Dealing with Sexism on WP

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In all honesty, when I see stuff like that, it makes me feel sorry for the person saying it. They've been hurt pretty bad, obviously. I don't see it as something to get upset over, the way someone crying in public wouldn't be a cause for someone to become angry with them. Though I understand that some people may be offended by it.

I agree with Fnord's point, however. I know that the world has an idea that men have to be "tough, all-knowing, all-problem-solving with no fears" but the entire point of Wrongplanet is to be a haven, right? A place for Aspies to interact safely? But a large part of being an Aspie is being rejected and dejected at some point, unfortunately.

Although I'm technically "new", from what I have seen you guys (the moderators) do deal with conflict really well here. The communication between the members and the staff is really great, in my opinion.

I'm putting forth this post more as a conflicting opinion (like a fresh idea, as well), but maybe it may be worthwhile to keep such these things but lock them so they can no longer be attributed to. The reason I suggest this would be that the evidence would still be there, and people would have to face the music for their actions, but it would still be pressing a point that misogyny and misandry are unacceptable. Does this fit with the way that you guys are currently moderating the forums, or have I gone flying off in the opposite direction of the point?

Also, what do you know, misandry does not exist in my browser's dictionary. That's sort of...

when we leave threads locked and in place, it appears that we are condoning them so we rarely do so unless the conversation became sexist later on. also, it isn't usually entire threads that are sexist but individual posts, so we can't leave those in place because members get upset over the post when they see them. there is no reason why anyone should have to see sexist posts targeted at their gender.

and i'll say once again - sexism doesn't necessarily come from a place of hurt. it has many sources. and also to assume that they are hurt does a disservice to the majority of men who are hurt badly yet don't become sexist.

I haven't seen any man-hating on this forum, but maybe I'm not looking in the right place. If I did see it, I would disagree with them. Men are as varied as women and any claim that all men are a particular way just isn't accurate. The main thing I do see a lot is pretty common throughout the internet, it's nothing remotely unique to this forum and I do see worse when browsing comments on most any mainstream news and commentary site.

Thanks for pointing that out, Fnord. I was just worried women were getting upset because someone was joking about them being in the kitchen or something. That kind of stuff used to bother me enough that I left the Digg community, but I never noticed the pervading problem of misandry until recently.

I think this thread could be used an example of part of the problem of sexism against females being tolerated on this site.

There is misandry, but it doesn't happen nearly as often as misogyny. However, when anyone attempts to talk about sexism against females, it won't be long before multiple male members come in and point out that there is misandry as well, despite no one denying the misandry. And I see guys(and female members) say really misogynist things literally every time I come to the board. It's so frequent that I rarely feel compelled to go through all of the hassle that comes with pointing it out. At least a couple guys chime in and they don't say "sexism is wrong" they say "Well women are sexist against males here too"

It's not constructive, the only purpose those comments serve is to invalidate anyone who points out the sexism toward female members. It's a ridiculously frequent occurrence and if you point it out, most of the conversation is defensive reactions from males pointing out that females are also guilty, in other conversations, which no one ever provides examples of, they just point it out in order to invalidate the complaints about the sexism toward females. The guys who do this aren't even being accused of sexism and often weren't previously involved in the threads in which this happens.

This thread isn't an example of anyone being sexist, but as soon as a female talks about the rampant sexism toward females, several guys chime in to say "It's not just men"

This thread is not an attack on men, it's a thread about instances of sexism toward women being frequent, extremely frequent, and ignored by most members.

It's not that being offended is unacceptable, it's that a lot of women have left the site because of it, and several have expressed that they feel uncomfortable posting. I made a thread about it in the Haven and there were several women who said they feel unwelcome, one woman even said every time she comes here she ends up feeling horrible about herself, the sexism toward women is a real problem for some members, and women also saying sexist things does not make the frequent sexist comments about women any less of a problem.

If I chose to report every sexist post I see to a moderator, I wouldn't have any time left to actually participate on the forum.

It seems like even if there were a thread explaining what constitutes a sexist comment at the top of every sub-forum, with examples of the frequent types of comments here, it... it's like there isn't even a solution.

Meems, you've spoken my mind for me.

I think you've hit it right there. It's only one step away from saying "If I chose to report every offensive post ..." et cetera.

Maybe we all need to "grow a thicker skin" and not feed the trolls who actually want to stir up trouble, so that those of us who only want to present a balanced view (even in separate threads and forums) won't get jumped on for being sexist and insensitive.

It's not comparable to being offended by a post and reporting it. I'm uncomfortable with misogyny or any kind of sexism, and it makes the environment on the forum really unwelcoming. If I were the only person who felt this way, I might rant in the Haven and then not talk about it anymore, but there are numerous women here who feel unwelcome.

I'm offended by posts in PPR about Israel and Palestine, or when someone says something about feeling sorry for atheists or when someone posts enthusiastically about becoming or being an ex-gay in the LGBT forum, etc. etc. I'm alright with being offended by posts on the board, because I can either take a step back and let it go, or I can disagree, respectfully. Even being insensitive is fine, most of us are insensitive here even if we don't mean to be. I expect insensitivity.

But when it comes to commonly seeing hateful comments about my entire sex, negative generalizations and such, and seeing no one stand up to it or disagree, as if everyone is OK with it... it's not a comfortable environment for a lot of female posters. The thing is, most of us found this place because we wanted to connect with other people on the spectrum or at least other people who we could relate to as outsiders. Sexism on the internet toward women is a really common thing that I do shrug off and ignore on most websites, but I don't think this should be one of them.

I want the women here to feel like we're just as welcome as anyone else. I want the men here to feel comfortable here, too, but not to the exclusion of women.

I'll ad that I don't see how sexism or any other type of hate is to not be expected in this forum and especially in some sections. Not only are those things apparent in just about every piece of humanity, but this is a forum full of people that don't fit in and many don't like that. wether they have been abused, used, ignored or ridiculed its all things that will build up a level of hate in someone.

now im not condoning any of it, im just saying I can understand where a lot of it comes from. especially with the arrogant and thick headed personality types

Mine....

The OP wasn't sexist, but the thread was soon populated with sexist content.

Okay, now I see your point more clearly. It's like when all the Good Old Boys over at the machine shop insist on having their pin-up posters, their pron mags, and their "if the b***** don't like it, she don't hafta be in here!" attitude - it creates a hostile work environment, to say the least.

But why do the idiots have to be so hostile toward every woman, and not just the few who cause trouble with their own hostility?

Last edited by Fnord on 18 Mar 2013, 3:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Yet it's often the people who do this who themselves engage in the worst misandry:

Example: "Being autistic and male means that women will always find you creepy, and there's nothing you can do about it" (usually, the same people who engage in misogyny too are also the worst at engaging in misandry). I see this all the time, and it's actually, I would argue, misandristic, not misogynistic.

Another example: "Autistic men have a tendency to stalk women."

Or "Only aspie women are ever able to pass as NT because aspie men just don't have the capability to act normally"

This is the real misandry on this forum.

Last edited by Tyri0n on 18 Mar 2013, 3:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I do expect it, I just also expect some level of concern about it and I have only seen two mods doing anything about it, and that's probably due to a lack of reporting it. It really is understandable, people develop hateful attitudes toward entire groups for understandable reasons, it's the conclusion I disagree with. I sympathize with people, that doesn't mean I can be accepting of hateful statements on this forum or just keep shrugging them off, because I also sympathize with all the people effected by these statements.

I don't think most people want or expect drastic actions or harsh words, I do want everyone to try to be understanding of one another and respect each other... and that's not always going to happen.

I don't even know. I don't know anymore.

Some people just love to hate, I guess.

It might help to look at this from a racial angle instead.

If someone were punched or bullied by a black person, was hurt, but responded to the hurt by turning it in an ideology about how white people are all oppressed by black people and ran around inserting that ideological spin all over the place and stereotyping black people negatively, a lot of people might respond pointing out that this person is being a bit of a racist idiot about his problem and is wrong. At this point, the racist person may call everyone who disagrees with him, especially any black person, as "afronazis." How dare they object! Oppression!

It's undeniable that people get hurt and some lash out at an entire group because of it, but the main thing that grates my nerves is when it's assumed that gives someone the right to voice opinion with no objection because any objection is further proof that they are oppressed victims.

This post is just a little built up thoughts from surfing the internet in general and seeing the MRA types pile on any sex and gender article, not specific to WP. I just wanted to vent about it I guess.

People tend to see those more like themselves as individuals and OTHERS lumped together as stereotypes. That's why when people see someone of their own nation/race whatever doing something bad, they usually assume it's just him. When a foreigner/other race/etc does something bad, people are quicker to assume.. "....they are like that."