natural, human reaction to want to push back against that person.

You are just pushing back against his in-your-face positivity, with a natural reaction of wanting to counterbalance it with some negativity.

I'm guessing you might not even feel such a need to do this if this guy was less exuberant about looking on the bright side.

Something I believe is wrong with our societies today is that there is a lot of judgementalism -- usually on the part of extremely "positive" people -- of other people's ability to cope, other people's outlook or belief about the nature of things.

It's one thing to be a person striving to improve, striving always to find the lesson, see the bright side, enjoy what's good etc, and to try to help someone do the same if they are struggling to do so.

It's another thing ENTIRELY to be that person but judge someone who is struggling to have those qualities or be that way. There are people who positive and maybe even help someone less so but they go about life not pushing it in people's faces or believing a less-so person to just be a bad seed of some kind just because they're not like that.

Then there are people who are positive but use it as a stick to beat "less-so" people up with. To always make comparisons and make sure in passive aggressive ways that you know that "they rule and you drool."

They think they're more evolved because of their approach to life but it's actually more evolved to understand that everyone is on their own path and nobody knows what that person experiences or what gives them reason to be the way they are, perhaps even it's their strength and their manner of surviving.

Nor in fact how positive they might in fact be about a lot of things, it's just that when Perfect Person starts up with the smug again you wanna just be even more negative just because. Just because it's obnoxious!

Some cynicism is healthier in my opinion, because there IS much about life and the world that sucks. Yeah you can say "well be the change you want to see" blah blah blah. A lot of us do that BUT QUIETLY. A lot of us do that without rubbing "Up with people!" in everyone's faces. A lot of do that while also still knowing that realistically everything isn't all roses and not everyone can be upbeat, nor is it particularly healthy to always be so. Sometimes it's even patronizingly inappropriate.

I think everyone tries their hardest, even the ones who seem like they're not trying, but the upbeat people jump to that conclusion just because that person wears it more on their sleeve how much they're struggling.

Don't let this guy or anyone like him get under your skin. These people need to "walk a mile in the next person's shoes" before they judge how well or badly you're doing, or even how "nice" you are. Nobody knows that sh!t about anyone else, even when they think they do.

Fnord is right. I am cynical about cynicism.

Of course there are times when one SHOULD be cynical. You have to be watchful of peoples' intentions at all times. The key, really, is not to SHOW it.

But as an overall philosophy of life, I find it to be corrosive. I find that it f***s up the spirit. It certainly screws up mine.

It's better, as the cliche goes, to see things with the glass half-full.

I going to be honest: nobody I know believes that I "exude positivity," or that I "rub it off" on other people.