The Mandela Effect

Post Reply New Topic

Can it be shown, when a change occurred?

This.

Was just gonna say that... if we had actually somehow switched cosmic railroad tracks onto a different time line (or whatever the heck the claim is of what happened), and this caused movie posters to change, and book covers to change, and the sound tracks of movies to change, and newspapers to change, and websites to change, and the printed word in the Bible to change, then wouldnt the memory making molecules in our brain cells ALSO change along with it? Our memories would change along with everything else so it would cancel out and there would be no descrepancy between our memories and our media, and we wouldnt even have any way of knowing that we had jumped the track into a different timeline even if it actually happened.

mikeman7918: Come up with a way to test and measure the paranormal, then we'll talk. If it can't be measured, then by definition it doesn't affect me and I can safely ignore it.18:
Para-Normal simply means currently unexplainable by currently known scientific-knowledge. You also posted a link to False-Memory Syndrome, how-ever, I found something quite interesting...

...a question from the channel-owner is put into the description and it goes as follows...
Curious J:
Anyone else notice a change in South America's location? Apparently tons of people have and there's proof online. For now anyway.

* I have one question for the skeptics of the Mandela Effect, and I ask it in a non-confrontational manner, with total respect, as I was initially a skeptic as well.

ME Skeptics,

After watching this video (specifically the last minute or two regarding the drawings), if you still take the viewpoint that we are all coincidentally misremembering things in the same wrong way- and that the drawings simply prove that there is a common misconception-then I have to ask:

Where did our wrong memory of these continent's locations come from?

Did we mis-hear the location at some point?
Beautiful Day In THIS Neighborhood, Int With THE Vampire, WAS like a box of chocolates... these things could have been misunderstood on the initial viewing/hearing thus creating a false memory,. A false memory only to be supported by the numerous (and also incorrect) quotes from the masses and thought pop culture for years to come.
A valid argument, I get it.

Same goes for a person thinking that a celebrity or public figure died when in fact they haven't. For whatever reason, maybe we misread or misheard a headline at some point and it gets stored in our brains incorrectly, remaining there until we realize one day years later that the person isn't dead.
Understood. Another valid point.

But... for 99% of the people who participated in the drawing project to all assume the exact same incorrect location of one of the world's major continents???

The standard arguments of the skeptic fall way short for this one.

When one is asked to draw the location of the contents, he/she is recalling a memory from the VISUAL part of the brain. So they didn't hear it wrong. Nor did they learn it wrong initially due to thier school using early, out-of-date maps during their education... because we simply can not find any maps in any books that show the continents in this 'incorrect' fashion.

They had to have SEEN it wrong. And not just once.

99% of people who participated- of various ages and from all over the world - All placed an ENTIRE CONTINENT in the EXACT SAME INCORRECT spot.

Let that sink in for a second.
And then let me know HOW that happened.

Thanks for reading.

Personally, I remember South-America being more to the left, too. I have a pretty damn good memory compared to most people. How-ever, I am also aware that the entire laws of physics can change on us without our even noticing, such as I gave in the example of the dream-state reality (memories were over-written for our alternate-time-line-existence, usually referred to as dreaming, such that we exist in yet another reality that feels just as if not even more objective than the Earth-Life). I have memories that factually span over multiple time-lines (and am also aware how to distinguish and tell them apart whilst I am in this particular time-line). Curious J's video is quite compelling none-the-less.

mikeman7918: like you the scientific community will change what they accept if new evidence suggests that a current idea is wrong.
That is what we are lead to believe but, believe it or not, science has always been and continues even to this very day to be controversial against any "radical" evidence contrary to the Status-Quo. They say that History Repeats Itself. History is not repeating if the Scientific-Community is not being stubborn to changes in paradigm (but look deep into any "controversial" subject and you will find significant resistance against any amount of evidence presented). Here are some reminders...

"Invisible forces that the eye cannot see causing sickness and disease? Nonsense! Everybody knows that all illnesses are caused by poisoned blood and that blood-letting is state-of-the-art medical-technology!" (Was later vindicated when the invention of the microscope proved the existence of viruses, bacteria, germs, etc)

"Rocks do not fall from the sky." (The French Academy of Sciences was forced to retract this statement after a meteor had hit near their facilities a few centuries ago)

"Pictures that move on their own? Absurd!" (Then came Motion-Pictures, Television, Movies, etc)

"Instanteous communication that is even faster than sending a courrier riding on a horse to deliver a message? Impossible!" (Radio-telegrams became a thing and there are now radio-signals used everywhere)

"Heavier-Than-Air Flying Machines? Your ideas are absurd!" (Even when The Wright-Brothers had demonstrated Heavier-Than-Air Flight to the public, skeptics still insisted on putting head-lines into the newspapers, claiming that The Wright-Brothers were engaged in fraud and trickery, via the use of Invisible-Ropes in order to fool people into thinking that there was such a thing as Heavier-Than-Air-Flight)

"Continents don't float on water you dumb-ass!" (Then came the eventually accepted THEORY of Plate-Tektonics after DECADES of resistance against such a seemingly absurd-sounding idea...)

Even Ohm's Law was a POSTHUMOUS work, a full 20 years after Mr. Ohm died, his theoretical-ideas vehemently opposed, mocked, ridiculed, not to mention that during his life he was a prime target of vicious attacks.

This stuff still happens even to this very day. Just try studying some Para-Psychology in-depth to see for yourself. Now I need to attach/link a couple of images that are relevant to what I have written here thus far.

mikeman7918: I think it's worth mentioning that I am technically a Christian (Mormon to be precise) although I have been questioning that lately and depending on how things go I may become agnostic.

I understand. I had a really good conversation with some Mormons that came to the apartment that I was living at at the time where we had a great discussion. I wish it could have been recorded since it was that good, they came up with some of the best questions for me to answer, and we covered a lot of detail. Unfortunately, I had lost their contact-information, due to varying unstable circumstances that I had around that decade ago, but maybe I might be able to draw their attention if I resume becoming a You-Tube celebrity again and bring up topics that might draw them to my video/channel and getting back in contact if they happen to manage to remember that day.

Also, people usually do not change belief-systems very easily, not without experiencing something in life that might be painful. I am also no stranger to Cognitive-Dissonance. I always pursue Cognitive-Dissonance now. I do not know if I should have used the term of an Agnostic for myself but at this point you have seen enough of my posts and read through enough of my responses to get an idea that I am not an adherent to any particular belief-system (nor dis-belief system), and I usually try to collect data that is diametrically opposed against whatever I may have believed at the time, such that what I accept today I can just as easily reject tomorrow, and what I reject today may just as easily be accepted tomorrow.

Rather than Belief-Systems, I am more like an Information-Collection System, and if each Tree of a Forest represented a different Religion or Belief-System, then I am a Harvester of Trees or a Collector of Trees to add to my Forest-Collection. I have also referred to this Metaphorical-Forest as a Grid, a Paradigm-Grid, and my interest is in always getting that grid expanded. The more I develop my Paradigm-Grid, the more I can metaphorically avoid mistaking one tree as being representative of a whole entire forest, and the "Opposing View-Points" book-series are examples of the kinds of things I try to stick into my Paradigm-Grid (I look at everybody's information, regardless of how seemingly absurd or impossible its ideas or beliefs may seem, and I can tell you for a fact that some trees are basically the same as others or at least are able to "parallel" one another, what I often see with highly polarised beliefs, some trees will be bigger than others, metaphorically speaking of course, etc).

mikeman7918: I for one have just (mostly) accepted that I can never really know for sure what the heck is really going on in the universe and so I am going by the next best thing: what I can observe. You can't deny the usefulness of science; I mean, we are currently communicating with some undeniably awesome technology.

I do not deny the usefulness of technology. I question if modern-day science has turned into a religion. Not all sciences are the same, and I am very HIGHLY SKEPTICAL when it comes to what I might call, a corporate-science. Any time a report or study or whatever or a web-site claims something about medicine/science/etc., immediately, I look up to see who owns the web-site or who funded the publication/study/paper/research, and if it's from a corporation, I immediately dismiss it as suspect.

mikeman7918: There is a string theorist named Brian Greene who has written 3 books about physics that I have read. Something tells me that you would enjoy them. He talks about a lot of deep physics theories as well as a lot of very plausible hypothetical stuff.

I am familiar with him, have several of his books that were left over from them having been passed onto me from a doctor/scientist who died a few years ago (from renal-failure after being taken off of dialysis due to being too weak to even be able to get him to dialysis any more since five days in a row worth of chemotherapy weakened his muscles so significantly that he could no longer even move, amongst other complications, including going through advanced stages of cancer), plus I have watched several of the Quantum-Physics and Quantum-Mechanics and Time-is-an-Illusion Documentaries that feature him as the main narrator.

I remember reading about the Tortesillas Meridian in jr. high back in 1969.

The Tortesillas Meridian was the dividing line of the world drawn by the Pope shortly after the first voyage of Columbus to divide the whole nonChristian (ie non European) world between the then two rising superpowers: Spain and Portugal. Spain got everything (discovered at the time or not) west of the line (essentially all of the Americas), and Portugal got everything east of the line (Africa, Asia).

The line runs straight pole to pole the length of the Atlantic. It cuts through the upper right corner of Brazil ( a piece of Brazil is east of the line), and the rest of the Americas are too the left of the line.

Now here comes the part thats relevant to this thread.

When I was a Jr. high kid looking at the map in 1969 I noticed that the Tortesillas line was completely to the east of North America. The line ran through open Ocean in the North Atlantic. It did not cut through any part of (what after Columbus's time would become) the USA nor Canada. I remember thinking at the time that "if the world had continued to follow that Papal bull dividing line of the world then all of the USA and Canada would have been Spanish, and only a tiny sliver of Brazil (instead of all of Brazil as it happened) would have gone to Portugal, and the rest to Spain.

In my time in 1969 IF south america had been "directly under north america" then the books I would have seen then would have shown North America bifurcated by the Tortesillas line. But they did not. Ergo- South Amerca was where it is now (west of South America) even back in 1969!

Except it has moved 45 inches to the west because of plate tectonics. Lol!

Folks are dumb about geography. They know south america is south of north america but they dont know that is also east of north america. Thats just the way it is.

A lawyer friend of my parents got into a debate with me over Thanksgiving dinner when he said that "Canada is three to five times the size of the contiguous USA", and I corrected him and said that "Canada is only about 27 percent larger than the USA without Alaska". The reason he thought what he thought was because on most flat maps of the world it looks like Canada is three times the size of the lower 48 United States because most world maps are based on the mercator projection which distort size and makes high latitude (close to the poles) places look bigger than they are. Canada looks that much bigger than the USA but the two countries are actually virtually the same size. But this older lawyer friend is probably not the only educated person in the world to have that misconception. If you took a poll you would probably find millions of folks "know" that Canada is three or five times the size of the contiguous USA. But that doesnt "prove" that Canada miraculously suddenly shrank to a fraction of its size one day because we all went through a matrix!

Last edited by naturalplastic on 14 Jun 2016, 4:45 am, edited 2 times in total.

the "mandela" effect is similar to an emotional version of a mandelbrot effect

Sorry.

You will have to elaborate.

The Mandelbrot Effect has something to do with fractal geometry. Thats about all I can grasp of it. How the Mandela effect (whether it's real or not) is like fractal geometry is not obvious (at least not to me).

the mandelbrot effect is either "how the whole subdivides into the minutia of it's composition in a linearly invariable method of subdefinition", or "how the end result can be an overlay of microscopic reconstitutions that go to create the whole which is linearly derivitative of it's componentry"

emotional mandelbrot effects are self sustaining with scrutiny as to their constructive components as well as the other way around (that is decompilation into identical components).

i do not know how to describe it in a human type of way i am sorry. my post was a comment meant to be ignored.
it is not important enough to discuss anyway because it was a sub-ambit thought anyway.

That's not even a thing -rational-wiki-only, anyway its well known longer than that
i'll stick it in the departement of bs, ct's, hivemind-swarmgrammar(free interpretation but i like the word) & Delusions and the Madness of the Masses

yeah that's cool. just stick where your mind feels at home.

This is also a compelling example of False-Belief Memory, how-ever, Curious J showed and detailed how he used to live in South America, unable to ask the locals as to which U.S. time-zones matched with the location where he was at on the continent, then using the time and map on his phone, followed the map from his phone to line up the U.S. equivalent via moving his finger up the screen until it showed which States lined up (directly North via a North-South line) with his immediate co-ordinate whilst he was in South-America.

What would account then for this kind of an anomaly unless macro-layers of data are being over-written ?

The guy was using his smartphone? A tiny screen on his smart phone? He probably couldnt even see the lines of Meridian on the tiny screen, and probably unwittingly slanted the tracks of his finger to line up with the USA, and which probably caused him to be on the wrong US time the whole trip (which wouldnt matter anyway- the locals wouldnt care if wanted breakfast at their lunchtime).

Re-listening to his commentary, his stay there was not a mere trip for a day, but being there for 100 days, thus it seems unlikely that he'd be slipping his finger that incorrectly that many times to result in such inaccuracies (not to mention that his full video-presentation looks to be detailed enough to the point where I would have trouble believing that his ability to pay attention to detail was sloppy or careless). His finger-tracing was done frequently enough to the point where he stopped doing it after a while due to finding that it would nearly always line up with Central-Time of North-America. For these reasons I still find it difficult to dismiss this phenomenon of The Mandela Effect as mere Phantasy (purposeful spelling). I find it quite fascinating and do not even remember knowing about the existence of The Mandela Effect until looking into this thread a couple of days ago.

Right. You lost your car keys. Therefore they had to have been stolen by space aliens (its the simplest explanation after all). Or it could be "macro layers of data being over written" on you(whatever THAT means). Lol!

He never found a hard paper map from any atlas, or even a roadside gas station to look at during the whole 100 day trip to check his smart phone map against? Couldnt even find a hotel room with a good sized internet computer screen?

If so then you can tell that he wasnt very "careful". Or he is not being very honest, or he is honestly reporting the results of his own honest incompentence.

And there is a problem with the internal logic of his story. He claims that every part of South America lined up with US Central time. Even if a giant lifted south america out of the ground and plopped it down so it lined up with the US midwest South Americaf would still be too big to fit into one time zone. At its widest point south America is atleast 3000 miles wide (more or less at the Equator). So that means the SA has to have at least three time zones. So even if the continent had been farther to the east than now it couldnt possibly be entirely on U.S. Central time.


FYI:Mexico and Central America are all mostly on U.S. Central Time. The Western slice of South America (Columbia, Peru, Ecuador, Chile, and Paraguay) are on Eastern Standard Time, The middle strip of S.A. ( Bolivia, Venezuela, and western Brazil) are on what might be called "Labrador Time" (the time zone of the empty Atlantic east of the US EST zone). And the eastern most part of the continent is on Greenland Time(Eastern Brazil,Uruguay,Argentina). The point is that South America has three time zones. Moving it west would change the time zones to different time zones, but you would still need three time zones.


And besides (as I explained above) I noticed that South America was farther east than most of North America on maps myself when I was a school kid in 1969 (long before that guy took his trip to South America).

Almost all Mandela Effects are the brain's autocorrect. I mean "Interview with A vampire" sounds sort of normal, while "Interview with THE vampire" does not. Barbara Streisand looks more correct than Barbra (her real name), so mental autocorrect kicks in.

When "Sex AND the city" started I thought "Oh, so many will get this really odd name wrong".

The things we thought we heard or saw are either more natural, normal or down to the point. I rarely see the Mandela effect going into more complexity, instead of into less complexity. Can only find one example, "Looney tOOns".

Or like, life is cruel, so someone who was jailed forever must have died in jail, no way he had a happy ending becoming the president.

I wish there was something more fancy to this.

His claim was not about every single part of South America lining up with every single part of North America; how can I be so sure that you are not ironically passing along faulty information yourself when re-listening to the clip indicates that he only made one specific particular claim in regards to time-zones, and that was specifically the country of Chilé in particular always lining up with North American Central-Time ? Certainly, I do not dispute your answers as being compelling, but what makes you immune to the same phenomenon from everybody else having a faulty memory ? Not to mention the multitudes of comments from people who had studied geography all of their lives and noticing something peculiar about the map (and in Quantum-Mechanics it's not really that far-fetched of a Theory when the Double-Slit Experiment is taken into consideration as to having a potentially significant effect upon the realities that are being rendered).

I thought that he said "i traveled all over South America and everywhere I went it lined up with US Central Time".

If it wasn't "all over South America" but just "all over Chile" then that makes what he said is even dumber.

Chile is a long narrow ridiculous looking shoe lace of a country than runs down the Pacific Coast of South America- about 1500 miles long, but rarely more than a 100 miles wide (if that much). The long part is north to south, and the narrow part is east to west. That bares repeating-the LONG PART is...NORTH TO SOUTH. time zones change east to west, not (for the most part) north to south. That means that no matter how much you explore every highway, and every byway of Chile (thought it is fairly large country) you're gonna be in the same damned time zone! So if the guy was always in the one country of Chile but still habitually checked to see "which American time zone" he was in then he is severely lacking in common sense. He shoulda known that he only had to check it once, because it should have been obvious to him the whole country would be on the same time zone.

And that time zone is U.S. Eastern Standard Time. Not U.S. Central Time.But its adjacent to U.S. Central time. So he was just one off of the right time zone.

So I will opt for the explanation that he was one-off because of either faulty memory, or faulty map reading of his little smart phone. Sorry. Dont see the need to cue up the Twilight Zone music for this.