help with thinking about diagnosis, please

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I've been struggling with pursuing a diagnosis of ASD for myself for a while now. My dad is autistic and it started me wondering based on some of my own issues. I know I have compensated and practised for several things that I found really hard growing up, and after reading that women sometimes do better at masking(?) their symptoms, it really got me wondering. I'm in the UK, and I know we have a law that lets adults pursue, but I'm afraid.

I got the diagnosis of schizophrenia when i was in my early 20s, but this is in remission and i was given the diagnosis of borderline personality disorder... without my knowledge! I was furious about this, I had never been consulted with or anything, it came out in a regular GP appointment years later.

I am afraid about pursuing an ASD diagnosis or assesment because of the BPD. I don't think I tick any of the boxes on BPD apart from self-harm, which I think was the only reason I was given the diagnosis. I'm afraid that I will be seen as "manipulative" because of my "BPD" if I try and discuss my thoughts on ASD diagnosis. I already went to the GP about it, but she immediately said I didn't have ASD and it was probably social anxiety (I am not socially anxious, I just prefer hanging out on my own... I don't feel it's fair to people who are truly socially anxious to compare the two or say they're similar!) She signed me on for a 6-session CBT course which was nice, I liked the councillor and she also disagreed with my diagnosis of BPD. She said I could go back to the GP to have it removed from my record.

I was wondering if I could use that as an excuse to talk again about ASD. But I'm scared. The GP told me to take some online tests, which I did and they showed a positive. (I know they're just sort of screening tools but it's what she told me to start with).

I printed these all out and I can take them to show her but I'm so scared... I don't know what I would do if I went through another traumatising diagnositc process, and they said there was nothing wrong (maybe I'm just terrible at coping?). OR, even worse, they confirmed I have BPD........ I wouldn't be able to deal with this. I'm scared they'll just say I have problems simply because of my severe peer abuse for 12 years when I was a child. I know that's a huge part of my problems, but what if there's somethign else. It's what I want to know.

I just don't know what to do. Is there anyone who has had a similar experience? What did you do? Were you afraid? I don't know how to tackle this situation with the GP... it's taking up most of my thinking time and has done for about 6 months

Check my last post here:
viewtopic.php?t=290488&p=6737176#p6737176

@the_face_of_boo Do you mean I should go open-minded? Sorry if that's not what you mean, I wasn't sure I understood. My original post was a bit panicked and unclear, maybe. I think I might mostly be scared I'll be ignored or thought to be manipulative because of the "BPD"... even if I ask for it to be taken away and ask for further assessment (for anything) I might be seen to be manipulative... I don't know. I don't really know wha to do

EDIT: I read further back in the thread. Is it about over-diagnosis? I'm still a bit confused which part of it exactly you mean.

sorry if my post was too unclear. But I think I will go to the doctors anyway because of the BPD, and see what she says about my print-outs.

I'm very scared

You can bring up to your GP documentation that talk about how autism manifests in girls. Or go directly to an autism specialist who make assessment and knows well the female profile.

An interesting link there :
http://www.emergenceplus.org.uk/carers-useful-information/343-borderline-personality-disorder-a-correct-diagnosis.html

And a citation from Tony Attwood :
"Many adults with Asperger’s Syndrome or high-functioning autism apply for psychiatric help but are only occasionally correctly diagnosed as having an autism spectrum disorder. We have seen our previous patients diagnosed with borderline personality disorder, antisocial personality disorder, paranoid disorder, psychosis, and schizophrenia. It may be a matter of the adult psychiatrist not being familiar with the history and symptoms of an individual with Asperger’s Syndrome/high functioning which makes him/her liable to make a diagnosis of a condition with some overlapping symptomatology for which there is a well-known framework."
Source : http://www.tonyattwood.com.au/index.php/component/djcatalog2/item/23-comparison-and-differentiation/137-asperger-s-syndrome-and-high-functioning-autism-shared-deficits-or-different-disorders

thank you very much iridescence, I'll definitely do this. I know there's a rule in the UK that allows adults access to a diagnosis through the NHS public services, but I'm not sure if I need to have a referral from the GP to start this... I know there's private things too, but I'm not sure if I can afford that. It depends how much it is. Maybe I can ask the GP that too. I will make an appointment this week and take these things. I'm scared but I hope I can do it and talk to her... it never goes well, I can never explain myself very well. I usually have to type things out & take them which feels a bit embarassing...

It is tough because any time I mention things like hearing voices everyone (doctors, I mean) just focus on that and panic about that and nothing else ever gets addressed. I do not have psychotic symptoms with the voices, I always explain it's something I have had since I was really young and that I know it is not from "outside sources" or anything, I know that it is more like a brain process. It is like hiccups, like that I cannot control it. It just happens. And I need to speak to them, and the pleasure I get from speaking to them I always try and explain is like as if I'm having a smoke break outside of work. I've recently even been wondering if me talking to the voices is maybe even stimming. But again, I'm too afraid to bring any of this up because classic BPD means you're "manipulative" and I don't want them to think I'm trying to alter my diagnosis because I'm manipulative... I'm just desperate to know. I just want to know. I really want to see a specialist

I got my Drs appointment, had it today. I told her I really wanted the BPD removed from my record, as it had been distressing me so much, and that nobody (including counsellors) agreed with it. The weird thing was, my dr could not find it listed anywhere in my record. I feel slightly cheated that I could not get that good feeling of it being erased in front of my eyes, but also slightly gratified that... the possibility was it was never there? Was that original Dr lying to me about it, even? Why would she do that?? So odd. I feel conflicted. I don't think I'll ever know the truth about that.

I took along a lot of printed material about autism and specifically women & autism and also the print-outs I made of the screening tests. She said that there would be nothing that could be done, sort of, there's almost no point in diagnosis because there's no medication for the diagnosis (I know that!)... I get this a lot with the Drs. I'll tell them I have a check-box symptom list for, say, something physical, and they'll tell me there's no point in pursuing a "proper" diagnosis because there's no treatment for it. It's about peace of mind and stopping worrying about it, for me, personally! I wish they would understand that

Anyway, eventually she said she'd refer me! She took all my printed material and told me that she would write up an application at the weekend for the psychiatrist. This will be...... hmm...... the 5th or 6th time I've seen a psychiatrist It never gets easier. Having to start again and explain everything all over again, it's very tiring. She said at any rate the "treatment" will always be counselling for me. It means 6 x 50minsessions of seeing someone... having to build a relationship with them within that time, trust them, have them suggest a few things, then it's over again until the next time (typically for me, I take about two years for my distress to build up enough to have to go back to the Dr and have this cycle start ALL OVER again........ it is distressing and tiring... but I think I must get something out of each time it happens.... I hope).

If anyone has any tips or recommendations for when I see the psychiatrist... should I take notes with me? This is with a view to something else (autism) as usually I see a psychiatrist when I am just in severe distress & can't function or really properly talk to them and they need to figure it out almost on their own... It's going to be weird and different!

TL;DR sorry I know I ramble: any tips for seeing a psychiatrist with respects to autism screening, please, would be really helpful. Or just your experiences, would be really helpful.

I feel you, that sounds exhausting

YES bring a list. I saw a psychiatrist a while ago for this and did not.

Make the list very well-organized. Put your "most autistic" tendencies at the top and write an anecdote to back each one up.

I didn't do that and wish I did.

Thank you budgiezilla, I will do this.

I'm impressed by you. You believed in your inner knowledge of your self, refused to give your power away to others, persevered and achieved progress through your actions, choices and self-determination. I love people who realise the power they have and use it in constructive ways. Good luck with the journey from here, I hope you meet the right people. And if your don't, bypass them and continue the search for more enlightened ones. You will know when you get there, and I hope it will be sooner rather than later.

Misdiagnosis of all mental illness has been shown to be extremely unreliable, and even more so when the subjects are people on the autistic spectrum. Progress has been made. To date there has been no apology from the medical profession nor psychiatrists for having caused and inflicted great misery and even lifelong harm (and perhaps unnecessary shortening of life spans) on many ASD people misdiagnosed and mistreated as having schizophrenia. The silent failure to do so speaks volumes.

b19 that is really very nice of you to say, and it also gives me hope that I'm not doing the wrong thing. I want to be well and be supported and I think a lot of that for me means answers... which nobody (professionals) wants to give, ugh.

I don't hold out much hope for the psychiatrist I will be booked in to see... if I'm right in my assumptions, it will be the same place I went to last time, which is just the mental health ward across the other side of town... I would be particularly suprised if I saw someone with autism specialty, and I think I would be VERY VERY surprised if I saw someone with women's autism specialty! Well, time will tell... but thank you for reminding me not to give up. I do appreciate that.

Oldbarn, there is an old saying: "If you are a hammer, then everything is a nail". That more or less sums up the current state of psychiatry to me. The assumption is that if you go to see a psychiatrist, then you must be mentally ill. The second assumption is that no events in your life, past or present, are relevant to your presentation there; the third assumption is that you have a brain that doesn't work properly because you are biologically abnormal, and this is the sole cause of your mental illness; the fourth assumption is that no-one gets out of the office without a diagnosis of mental illness and follow-up appointments; the fifth assumption is that psychiatrists are scientists, (highly debated and debateable), immensely superior to the patients (who can never be right if they beg to disagree) and who refuse to take note of the very numerous studies which show that the drugs they prescribe have a very poor rate of helping the clients they label and charge. Psychiatry as a speciality seems to attract a particular kind of personality - often one that is pompous, condescending and regards patients as automatically "worth-less". Psychiatrists receive a commission for the drugs they prescribe in the USA and NZ - the only two countries where this corruption is legal.

So be careful in that system. There are some good people in it, but they are pretty rare in my experience and you would be tremendously lucky, given the odds, to meet one. Personally, I believe that you have better chances of healing with very realistic mature experienced psychotherapists. (My favourite is David Richo - google him if you are interested). His approach is that people encounter problems in life. And there are solutions to these problems, which can be found by a joint encounter between psychotherapist as mentor/guide and client as active participant in his/her own healing. We need to be primary agents in the healing of ourselves and our pain, and not devolve that power to psychiatrists (in my view). When you surrender all of your personal power, you become as a child in the hands of an authoritarian parent, who values their clad in iron rules and not your unique needs and individuality. That's just my view of course. Doubtless others will disagree and that will be their views. The truth is a complex thing, no one person ever holds all the parts..

B19, psychiatry is sort of frightening. There's so much power within it that is exerted on the person and of course all of that seeps through to the public as well. So they get funny ideas and prejudices about everything as well.

One doctor said to me once: "I don't treat labels. I treat symptoms." And I though to myself, oh my gosh, you mean you don't even treat PEOPLE?! You don't even see us as people, oh my gosh

Oh my gosh, do not get me started on psychiatric drugs. I could go on forever. I'm very happy when they seem to help people, but I had such a terrible time with them and I do not like them at all... and I frustrated so many doctors because the pills never seemed to work on me. I went through horrible, excessive doses of very strong anti-psychotics and anti-depressants (they kept on trying different things and none of them worked) and I am worried for my health in the future because who knows what they might have done to my long-term health? We don't know these things very well yet. I am worried for myself and for other people who have had medication forced on them with no good results!

I am very concerned that psychiatrists receive commission in the US and NZ based on prescription. That sounds like a terrible and precarious situation. I can only wish the best for people who get wrongly treated. My partner says he thinks that sometime in the future many will see that some forms of psychiatric treatments will be seen as very barbaric and cruel. I still recall the nice man who was on the ward with me one time (he was diagnosed with schizophrenia too) and he had to go through electro-convulsive therapy and he hated it, and did not think it even benefited him, and he was so sad about the whole thing. I felt very bad for him when he had to go for his sessions.

In other news I took advice and I have written up a document about anything I thought was relevant to a diagnosis. It is 16 pages long. That is VERY long and I know that probably nobody would read it (in the assessments) but I needed to write it down anyway in case I get asked about something and don't know how to respond... which I know I will because I always do. I found that having a document in my recent CBT sessions helped a lot actually. I could just refer to it rather than go verbally numb and not be able to respond and panic that I was wasting the therapist's time.

My GP did indeed write up a referral for me to the local psych centre, but I just got a letter from them saying they were re-referring me to Autism Oxford as they felt it was more appropriate. Well, that's good, I think! I don't know how long I will need to wait or what will happen next, so I'm still very worried. I get a lot of what I used to think were panic attacks but I think they are in fact meltdowns......... at least that's how everyone who has meltdowns describes them as. I am fairly certain they are not panic attacks now. But they're very bad and the stress of not knowing what's happening with this whole situation is sort of making them a bit worse... but I read about coping strategies and one coping strategy was to try and *ENVISION* headbanging/head-slapping instead of actually doing it, if you can try hard enough, and that is actually really helping because headbanging sort of scares me and makes me worry if I'm home alone I might even knock myself out. So yesterday for instance I tried envisioning it instead of doing it when I got next to the wall and it did help!! !!

I hope I can get some resolution soon.

thank you iridescence. I am pretty worried about it all but i hope maybe one day this will all be resolved... in one way or another I will try and post a bit more about whatever process I go through as I think it might help others (especially if they are in the Oxford area!)

I've got my pre-assessment on Thursday. This is a lot quicker than I expected, and there were a lot of other appointment slots too - this is good news for other people ever in line to be waiting on a pre-assessment, it seems this stage is quite fast. I think that once I had my form through from the clinic it took about four weeks to solidify an appointment and then it was only about another two/three weeks until the appointment.

I'm really very scared because I'm worried I'll get turned away and told I'm suffering with stress (I mean, I AM, but I need to know if there's anything else) but I will report back on the process as well as I can for the benefit of others in the same position.