Help with my AS daughter, please!

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My 7 year old daughter has AS. She is smart, funny, creative......and inflexible, disrespectful, cannot see others point of view, is controling etc.

I signed her up for an art camp (3 hours in the afternoon for a week) because she said she wanted to do it. Well, today is the first day and she is refusing to go! She says she won't like it. I already paid for this and it makes me upset when she pulls this "refusal" stuff.

So I am asking for some help from the AS women. Were you like this as a child (or are you still like this)? And what should I do to get her to relax and go to camp???

Hi

Sorry you are having a rough time. Personally, as a child, if I was told to do it - I did it. Then suffered in silence, dealt with overwhelming fear, panic and bottled my anger. I also talked minimally and never cried, didn't feel pain unless I saw blood.

I am more as you describe your daughter today though. There are many times where I want to do something - but last minute fear can be paralyzing. That I simply can not do it. I tend to come off angry and aggressive when I am scared. Is it possible this is the case for her now? She may want to, but change is hard.

Also I tend to do something way better and not be so scared if my kids are with me (odd I know as I am the parent, not the child) or if my mom (ouchie to admit that - I am rather old) So maybe she is scared to go alone? Can you stay with her maybe the first day?

I am a stickler for rules. So even if I don't want to do something - if it is breaking a rule if I don't do it, I will do it biting the bullet, and most the time it isn't that bad. Maybe if your daughter is rule driven, you can tell her a rule regarding this camp.

I can't think of anything that would relax me to be able to go. Just the being there and seeing it is ok would make it better. I may even completely reject it while home and actually enjoy it while there...

I know my answer isn't that helpful... sorry

My "special interest" is also art. I sculpt dollhouse miniatures today. I grew up loving art. Start young trying to mold her creativity into something bankable. An aspie that can turn their special interest into a marketable job has an easier time career
wise.

Hope you can get her to go

My best to you and your family.

Hmm, I'd explain to her and remind her that she wanted to go to this art camp. Mummy already paid for it and mummy worked hard for that money so you can be happy and do the things you like doing. I'd try to get her interested in all of the fun things that she'll be doing there.

Personally, I'd try to make her go. If she absolutely refuses, like throws a temper tantrum and you'd rather not be embarrassed then tell her that next time she wants to join something she wont be allowed to unles she earns the money by doing chores so she knows how hard it is to work like mummy did and tell her that she wasted your money. Depending on how she acts, maybe even ground her or take away a priviledge...but it depends how her attitude is. I don't know your daughter and how bad it really is.

hi I'm 14 years old and I still do this,but to a lesser extent. Like, tomorrow I'm supposed to go to the fair with some friends and last week I really wanted to go, but today I'm dreading it. Most likely I'll tell my mom I don't want to go, and she will tell me how she already paid for it, and I promised my friends that I would go,therefore,I need to go. And I'll probably have a meltdown/shut down, but I'll go.

explain to you daughter reasons why she should go and that it will be fun. Ask her why she doesn't want to go and be flexible with her answers. If she sais she's scared, go with her for example. If she simply refuses to go, tell her a reward. Like "if you you go today we can get icecream after" etc. If the class has a lot of kids and she's scared of crowds, ask the teacher if she can sit by herself. Don't force her to interact with the other kids because that might cause a meltdown/shutdown.After you make it clear that she's going and your not changing your mind, let her have some alone time for 30 mins-a hour. She will need to mentally prepare herself for this change in routine,and it will give her time to cool down.

these things help me, so I hope I helped

Thank you for the advice. Here is how it just played out. I explained to her that she did say she wanted to go to the camp. She insists she only wants to go to "magic tree house camp" next week and she never wanted art camp (but she did!). She is she stuck on the fact that she never said she wanted to go. I told her I would get her a whole box of Trader Joes chocolate bars while she is at camp and they will be hers and she won't have to share them with her sister. She was excited about that, we all got in the car and went. We walked into the classroom, she seemed ok. There was a girl from her school there but she wouldn't go say hello to her (the girl did not come up and say hi to us either). Then they put this bracelet on her wrist for safety and she did NOT like that, and she took it off! She would not sit at a table. When I tried to leave she followed me and her sister out the door. A very nice camp counselor came out with us and tried to help. Then my daughter ran out the door and into the parking lot! I told her that if she did not stay I would NOT sign her up for ballet and she really wants to do that. She said she didn't care (but she wil care when I sign her little sister up and not her!). Then she ran out to the car and tried the open the door repeatedly. I talked to her some more and she was just freaking out and said she had to go home. After 20 minutes I gave up and let her in the car and told her no ballet for her!

In the car she told me she wanted me and her sister to die. She didn't care about the chocolate or ballet. She said I was stupid to pay $135 for the camp.

So now I am very angry with her. I understand the social anxiety thing. I myself get nervous before I go someplace new or are around new people. But I suck it up and deal. She has done this several times before with things and ends up having a great time. This is the first time I did not continue to push her. I had her 5 year old sister hanging on me and I could not carry DD7 kicking and screaming back to the classroom with the 5 year old.

Right now I want nothing to do with her for the rest of the day! I don't want her to constantly ask me for stuff and ask me to play her little games where she has to be in control of everything. I don't want to look at her! She is so disrespectful! Are most people with Asperger's like this? Or is there something else going on? I need a time out!

HELP

One thing you need to realize... We can't just "suck it up and deal with it." It doesn't work that way. Even when I'm around lots of people I know, it affects me. Like, I don't know if my brain gets overloaded because it's trying to process the actions and words of so many more people, or what the hell it is, but I'll start to feel sorta lightheaded/stupid... actually, it's almost like a mairjuana high, except there's no pleasure to be had from it; just the lack of a fully functioning brain. This can get extremely frustrating because it's already frustrating to be around people at all. I'm clumsy as hell, so I already look like a bumbling fool. Then I trip over my words sometimes, and in large groups of people, I can't hear what the hell the person next to me is saying a lot of the time, so I just come off as this gigantic idiot in public sometimes. Because of that, I'm better off not going out at all. I'm not trying to suggest that what she said to you was okay by any means, but I can relate to it. There have been times when I've had similar bad thoughts and said things like that.

I am a nice, decent, loving person.

But I have my sensory side and that is NOT pretty. Nice. Or loving. My sensory side is my ugly side. Mean, angry, and hurtful.

From what you describe, I think your daughter has sensory issues. Forget social anxiety, that pales in comparison. There is a spectacular article that can put it into perspective for you. It explains absolutely everything you would ever need to understand. Here is a few bits I picked out that pertains to your situation

Quoted:

"The family was struggling to find the solution to a challenging behaviour of an 8-year-old autistic boy. The boy removed his clothes at any opportunity no matter where he was. The mother asked for advice from a ‘specialist’. And the advice was to encourage (?) the boy to keep his clothes on and reward him (with a chocolate biscuit) when he complies. If we look at this situation from the ‘autistic perspective’, tactile processing problems are obvious. The boy himself was aware of which fabric would ‘hurt’ him and tried to protect himself. His ‘clues’ were not recognized by the people involved. We could interpret the intervention as follows: A person with broken legs is encourage to run and promised to be rewarded with a chocolate biscuit. Would you run?"

End Quote

They put the bracelet on your daughter = sensory problem to me. She reacted and removed the bracelet and removed herself from the place that hurt her. You Mommy, brought her and encouraged her to experience that. Daughter is now angry and lashing out at Mommy for taking her to a place that hurt her. You then as well punished her and took ballet away as a result.

A very confusing experience for a child.

Your daughter can be Hyper sensitive to stimuli. Fight or flight response will kick in then. Your body can handle only so much before desperation kicks in. Your daughter may not even be consciously aware of her issues, if that is the case, how can she properly communicate it to you? By her behaviors though, you can figure it out.

She freaked after they put the bracelet on. That says tons to me.

Quote:

"Another situation: At one of the autistic provisions a teaching support assistant is happily whistling and singing. Josh, an 11-year-old autistic boy with hyperhearing, is rocking back and forth. He covers his ears with his hands, but it does not seem to work and he pushes his index fingers inside his ears. No effect. Then he pleads with his ‘helper’: “Loraine, stop singing please. Stop it!” The reaction of the support worker? “Why should I? Don’t be stupid, Josh.”

If we look at the same situation from Josh’s perspective we could interpret it as a sensory assault of the child. For this boy ‘the singing’ (whether it was the pitch of the voice or the sounds of whistling he could not tolerate) physically hurt his ears, as if the helper threw stones or litter at him. So why should she stop?"

End quote.

Please read this article:

http://www.autismtoday.com/articles/dif ... iences.htm


I know it is hard for you to understand. But the world on the autistic spectrum can be very overwhelming and painful. You can learn how to understand your daughter, and you both will have an easier time of it.

Hope this helps!

Best wishes to you

I spoke with her and I told her that I am sure there would be a way for her not to wear the bracelet or to wear it someplace else and not her wrist. She said no! She didn't like the room but she can't explain it. She said she will go to camp next week if the room is OK. WHAT THE HECK? I don't know what the room will be like, it will be some sort of classroom. I called the camp and they said they would work with us with the bracelet situation and make the room brighter (she said it was too dark). They said if I cancel next weeks camp I will get money back but I have to cancel this week. She says she wants to go to camp next week, but if she freaks out again there goes another $135!

I am trying to understand. I think if she was nonverbal or delayed or something it would make more sense. She is very smart, I know her IQ and although I don't know mine, I am sure hers is higher than mine because it is high! To see this beautiful, intelligent girl, who has been talking and talking since before she was 2, melt down over things and often act like she is 2 or 3 emotionally, is just so confusing.

She can't seem to put into words exactly the problem with the room. I am imagining bringing her next week and her pulling the same exact thing. I told her if she could go to 1 day of art camp, then I will let her try the camp next week. She said no, she won't go back. So I am thinking of canceling next weeks camp. I signed her up for these camps because I think she would really enjoy them. I don't want to cause distress.

I am over my anger, it didn't last long. I love her and can't stand to see her go through life like this, it is torture.

Thank you for the replies and please keep them coming. I need as much insight as I can get. I am reading Aspergirls now and have read other books but I don't feel like they offer much practical advice.

What would you have done if your child ran out of the camp room? Said ok, you don't have to stay and that is that? She tried to run out of a few other things over the past couple years (including a couple social skills groups) but in all situations there was someone really well qualified to deal with her (like an OT) and I was able to leave and they worked with her. And then she ended up loving being there. So to just let her refuse and have her not experience things would not be good.

Hmm, when I was younger I tried horseback riding lessons for awhile and I didn't like it so I eventually dropped out of it. My mum paid weekly though so money didn't really matter. When I was younger my family knew I had developmental disabilities but they didn't know it was AS. AS was just starting to become popular and mostly only for boys.

I remember my dad tried to get me into karate by going to observe a class but I didn't want to sign up and I was mad because he tricked me into going and told me it was dance class. I did however participate in creative dance and ballet when I was 4 and 5 and I enjoyed it although I had some difficulties with the gross motor stuff.

It sounds like you did your best. I mean, it's good to be firm with your children but if they absolutely don't want to go to an extracurricular activity you can't really force them because obviously they're not going to like it or be happy with you, it's a bit embarrassing if they're freaking out plus it's not fair to the other children.

Next time if she wants to join something basically tell her what I told you earlier that money doesn't grow on trees and mom and dad worked hard so she could participate. Warn her that if she wastes mom's money again then she'll be doing chores.

Also, the next time you sign her up for something ask the instructor if she can try a demo class or an observation class. Most extracurricular activities like dance will allow this sort of thing. That way she can either watch it or try out a class to see if she likes it or not before you put the money into it.

Good Luck!

A few things come to mind:

Did you ask her about the girl who was there who is in her class at school? I'm curious, because you recognized her but they didn't acknowledge each other. Is it possible she's had problems with her? Not that I think that would explain all of this, necessarily. But when I got bullied by kids I didn't even really recognize it as bullying - even when I was much older than 7 - only as a distressful situation I wanted to avoid.

Remember she's only 7. When I was that age I had trouble just with regular school. I remember I tried to go to a dance class outside of school at about that age, and I was unable to handle it. Just the social and sensory aspects of regular school were so much for me to handle, I needed a break the rest of the time. Too much social interaction without enough time to myself exhausted me and gave me migraines - I had them that early, and they're mostly stress-related.

There were a lot of situations I recall as a child where something sounded really fun when talking about it at home, way in advance, but when they got closer and I realized I wouldn't be at home, I would be in a strange place with strange people, and lots of new things going on, seemed rather terrifying and stressful.

But I was one of those kids who would quite often do whatever because I had to, even if I was miserable the whole time. I didn't understand why I didn't like certain situations (and no one knew what Asperger's was then anyway), and I could not articulate what the trouble was to my parents, only that I didn't like it or didn't want to do it.

She is done with school and all last week was home with me so she hasn't had too much social interaction. And she did want to do camp...but like you said, maybe it sounded good a couple months ago and not today!

That is interesting you could not articulate what the trouble was and just said you didn't like it or didn't want to do it. She keeps saying she didn't like the room but can't explain it.

That is a good idea about asking for a demo class. For this camp, it would not have worked out, but I can see it working out in the future for a dance class or something.

Maybe she felt uncomfortable when she saw everyone sitting around the table. It could be a social thing. I know I had problems like that.

With hyper sensitivities are you aware your daughter can hear things you possible can't? That maybe she doesn't even realize she hears them, but they cause her anxiety?

Smells - she possibly can smell things you can not detect. She may not even realize you can not.

Or if she is hypo with her vision, things can appear too dim for her and strain her eyes.

She can be both hypo and hyper in different areas.. making it all the more difficult to pin down.

I went until I was 34 years old before I was able to identify some of my triggers. I always just thought I was mean and irritable. Now that I know what sensory overload is and how to prevent or stave it off - I am much nicer to be around.

I read aspergirls. It was helpful a bit - but not as much as I hoped.

I think talking here to adult aspies will be most helpful for you. I hope that article helped some too.

What ever is going on... hope it gets easier for you.

The main thing that sets my daughter (who is 6 1/2) and I apart is the difference in situations like these. If my Mum booked something which I had said I wanted to go to, I'd go, whether I'd changed my mind or not and no matter how anxious I was. I'd cry in bed and feel awful, while I was there, but no-one would know, as I'd keep it all inside. I'd maybe still have awful moments, 25 years later, when I remembered the event, which caused me so much grief. (Not that I think your daughter's art camp would be traumatic.)

On the other hand, my daughter is as stubborn as a mule. She has a much stronger will than I. I've booked things for her in the past and she has gone to one class and then refused to go to any more. Thankfully, I've been able to get my money back without quibble, for the classes run by the council that she didn't go to. But, that would not be the case for events held by smaller organisations and franchises.

The difference is in our personalities, not in how our parents have raised us. My parents never had to tell me off for anything. I don't remember being punished or grounded, because I simply just did as I was told. My parents say I was very easy to raise. I'd like to raise my daughter in the same fashion, but it's just not to be. She's much better than she was, but she's not a child that you just need to ask once and it's done (or 3 times or 10 times).

I don't have any advice for you, other than minimising sensory issues. I'd advise you to speak with the workshop co-ordinator and tell then that your daughter might need rest time or to sit apart from the other kids at times (or whatever would help her to feel at ease). My daughter goes to a weekly singing/art/drama workshop and she gets to do that. The staff are great with her and just leave her to do her own thing, when she wants to, which might involve helping the facilitators, rather than what she's meant to be doing. Then she comes back to the matter in hand, refreshed and full of ideas. As a result, she's actually very happy to be at the class and I pretty sure this is going to be a long term hobby, possibly leading to a career, in some form or another. Teachers at other classes would be inclined to coax her to join in, but it has the opposite effect on her.

I hope your daughter does go to this and enjoys it.

They would be willing to work with her if I could get her to go. They said they could figure something out where she didn't have to wear the bracelet, they can turn the lights on brighter, I am sure she could sit wherever she wants etc. But she just refuses to go. Like I said, she shuts down like this and tries to leave new situations but in all previous cases after about 15 minutes she settled in and was happy to participate. But this time she would not go back in the classroom and she does not want to go back today.

I told her if she went to one class this week then she can go to her camp next week, but she won't go. She wants to go to camp next week but she said she will only stay if she likes the room (something about the art room really bothered her but she can't explain it). I am already paying for this weeks camp and cannot get a refund. If I cancel the other I can get a refund. If I wait until Monday and let her check it out and she doesn't want to stay, I lose that money too. Paying 300 for 2 weeks of camp and her not going is crazy.

It is hard for us to understand why she can't just go for 1 day (only 3 hours). If she hates it then I wouldn't make her go back. But she can't just sit and do art (which she loves) for 3 hours because she didn't like the classroom? It seems irrational. Often, she seems irrational with so many things. Sometimes I "get it." But other times I really don't. I do sort of get this, and I am not going to cause her distress by forcing the issue, but this cannot become a habit. If it does she will end up isolating herself and never doing anything. And like I said when she does suck it up and stay at things she ends up loving the experience.

She really does not seem to have many sensory issues. She used to be bothered by loud noises but not so much anymore. If she does have sensory stuff going on, I don't know what it is. Are there certain questions I can ask her that will lead me to answers of what bothers her? We can't avoid or minimize reactions if we don't know what is bothering her.

My daughter is so stubborn also. "Oppositional Defiant" I believe the term is. She purposely breaks the rules. She wants everything now, she is very demanding. She comes off as rude, disrespectful, and a brat often. Other times, when she is a little more flexible, she can be very delightful, loving, and lots of fun.