Worried about boyfriend's girl best friend

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I hope she really is going to make a genuine effort to just get along from now on, but at least she knows how dangerous it will be for her friendship with him if she now decides it's still ok for her to treat me badly. He said he didn't want to give me too many details at first simply because I'd had a busy few days and he didn't want to overload me, so I'm not angry with him for not telling me straight away - he was just trying to look after me and keeping the Asperger's problems in mind

So, I didn't get to meet her yet since they talked, but fingers crossed it goes well and we can maybe even be friends, because we did get along before all the drama. She's a bit odd, but nobody's perfect and maybe she'll no longer be nasty odd, just nice odd Also hope I'm not being naive!! !

Break it off. She's just waiting for him to mature and finally come to his senses and be more than just a friend. Personally, I can't stand guys that have girls for friends! He says guys don't talk about personal stuff - that's a load of baloney! They DO indeed talk personal stuff. My own brother used to actually wimper over the phone to his best bud over women. He was thirty at the time! Your so-called boyfriend is "playing ther field" under the disguise of friendships. What makes you more than a friend? Sex. Who's to say they didn't have sex?
AND at what point will you too become "just a friend". He's a jackass.

He sounds like he's screwing around with her. What kind of guy wouldn't stand up to his female friend in order to make his girlfriend feel better? The friend is behaving ridiculously and so is your boyfriend imho.

If they were trying to get together they surely would have made a move by now... They've been friends for over 5 years. Yes, they had been disturbingly cuddley for friends (and apparently this is how he would be with any of his girly friends), but I've stomped that out for good. It's not fair on them, let alone on me, that he should give what would seem like more than friendly physical affection to them especially as it would put those girls' relationships at risk if they had boyfriends. I made my point by asking him if he'd wanted to be like that with his guy friends but obviously couldn't... I asked all sorts of questions to make him see just how weird it was and how it looked to everyone else, not just me. He has stopped that for good and I trust that he doesn't do it when I don't see.
I think that this should count as her last chance with this. If she makes one mistake now, she's in trouble. If she doesn't want to make things work out between me and her, then that means she doesn't want it to work for me and him, or else that she doesn't like me, in which case she would have advised him by now that I was bad for him. Yeah, jealousy is hard and horrible to put up with and takes a lot of time to heal and get over, but she's had a year and a half now so she's played all her cards.

Personally it gives me alarm bells if a guy has mainly or all female friends. I wouldn't date one.

Talked to him again today to get 100% of the details of how he dealt with this... I found out that she claimed that she "didn't remember doing it" and that she was "sorry if she had done it" and that she said it "shouldn't" happen again. And I asked specifically for his reaction, and he said that he'd decided to give her the benefit of the doubt. Clever and manipulative, as I thought she would be. She knows he can't prove whether or not she remembers doing something, and she knows that "shouldn't" is not definite. She lied to his face and also implied that I was lying.

Not good enough. He chose to believe her over me. He said he's scared of losing his friend but I said that I'd happily stand up to a friend, no matter what the consequences, for him, and expected the same of him. I told him it was wrong that he chose to believe her over me, because that means he let her believe that he thinks I'm a liar. He will leave himself no leg to stand on if he keeps appeasing her! He's chickening out and I'm not letting him do that any more.

Good luck Niamh.

Wohoo! I thought about this a lot again yesterday and did the maths and ended up solving the puzzle!

I thought about the way she treats me (essentially, bullies me) and about how it should be really really obvious to her by now that she's not going to succeed in breaking us up. After all this time, she's just doing the same stupid evil things and, seemingly, achieving nothing from it.

Then I thought about all the things she does to my boyfriend, like sending him on random and unmerited guilt trips every so often and making him feel like he's not been a good enough friend etc. and I remembered, from talking to him yesterday, that every time she did this he'd stop her as soon as he realized what she was up to - yet he never forced her to stop completely and so she keeps doing it. Any time she does anything like this and I get angry with her, because it's completely unfair on him and it certainly constitutes bullying him, he says "Please don't hold it against her!"

So, why would she do this repetitive bullying to both of us, seemingly trying to destroy both relationships - hers with him, and mine with him - and yet, consistently failing to achieve either? She must be getting some satisfaction from this...

Of course. Undivided attention from my boyfriend.

She doesn't actually care that I'm his girlfriend and she's not jealous of me at all (well, possibly a little, but it's definitely not the main drive behind all this); she just desperately wants attention, and what better way to get 100% of anyone's attention than to do something dramatic? I'm not a problem to her - I'm actually a really useful tool for her to use to get his attention. She doesn't actually care about whether we break up or not - she just needs her attention fix. So, I'm in a no-win situation; the possible results are 1) I go to my boyfriend and tell him she's being an ass again and he goes to her to talk about it, 2) I get sick of her behaviour and go to her myself and let rip, so she runs to him and says I'm accusing her of something she didn't do, or 3) I end up breaking up with my boyfriend, and being his "best friend", she's the one he'll go to for comfort. I lose out every time, and she gets what she wants every time, because she knows for a fact that he'll never let go of her.

Now, for the worst part, the part that proves just how horrible she really is... When my boyfriend moved here to go to college, he moved away from all the friends he had. They all got scattered amongst different parts of Ireland and England, and he lost touch with a number of them. That, combined with a culture shock, had a horrible effect on him. He missed his friends sorely and couldn't get time away from college to go meet them. He had to start over from scratch and try to make new friends, which he found really hard. This was at least half of what led to him getting depression, and he had to take a year out to recover. She was one of the first people he made friends with when he started college and so she saw him go through all this. She knew what was happening for him. And she knew from then on, if not before then, that he would never let go of her as a friend no matter what she did, because he's now terrified of losing friends. He feels like he has so few compared to how popular he used to be in his original homeplace that he's become scared of losing any, even if they need to go. And I think seeing him almost in tears admitting this yesterday is a good sign of the truth.

So the answer to the puzzle: The crazy woman is addicted to attention. She has an unstoppable source of attention in my boyfriend, because he is terrified of standing up to her for real. She has the ability to send him on guilt trips to get his undivided attention there. She now has me as an extra tool for more means of getting attention from him, and the possible results of using me all involve me getting hurt and her getting away with it. Genius. She knew that she could use his past sufferings in order to use him, and no matter just how shamefully she treated him she would still get what she wanted.

I cannot describe how much I hate that woman right now. She is an evil, sly, manipulative bully who's so addicted to attention that she actually does not care who she hurts in order to get her fix! She has treated my boyfriend so shamefully and he's been too weak to stop it because of a deep fear - knowledge of which she used to get what she was looking for. The problem here isn't about me at all - it's about him... it's her consistent walking all over him and then making him feel guilty every time he tries to stop it. He needs to get rid of her... she's brought him suffering he does not deserve and messed with his head completely! She's going to continue to make his life miserable I really need to get him to see what she's been doing to him!! ! Rotten, manipulative, bullying user!! !

I have so much hatred for her right now... he needs to cut her out!

Quick update, boyfriend decided, of his own accord, that if his friend does one more thing against him or us, he's going to break ties with her... I'm delighted for him - he's finally standing up for himself! Yes, I had to point out how ridiculous their "relationship" is and how the crap she does is bad for his emotional health, so it's crazy that he should insist on letting her away with it every time - but he still made the choice himself without me feeding it. He says he's realized that he has been a pushover, that she's been getting away with treating him badly for too long, and that she's taken it too far. He's giving her this one last go, and when she makes a false move, then they're finished. I say "when" because she just won't be able to resist, and she has no idea that he's finally become fed up of her messing with him.

I do hope I'm not coming across as obsessive, I just like to use the forums here as a place to rant and get relief. It's really helpful for me and keeps me from getting too emotional about all this

huh? I have had two best friends that are guys...I love them both dearly...I was not particularly fond of the girlfriend one ended up with...I was as nice to her as I could possibly be...she was always a witch...not directly of course, and not in front of him, but a witch...guess what? I have always treated them both with the respect that I treat my friends...hmmm...if I call their house (both are now married) I talk to the wives first, chat with them even if MY friend answers the phone...if we ran into each other I would ALWAYS complement them on SOMETHING...their hair, their new shoes, dress...whatever...anything to let them know that in no way was I romantically involved or jealous of them...

PS - any "friend" of a man/guy doing anything less than that has a different view of that "friend of theirs"...ie. they like them

good luck

Well done on being a mature and decent friend!!

I'm still having nagging confused thoughts on my mind with this... I can't make out what kind of relationship they have! If they're just friends, then why does she get away with EVERYTHING? Why does he choose her story over mine when she's being an ass? And why the heck does he think she deserves another chance even though she's had a year and a half of chances to get used to this? I'm confused as to whether she does fancy him or not because she has a boyfriend herself, but I wouldn't be at all surprised, given her malicious and manipulative nature, if he was just a sort of revenge boyfriend...

I dunno It's sapping my energy because when I don't understand what's going on with something in my life I can't help thinking about it and it's distracting and tiring... It's like my brain's trying to work it all out all the time... A big part of me wants to get angry and show 100% how unfairly treated I feel, but the rest of me is too confused to decide whether I should say anything to my boyfriend about it. Maybe I should get him to talk to her again, but PROPERLY, i.e. tell her that he knows that she was lying to him when she denied causing trouble and make it clear to her that there is no more trouble to be had. It's not easy, but surely just sticking to the truth is easy enough? I mean, I find it hard to talk to him about this stuff because I know it involves accusations and negativity, but I still put it out there and I still let him know when things feel wrong AND I stick to my story... I think I need clarity on what he feels his side of the story actually is...

THIS.

Ok, now she's putting on a big act for my boyfriend so as not to lose him to me. She's suddenly telling him to say "hi" to me when they're texting and "get well soon" (I have a kidney infection at the moment) etc. whereas, when we bump into each other now, she just smiles for a second and then looks away as quickly as possible, without saying a word. Clever, because now I can't say that she's blanking me, and in my boyfriend's eyes she's being perfectly well-behaved.

So, guess I should just make him aware of how false she's being, and see how it goes?

Yes it sounds even bitchier than before. Is your boyfriend really that stupid?

Now she isn't being obviously rude (rather, she is being deviously rude) you could try to brush off her bitchiness, and pretend you think shes actually being nice. She won't like that at all.

Great! That's exactly how I'm being with her, friendly as always. Keeps me in the clear so she has nothing to accuse me of, and nothing to blow out of proportion. My boyfriend's wrapped around her little finger completely... Although now he's promised me that if she does anything to either of us again, i.e. blanks me again or sends him on another pointless guilt trip, he's breaking ties with her for good. It's going to be hard to explain this one to him I guess. Wonder what scheme she'll come up with next...

Forgot to mention guys - I'm not giving any ultimatum at this point. An ultimatum involves telling him to do something or else I'm leaving. I have no desire to leave right now, and nobody should ever throw the ultimatum out there unless they do... in which case, they should actually just leave without making any "or else" requests. I have, however, made it clear that if she continues to cause trouble, it may become too much to bear and I may eventually want to get out. He just needs to either get her to stop being a narcissist or to get away from the narcissist, the latter of course being the more doable and likely outcome.