I'm so stupid I hate myself

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My mum said that sometimes I talk about embarrassing things when we're waiting at a bus stop where there are other people waiting. By embarrassing, she means stuff that might make people think I'm strange if they hear. I asked her to give an example of what sort of things I say, but she said she couldn't really remember what sort of things I say (as we haven't got a bus for a while).

So I suppose I sound like a village idiot or something. I'm a 27-year-old FEMALE with MILD Asperger's, and yet I've only just realised that you only have to talk about limited subjects when in public in case people might be listening.

My mum was just being honest with me, so please no badmouthing my mum, and usually Aspies prefer honesty so please don't badmouth my mum for being honest. But it's made me realise how stupid I am. I don't have special interests or any certain subjects I talk endlessly about, so it's not that. I don't talk about personal stuff in public either - I knew that rule since I was a child. So I don't know what other subjects there are that are inappropriate to talk about near strangers.

EDIT: Oh, and no I do NOT say things about the other people in the bus stop, like "that woman is fat". My mum is saying that I talk about things that might make others think I'm weird, not nasty or rude.

I think I would like you if we were friends in person.

Who cares what people think?

I think she is oversensitive.
Well, I remember some conversations in public transport that made people stare... like which building in the city would we like to blow up (which meant a gallery of bad architecture - but it surely sounded creepy), how skin reacts to different chemicals or detailed lecture on fire safety rules to 4yo kids... but come on, being weird is not that bad!

If she feels uncomfortable talking some topics in public, could she simply tell you this the moment your conversation turns that way? I hated when my mother was telling me I was behaving inappropriately hours after my actions, when I could do nothing about it. Ask her to tell you immidiatelly and explain you don't get meaningful stares, she needs to pronounce it "that topic is weird, let's talk something else" or "I'd rather not talk it now".

That's not being stupid. That's being affected by your Aspergers so that you have limited awareness about the social conventions of conversation in public.

First question is whether it matters if people think you're weird. I think the issue is different depending on whether you live in an area with a high population or one with a lower population (like a village) where people are very likely to recognise you. I live in an urban area and have always liked living in urban areas because of the relative anonymity. Living in an urban area, I would break down the issue as follows:
* if strangers at the bus stop think I'm odd, this doesn't really affect my life, therefore when I get annoyed about it (e.g. thinking "I'm so stupid I hate myself") I will remind myself as often as I need to that it doesn't much matter what strangers at the bus stop think and will try as much as possible not to let it bother me;
* if somebody I know is at the bus stop / in a similar public place, I will consciously try to modify my behaviour by talking less or thinking whether what I'm going to say is going to come across as weird;
* if there is a group of strangers at the bus stop and I chat away to my mum and then the next day (or whenever), I meet one of the strangers from the bus stop in a social situation / they start at my workplace / whatever, I will say somthing to them like, "Oh. You were at my bus stop yesterday. I might have come across as a bit weird. I just talk about anything I feel like." - at which point, most nice people whose opinion is worth bothering about will be nice about it e.g. saying "Oh, I didn't notice" or "Oh, I thought it was a bit weird you were talking about modified starch in the groceries you'd just bought, but it doesn't matter much" or something.

I think the basic choice you have, which is one which I think Aspies very often have is - try not to be concerned about what other people think vs. try to modify one's behaviour to be more socially normative. Only a massively-confident and / or very socially-oblivious Aspie can avoid being bothered about what other people think entirely, however modifying one's behaviour to be more socially normative can be very emotionally demanding, tiring and draining. Hence, my suggestion as to how I would handle the bus-stop issue living in an urban area - generally try not to worry about other people's perceptions when these don't matter (strangers), but maybe try to modify my behaviour to be more socially normative if there was somebody I know at the bus stop. I think self-acceptance / not worrying too much if other people think one is "weird"* is generally preferable to trying to modify one's behaviour to be more socially normative, because it places less emotional demands on one and is less like trying to fit a square peg into a round hole. But I can see it might be tricky, especially if one lives in a rural area / area with smaller population where there might frequently be people you know at the bus stop.

If the issue bothers you and you want to do more modification of your own behaviour, could you and your mum (and any other trusted friends / family) think some more about what kind of things you say in public which might come across as weird? Try to think and ask your mum of specific examples. Then try to come up with some rules for yourself as to what comes across weird in public. But that's a lot of hassle. So I would generally have a strong preference for trying not to be too bothered if people think I'm weird and reminding myself that strangers' opinions of me don't matter.

(* "Weird" (i.e. "different") can be treated by jerks as a bad way for people to be, but actually it's not hurting anybody. Therefore, I try not to be too bothered if people think I'm "weird". I am bothered if people think my behaviour is "hurtful" / "rude" / etc and so I am much more inclined to put effort into modifying Aspie behaviour which could fit those definitions than Aspie behaviour which is just "weird".)

Sorry Jo, do you talk loud?

I'm not going to knock Jo's mother.

But she acts just like my mother. My mother becomes easily embarrassed when she's around me. It's almost as if she's "expecting" me to say something weird, or talk about something weird.

Quite frankly, it's none of their business--the people on the bus. I hear "weird" crap talked about all the time. It's actually quite interesting at times.

I guess you have to be sensitive to your mother's fears, Jo. But, truly, unless you're some thug kid who's looking for a fight or a laugh, people really don't give two craps what other people say. They're into their own thing, usually, especially these days with phones and earphones.

I don't talk loud, in fact I'm more of a mumbler and I keep my voice at a certain level when talking in public.

Even if I tried not to care what other people think, I still can't stop my mum from caring what they think, and she has always been a sensitive person. Personally I feel that other people aren't really listening, because I know that I don't listen to other people's conversations unless they are shouting loud enough for everyone to hear, but even then I don't really take in every word enough to judge them, because I know that it's none of my business. The only time I might look or judge is if people are arguing loudly, and me and my mum don't argue in public.

My mum is so sensitive though. One time I was in a busy shop with her and she looked at an item and wanted to buy it for someone I knew she didn't like very much, so I said, "but I didn't think you liked that person very much" and she told me not to state that she doesn't like a person in public in case people heard and thought she was nasty for not liking a person. We were in a big shop in a city that was miles away from the town we lived in, so it wasn't like we knew anyone there who might know the person my mum doesn't like. Humans are entitled to dislike another human, and that doesn't mean you are a bad person. And strangers don't know (or care) about the full story.

But that's a thing I've learnt about NTs, they seem to think that just because they know about something personal, they think everybody else will know about that one personal thing just by having a small chance of hearing a few vague words about the personal business that won't actually give anything away. Like for example if you are in a big city where you know no-one, and you was with someone who was on their way to see the doctor because they thought they were pregnant but didn't want anyone but you to know. You perhaps ask them "so when's your doctors appointment?" and they said "don't ask that out loud, I don't want everyone knowing I might be pregnant!" That's so annoying because 1, nobody around even knows us, 2, you could be going to the doctor for a million different reasons, and 3, if anybody did hear me ask when the doctors appointment is all you are to that person is a person with a doctors appointment, then that person who might have heard has his or her own life to lead and isn't exactly going to think "oh, that girl has a doctors appointment, I wonder if she's pregnant, I'm going to track her down and broadcast it to the whole world".

I know exactly what you mean. It irritates me, too.

But people still are sensitive to that extremely small chance that such "public disclosure" will cause problems for them.

It's hard to be around people like that.

You're not stupid. It's normal for people on the spectrum, regardless of "mildness", to have trouble with some social cues. On the other hand, your mom may just be extra-sensitive. Can you talk to your mom about it, and tell her how you feel?

Lol your mum sounds funny Jo....I mean that in a good way.

I wouldn't worry to be honest and you are not stupid either.

We are all kinda at a dead end on this.

Jo pretty much got rid of all of the "usual suspects" that trigger one's elders to tell you "not to talk about that stuff". Its not that she talks about sex/medical/drugs issues in public, or rattles on about weird special interests, or points out strangers. Your mom could not recall any specific "example".

So I don't know. You maybe violating some really subtle but real rule. Or maybe your mom is overly sensitive.

My mum is funny, you'd love to meet her.

My mum says that sometimes I've talked about "stuff that doesn't need to be said" in the past, and that it's not a big problem.

And yes she is sensitive. She admits that herself.

Since your Mum didn't say anything at the time, or for a long time afterwards, I think this is less about what you said at the bus stop and more that she is annoyed at the time she told you this. Is this possible?

When people loose patients with me they often throw up stuff from ages ago that they assume I know upset them or annoyed them at the time. I then feel really stupid because I had no idea there was a problem at the time. But I am not stupid, I am an Aspie, they simply told me they were upset using body language and facial expressions that I am unable to read, rather like if they had told me they were upset in a language that I was unfamiliar with.

It does not sound as if your Mum has grasped the basics of you being an Asperger, she may think that by telling you this, the problem will be solved by you simply paying more attention. THIS APPROACH WILL NOT WORK, vetting everything you say at the level that would need, even when talking to your own Mum, will lead to a breakdown.

I am educating my family (those that still speak to me) as to my difficulties in interacting with other people bit by bit, after all it's a lot for them to take in.

Is it just me, or is there completely a correlation between how much someone else gets irritated at us and how much we get irritated back?

Anyway, don't hate yourself. There's some NPs out there who want us to hate ourselves so we will get irritated at ourselves, lash out, and they can be right about us. To some people, being right is more important than doing the right thing, which could easily be the #1 source of grief for anyone on the spectrum.

Actually, while I don't remember what I was talking about the last time I was at the bus stop with my mum, I do remember her looking agitated as I was talking, and I wondered why she was feeling like that about the subject I was talking about, but I didn't really think any more about it until today. We both had a free day together today and we were deciding on what to do. I just suddenly thought about her nonverbal reaction at the bus stop that time and said "we could get the bus and go shopping but you don't like me talking in the bus stop when there are other people waiting there". And then this brought on a self-loathing moment of mine. I do wish one of us could remember what it was I was talking about that day, because I love examples.

Sometimes I do speak out a small ailment I temporarily have, which could be something I might've said in the bus stop that day. Because I clench my jaw a lot when not talking, I sometimes focus on how "sticky" my teeth feel as I bite down (I do clean my teeth regularly by the way), and it feels annoying but at the same time good, and so I have an impulsive urge to say "my teeth feel sticky". So maybe I said that or something, which might be weird to strangers, in a gross way. I'm not saying that was what I was talking about, but it might've been something along the lines of that, something that doesn't need to be said randomly.

Now everything going with your mum?